Smacking children "oh everyone does it"

[cantbelieveimhearingthis]

NC for this

So I was on the bus the other day with DD (19 months). Another lady gets on with a pushchair and a little boy, the boy is probably about 2 and a half. Two older ladies then get on and start chatting to the other lady with the pushchair. DD is waving and smiling and the older ladies were commenting on how lovely she was, I said thank you but frankly I'd had a shitty day so just kept my self to myself. They keep talking about children and are clearly trying to get me involved. The other lady with the pushchair and the older ladies get into behaviour and how "naughty" her little boy is. The conversation then turns to the topic of smacking. Older ladies start to agree that nowadays children are too soft and that smacking them does them no harm, but teaches them a lesson. Lady with a pushchair then piped up saying "oh yes when he's naughty I smack him on the bottom, he's got a nappy on so it does him no harm" She then says she threatens her TWO year old with smacking if he doesn't do as he's told. They're now trying to get me involved in the smacking conversation and I'm trying my hardest to be polite. Lady with the pushchair then says "trust me when they start throwing tantrums, smacking is the only thing that works" "everyone does it, they're just too afraid to admit to it". AIBU to be a little bit taken aback by this? I can understand to an extent the older ladies as they were from a different generation. But the other lady blatantly admitting to hitting a two year old?? I thought we had moved past this?

I don't like people that smack kids it's horrible my kids are wild sometimes which I'm doing my best with they are 2 & 4 and their behaviour can be bad sometimes but I couldn't smack them , I can remember my mum going to hit me when I was about 14 and I tried to push her away from me she nearly fell down the stairs so my dad came flying up the stairs and punched me in my face full pelt, weirdly now I've never ever let them look after my children and I see them almost weekly.

I was never smacked by my dad, my mum slapped me on the legs once or twice. My uncle, despite being a lovely man on the whole, would use a belt on my cousins.

I smacked my daughter once, we were having a teenage argument, and she slapped me into the middle of next week.

Sometimes we lose our rag and lash out, but smacking should never be first choice punishment.

Smacking a child or an animal is wrong. If I smacked another adult in the street the police would be called. Smack a child in the street and no one says anything. I don't need to batter my child to get him to behave, he is taught respect and we punish him by taking things away or stopping TV etc. I also notice that children who are smacked are the ones who smack others. How can we teach that violence isn't the answer and bullying is wrong when we are hitting children half our size.

There is definitely a rise in knife crime and disrespect towards others. I think it is lack of discipline possibly and I agree with poster saying you don't have to be friends with your dc and you are in charge not them but this can still be achieved without smacking.

However shades of grey imo

I would wager everything I own on stabbing perpetrators having been hit as children. To correlate not smacking with rise in crime would suggest that the youth courts, prus and police stations are full of middle class vegan plastic toy eschewing kids called Bear and Rain, which they evidently are not.

I think the opposite because of the ban of corporal punishment in schools (not that I agreed with that) and the unacceptable attitude towards smacking in the last 20' years.

Lol - Bear and Rain 😊

I would wager everything I own on stabbing perpetrators having been hit as children

So would I.
But probably not as an occasional punishment in an otherwise loving, stable family environment.

More likely your talking about beatings or frequent smacking as a first choice, quite likely combined with poverty and the issues directly linked to that like addictions, domestic violence, poor self esteem, depression etc.

Teacher22- What did that teacher do that affected those children so much??

Would never raise a hand to a loved one. In any circs. Especially if they happen to be much smaller/younger than me.

My two have grown up fine without being whacked funnily enough.

The hypocrisy of hitting to show how you shouldn't hit belies belief.

There is a massive difference between smacking a child and beating the living crap out of them because you've lost control. I don't think that smacking is inherently damaging long term. Many of us were smacked. While i don't think that smacking is the answer I agree that parents are too soft these days and are raising a generation of spoiled, ill prepared kids. We are raising future adults and I think people forget that.

I think it is damaging. The few times it happened to me forever tainted my view and relationship with that person. I never viewed them the same way afterwards.

There is a massive difference between smacking a child and beating the living crap out of them because you've lost control

If you smacked an adult it would assault. Beating the living daylights out of them GBH. The only reason people hit children is because the adult can get away with it when they're the parent. The sooner this is made completely illegal the better.

I get so tired of seeing the 'smacking is OK when you need to regain control quickly/safeguard your child' bullshit on here. My DS ran out into the road once. Funnily enough, my knee-jerk reaction was to grab him, hug him in relief and berate myself for not watching him more carefully. Not, 'Yay, now I can hurt and humiliate him!'

The fright he got was enough to stop him doing it again. Smacking has been proven not to work, so as far as stopping your kids running into the road goes, it's no substitute for responsible parenting.

Jesus
That's what I meant by the knee jerk grabbing situations to get a child out of a dangerous situation.
I'd sooner grab and pull a child back than say 'Timmy please stop running towards the road as it's busy' and i'd rather firmly tap their hands rather than start explaining something is hot. Once the immediate danger is out the way, as you say you'd hug and explain you're glad they're ok.

Smacking as a punishment is awful

I slipped over In the soap in a shower once on holiday aged about 6 (had only had baths before) and my DM hit me for falling over. I associate people who hit children with that kind of mentality.

"If we look at nature animals will give their babies a little nip if they continue to bite them/run away."

That argument doesn't work. In nature we also see mum animals eating their young or abandoning unhealthy babies to instead only focus their efforts on the healthier looking ones!

I'm obviously not comparing smacking to these things but pointing out that we can't justify something because it happens in the wild!

But let’s just blame smacking.
It’s far easier than tackling the actual root cause of the problem.

I didn't say it was solely down to kids being smacked, but it all starts somewhere. I agree that violent crime is on the rise for many reasons other than smacking, I come from one of these areas where violent crimes are committed on a pretty much daily basis. I have seen the way some of these youths have been brought up. Poverty, lack of a decent education/youth services have a huge part to play, but are often the reasons these parents resort to violence themselves, which just turns it into a vicious cycle, "my parents hit me and I'm alright" mentality. Well alot of things that people used to think were alright turned out not to be, when we know better, we do better.
Not sure why animals disciplining their young physically is being talked about either. Not the same in any way, shape or form, humans have grown to be civilised and don't act like animals in other ways, why on earth would it be ok to smack a child because a lioness nipped her cub?

firstimemamma

Said what I wanted to in a better way re animals!

Smacking/Actual and Grievous Bodily Harm/Common Assault/Child Abuse is illegal in most civilised countries.

Firsttimemamma exactly the point I was going to make - well put.

The 'my parents smacked me and I turned out alright - well, my late husband said that many times. He turned out a depressed alcoholic. His brother is exactly the same. Not saying it's as simple as 'he was hit - he turned out that way', but from what he told me, the hitting was part of a rigid black and white style of parenting where the child wasn't allowed to develop independence and a voice of their own even into adolescence, leaving them completely ill-equipped to handle life in the real world.

Bottom line: hitting children 'works' because it causes pain and/or fear and/or humiliation.

If it didn't cause the child to feel at least one of those things, people wouldn't do it. People hit their children because they want the child to experience those feelings.

If you hit, or defend hitting, understand that this is your baseline position. None of the pro-hitting arguments you can come up with alter that position.

I never smacked mine. Mine are mid to late teens now, and I can't remember exactly what I did, but I do recall that time-outs, distractions and talking to them were parts of it.

Smacking is still fairly common, research indicates that it is more common in economically deprived areas (of the UK) and this correlates geographically
In certain areas yes. I don't smack my DC, this is a working class area, I have often heard parents name call, shouting at their children which is just as bad, we have moved on from smacking, I heard a DM call her DS a cockeye cunt, he has a turn in his eye. I told her she was disgusting.
I don't think there is enough education on New discipline technics.
It has gone the opposite way. I was terrified to be a cheeky child, I would never disrespect my teacher, the garda, shop workers, lots of DC are cheeky ballsy and there is little consequences, other than shouty parents, not helping the situation at all.

Bottom line: hitting children 'works' because it causes pain and/or fear and/or humiliation

Sometimes that is necessary to suppress a bad behaviour.
If the behaviour is more rewarding than the consequence then it is likely to be repeated.

Example, why don’t most people opt to rob the bank?
Or murder their worst enemy?
Or have an affair with their crush?

Social conditioning and what we are taught to perceive as right and wrong will play a role but IMO it’s mostly because they are frightened of the consequences.

Losing their freedom, financial stability, their friends and family etc.

If the consequences were not there I think a lot of people who ordinarily would have been discouraged from socially unacceptable (but personally rewarding) behaviour would be found engaging in that behaviour.

The threat of punishment is ultimately what forces them to behave themselves.

If it didn't cause the child to feel at least one of those things, people wouldn't do it. People hit their children because they want the child to experience those feelings

I can 100% say when I (rarely) hit one of my children I am never thinking I want you to suffer, feel humiliated, feel pain etc.

If I feel something can be resolved without smacking I will absolutely do that instead.
I certainly don’t think parents should be using smacking as a first form of discipline.
I mostly use time outs, confiscation, I talk, sometimes shout.
But sometimes a smack is the most effective way of getting the message through.

In an otherwise stable and loving unit, it is not abusive.

Obviously beatings and constantly smacking and intimidating is.
But that isn’t how most parents who smack operate.