AIBU to think that the term 'natural birth' might cause upset to others?

[Mitzicoco]

I had two water births. One fairly straightforward and the other not so (thank god I was in a hospital). When chatting to other mothers through NCT or baby groups I noticed that a lot of people referred to their births as natural. Nothing wrong with that, but I just wondered if I might feel upset by these comments if I had had a c-section, or some other delivery. Surely every birth is natural? What do you think?

There is natural about vaginal births in the western world. They are all medicalised.

Exactly

I refer to the fact I wanted a 'natural birth' because people recoil when you say the word vagina.

Natural means just that, naturally a baby comes out the floof. Is it any less of an achievement to have a c section? Is it fuck.

My son came into the world from my body, regardless of where the exit point is.

Also worth noting that C-sections have been around for hundreds of years. Remember the threat to Macbeth? That his destruction would come from someone "not woman born"?

Thousands of years.

I had to be induced , and thereafter( some hours if not days later an emergency C- Section. ) My preference was for a "natural" vaginal birth. My lovely GP , when I went for my final appointment with her , said , you can think what you you like , but in the end your job is to get that baby out and don't come crying to me if it wasn't all lavender oil. So - for reasons I had to have a c section. I asked the doctor what would happen if I didn't - & he said ( tentatively because this was many years ago and woman had just sued the NHS for depriving her of a "natural birth" ) well first the baby will die and then you will. To which I said , well I think we should do this. & we did & he he now 22 and healthy and just lovely.

I think that I get what @Bertrandrussell is saying in that I would have preferred a birth with less / no intervention & in those circumstances I may have thought more about any procedures etc. Had that been the case I would have been delighted. As it was my breathing techniques before we knew EMCS resulted in me hyperventilating and lovely doctor said - here is a one of our more technical answers. It was a brown paper bag which I had to breathe into So do I think those who had vaginal deliveries with minimum / no intervention ) birth experience was better than mine , could very well be - who knows? I don't. All I know is that the only way for me to give birth to my son was the way it happened. So the epidurals and interventions were for medical reasons - I did not choose them "up front" .

That said I was jolly envious of those who were up and about shortly after birth - I was lying down with a catheter & stitches where they had hoiked DS out.

If I could make a choice ( which I did ) I would have a birth with the fewest interventions. Didn't work out like that. So - doesn't matter , all worked out well. I think there are degrees between , nothing at all ( and fantastic if that works for you , ) some pain relief ( whatever that may be, and I have no issue with that at all ) EMCS and then those who elect a Cesarean which is not necessarry ( was too posh to push a phrase at one time ? ) . It may be a previous birth says that a CS would be the right answer next time

If I am honest - as long as the baby comes out healthy I am not sure it entirely matters.

The only one thing which made me look like I had chewed on a nettle which a bulldog had pissed on once when was somebody suggested to me that I could not have possibly bonded with my DS as well as she had with hers because he ( mine) was delivered by Cesarean .But - to get back to the original point - I wasn't upset she was talking about a "natural birth" as I think the OP meant it - more because she couldn't see a healthy baby delivered any which way round under the circumstances is A Good Thing.

Not sure I have entirely answered the question but feel good for getting that off my chest

Though 2000 yrs ago the mother would die or already be dead.

“Also worth noting that C-sections have been around for hundreds of years”

Well, not ones where both mother and baby survived..

I know I'd have been a goner less than 100 yrs ago.

It's called a "cascade of interventions" and it's a thing. Induction via drip is more painful, therefore mother needs epidural, therefore instrumental delivery becomes statistically more likely.

Of course induction via drip can be the best course of action in some cases, but sadly I don't think all mothers are supported to make an informed decision about that - in many cases the HCPs make the decision for them or push hard for it without discussing all the risks/benefits and options.

Either way it's obviously not the mother's "fault" she didn't end up with a "natural" birth.

I know I'd have been a goner less than 100 yrs ago.

Me too - breech presentation and low fluid. I am very grateful to modern medicine.

European C-Sections in ancient times often involved cutting a woman open with no intention of putting her back together. Even in Arabia / Persia / India where medical services were more advanced, not very many women would have survived a c-section and they were nearly always reserved as the last option.

I was so shocked when I first learned that at school, how frequently women died in childbirth historically and it was fairly normal for the husband to pretty much accept it and go on to marry again within the year.

I agree that no one really wants interventions prior to giving birth. However, after two days of irregular contractions, I was exhausted and not coping. I genuinely was at the stage of trying to figure out how to kill myself as no pain relief was forthcoming, as I hadn't reach 4cm (I think I was at 3cm for around 20 hours). I wanted an intervention very badly.

I felt for a long time afterwards that I was refused an intervention because the midwife was prioritising a natural labour/ avoiding the 'cascade of interventions' over my mental health. I finally had an epidural and forceps. Around 18 months later I had lots counselling for PTSD as I was still so upset by it, mainly the part where I wanted to kill myself and the baby - I felt very guilty.

I'm pregnant again now and plan on as early an epidural as possible. I don't feel guilty about that!

I never knew how to answer that question with DD1. I was induced, early, but she came out of my vagina. I dont class that as natural! If everything had been left to nature we'd both have died...

"My self esteem is not contingent on pushing something out of my vagina."

I had a failed induction, failure to progress and an EMCS. Left to mother nature my daughter and I would be dead so yay for artifice. Yay also to nitrous, remifentanyl and Valium- the only time I will ever get to try them and it was all legal and positively encouraged #2 due next week, Plan A is VBAC - so fairly medicalised what with all the monitoring- but if I need a section I care not.

I also walk for short trips but drive the 15 miles to work in an artificial car, eat a lot of locally produced food but also enjoy rice, delicious avocados, honeydew melon and all sorts of things that will never grow in this cold wet corner of the world naturally or at all. I've had my eyes lasered with an artificial laser with superb results and I love the sense of community, interest and chat that comes with reading and typing electronic messages on an artificial screen that get bounced up to an artificial satellite and back down.
"Natural" life was largely nasty, brutish and short.

@RoseReally - that sounds really tough I hope you are feeling better now and congratulations on your pregnancy! At my debrief following my birth (would really recommend a debrief for anybody who has a tricky time) my midwife mentioned that, in her experience, not having pain relief when its really needed - for whatever reason - can be far more traumatising than ending up with other forms of intervention. So when pain relief is needed, it's needed.
@AnotherEmma - completely agree with you. I suppose my birth was a classic cascade of intervention. However I couldn't have done it without an epidural. Maybe I wouldn't have needed forceps if I hadn't had one - but baby was over 90th percentile so maybe I would have done!
@powershowerforanhour - good luck!

It is a natural birth. It’s things like this that made the term snowflake come into existence. Nobody should be ashamed of any type of birth but it is a term and accurately describes the situation.

The only time I have felt upset about birth stories is when people talked about what happened when their baby was born.

I had to have DD under general anaesthetic in surgery alone. It was a couple of hours surgery due to placenta previa in which they knew I would bleed. It makes me sad when people talk about their first few moments and I feel like I really missed out. Not their fault though of course.

I agree re the cascade of interventions. Medics don't offer them for shits and giggles, and refusing interventions can also lead to more serious measures being needed, further down the line.

Most of the time, the "choice" is no choice at all. Describing interventions as "choice" puts the responsibility for how the labour progresses back upon the woman e.g. "If only I could have been braver with the pain, the epidural and ventouse may not have been needed".

Spectacularly unhelpful when a woman may well be at her most vulnerable.

If men had babies, would the emphasis then be on "natural" and pain relief-free birth? Would it fuck!

I'm surrounded by people who sneezed their babies out in 5 minutes without pain relief or intervention.

And I had 2 cesareans and nearly died both times.

It used to really bother me and I felt like I'd failed at this "natural" thing, especially because many many comments hinted that I must have done something wrong. Did I not exercise enough? Perhaps I should have been more mindful? Was my breathing correct?

Bog off. I'm over it now. My children are healthy and wonderful and neither of them care how they entered the world so why should I.

Can totally relate Janet. My second was born with a heart defect that could only have been cured in the last 40 yrs. He's now a healthy strapping boy, I'm so grateful.

Everyone I know who had an epidural for their first birth at least was either a) on the drip, therefore dealing with very high pain levels b) had something like back to back presentation, therefore dealing with high pain levels or c) had been labouring for ages, not getting anywhere and totally exhausted.

It’s a last resort when labour’s not going particularly well in the first place.

I’m sure they exist, but I haven’t come across women who are managing fairly well and want an epidural just because.

And anyone I know who had birth with just gas and air had no complicating factors in the first place.

I agree it’s unhelpful to position interventions as a ‘choice’. Certainly ime it tends to be women at the end of their tether.

Not true. Many south asian women choose gas and air because they’ve been told by their families that other drugs are unhealthy - my sister and sil had back to back and was in a lot of pain and refused to have epidurals. Sister tore (3rd degree) and had to then be stitched up without any pain relief. Sil was rushed for a c-section because she passed out in pain. The midwives were furious with both of them but it’s apparently a common feature amongst South Asian pregnancies - and probably one of the reasons why complex births tend to become even more complex.

I think a supernatural birth would be pretty cool.