To have a 5th child

[Flowerflow]

I have 4 children ages 13, 9, 8 and 4 (5 in a few days), recently DP and I have been discussing have another child, he completely up for it but I'm still a little unsure. I have a few concerns like we currently live in a 4 bedroom house, oldest two share and youngest two have their own bedrooms. 8 year old is the only boy and if were to have another boy they would probably share but there would be a big age gap and DS wouldn't be impressed. That or we move to a bigger house which we might not be able to afford where we currently but would be able to if we move slightly further away. Another concern would be there'll be 5/6 between them and our current youngest so new baby might feel left out or the odd one out although not all our children are very close in age. I'm also unsure about going through pregnancy again, I've never really enjoyed it, baby, toddler stage and so I'll happily go through again but pregnancy I'm willing to go through not exactly happily though. On the other hand I'd love to have a fifth child and these concerns and problems can be worked through

Still, even such candid conversations didn't throw up any hypothetical future envirommental apocalypsr which I have unnessecarily excessively? contributed to.

CrushedVelvetCouch, alas the future environmental apocalypse isn't "hypothetical" at all.

‘Who on earth would question, face to face, your choice about family size?’

Just ask anyone who doesn’t have children...

According to this school of thought, even one new child per couple is totally unsustainable and we need to lose over 90% of the existing people before we even consider having any more new people

So many risks with any pregnancy - baby dies, you die, baby has disabilities that affect quality of life, you struggle with mental health or financially etc.

You already have 4 DC that need you. I don't see why they are not prioritised.

It seems very generous to call the Georgia Guidestones a "school of thought".

you should think about the impact on your body too. That's a lot of pregnancies. They do take a toll on the body.
What do you imagine would happen to you if you had 5 children?

What do you imagine would happen to you if you had 5 children?

All pregnancies carry a measure of risk. A single pregnancy can, if you are unlucky (and many women are unlucky) completely bugger up your body and your health. One of the many reasons I stopped at one child was that pregnancy completely buggered up my health for a long time, and I thought it would be unfair on my existing son, not to mention dangerous for me, to risk my health even further with a second pregnancy.

And you can have four pregnancies with no trouble, sure, but that's no guarantee every subsequent pregnancy will be like that. Pregnancy is a risk, every time. And you have to make decisions about whether that risk is worth it, every time.

lots of things carry a risk though, and I think with good nutrition and medical support it’s probably not as significant as you think.

It seems very generous to call the Georgia Guidestones a "school of thought".

Yeah, I know - crazy, isn't it?! it obviously mattered greatly to somebody, though - they didn't get that thing knocked up at Timpsons for a tenner on a Friday afternoon.

OP. YABU. Just stop producing kids now.
4 is plenty.

@Crushedvelvetcouch I agree with all your posts.

I don’t find large families distasteful, it’s the exact opposite. I’m from a large family myself and loved. I am absolutely sold on the idyllic fantasy of having a lovely crowd of children to raise, and I find large families interesting and appealing.

But I live in the real world, and I have enough of a conscience to know that it would be morally reprehensible to put my own feelings above the toll having 5 children would take on the planet. I can’t pretend that mitigating environmental disaster is someone else’s responsibility, because as this thread demonstrates, there are already far too many people who feel that way...

At a guess I would say that 'environmental issues' is a more noble reason than 'finding big families distasteful' or being a touch envious that other people are able to cope well with and raise happy DC in big families when you struggle to parent an only.

Yes, we're all just jellus hun

Evidently.

I might have gone for another - maybe two more. Guilt stopped me.

Do you vote Green Swift?

I just want to say thank you to the people who have large families, and raise them to be contribution members of society, your contribution to society at a time when we have failing birth rates is invaluable, especially given that we already face problems paying for our services, especially with regard to the pensions and care of people who are adults now - people like you adding human beings with their whole lives ahead of them now is how any of this stuff gets paid for. As a society we all owe you a debt of gratitude.

Eugh, too many especiallys, dreadful English. Sorry, but you get the point.

No. Do what I can but appreciate it seems pretty pathetic in the grand scheme of things- cycle when I can mooncup reusable nappies at that stage local fruit and veg shampoo bars glass bottle milk delivery less meat etc. I don’t live off grid in a shack in the woods though. But I did stop at 2.

I don't thing large families are distasteful, I'm not in the slightest bit envious that others might be able to cope. I think that, with the state of the environment having been made very clear recently, it is irresponsible. We all do irresponsible things though.

I have 3. I've done my bit towards over population and it never entered my mind when planning a third. It would now. It's all very well saying "oh, but most people aren't having 5, it'll be fine!" Or "oh, but I bet you drive a car!" the fact is that we have fucked up the planet in so many different ways and we do actually need to take steps to reduce this as much as we can.

I just want to say thank you to the people who have large families, and raise them to be contribution members of society, your contribution to society at a time when we have failing birth rates is invaluable, especially given that we already face problems paying for our services

We don't need more people, society needs to change. So, fuck up theplanet with over population or pay for services? Which would you choose?

Just do you listen to the news? As I type an extremely clever man from Cambridge university is talking about us “looking down the barrel of a gun” and you think we need more consumers. Really?

Swift I'm not for one moment supposing that you should vote Green.
The reason I asked is because as I prevuously mentioned in 'real life' I have not once encountered people discussing environmental implications when discussing family size.
This then, logically I thought led me to wonder if this somegow correlated with me not being personally aquainted with very many people who vote Green, or outwardly admit to doing so. I am aware that some choose to keep political leanings as a private matter, although I'd wager this is less common nowadays.

Anyway there may still be an element of explanation in the fact that I don't personally seem to know any Green voters and I concurrently don't hear of environmental issues discussed in relation to family planning.

Just a thought really and thanks for your answer.

Most people are pleasant and polite. I wouldn’t say to someone with 5 kids already here that my personal opinion is it’s irresponsible because I am not a dick. But if someone asks “should I have a fifth” I am not going to say “yay you go girl more taxpayers” I just can’t sorry.

This is ages old but also a fairly clever academic and I assume most of you saw it at the time. What did you think when you first saw it and how has that changed?

www.ted.com/talks/hans_rosling_on_global_population_growth/up-next?language=en