Or is the person we're buying a house from totally fucking batshit?

[sootspritez]

I'm gonna start by saying I know I'm not being unreasonable, however I am inexperienced, so looking for some guidance on where you think things have gone wrong and what I can now do to placate this nutjob vendor. NC as outing. Will try not to drip feed.

Dh and I are first time buyers. Visited a house. Loved it. Offered full asking price. All fine up until this point.

3 weeks after offer is accepted the survey happens. This is when things start going south.

Let's say that house was on market for 150k. Survey came back and said the house was only work 137k due to needing new Windows, chimney work, roof tiles, etc and the bank believe this was all the house was worth.

Survey cost in excess of £500 so fairly decent survey for a reasonable priced house. Put it to the agents that unfortunately this is now all we can offer as the mortgage lenders I.e. bank believe it's all the house is worth due to work needing doing. Fully prepared to be told tough and that they're holding out for the full price as I know they rejected a previous offer for being slightly below asking.

Vendor agrees to sell for 137k immediately. Phew... Or so we thought.

From this point on the following has happened via estate agents -

• vendor has cancelled 3 second viewings because they were inconvenient though she initially agreed

• she has denied entrance to the property for a contractor to come out with us to estimate how much work needs doing

• pointlessly got in touch to specify that now that they had gone below asking that all appliances wouldn't be included (I didn't want her appliances)

• asked EA to ask us TWICE if we would be willing to offer them more money despite accepting price given by mortgage lender

• when we have asked for another viewing she has proposed just insane times '20 mins at 6pm on the last Sunday of the month' '30 mins at 10.30am exactly 4 weeks on friday' despite us offering to be entirely flexible where possible (I.e. evenings and weekends at her convenience but would be willing to book an hour off work if she can guarantee the time). She says she cannot guarantee time as she works fill time and has 2 boys who play football until 8pm every single night and all day every weekend and they are her priority.

She has told the EA that she thinks we are inflexible and both the EA and the branch manager have apologised to us for her behaviour but obviously won't challenge her on it.

Am I right in thinking she's pissed off about lowering the price and just doesn't wanna sell her house?!

The vendor doesn't want you too have one? Ask yourself why

I'd hazard that a previous visit resulted in a huge reduction - the vendor is probably worried the same thing will happen again.

Op - I’d walk away. It doesn’t bode well she refuses to give information on whether there’s an rsj. That’s pretty basic.

Yeah maybe you should’ve had the builder in before revising the offer. But you’re first time buyers you live and learn. It shouldn’t be this hard and if she’s being snarky about appliances and stuff I’d back out before you’re really tied in.

Hope you find another lovely place.

Just to reiterate it is not normal to do further viewings after offer has been accepted.

Sometimes people do a measuring up between exchanging and completion after committing to buy the house. But again not usually.

You have to simply wait until you are in the new house and then plan etc

If I were selling, had accepted an offer and then the buyers wanted further viewings I would think that they were not serious and going to pull out

legally the buyer can walk away at any point before contract are exchanged.

They are not bound to buy a possible wreck just because they unfortunately didn't pull out at time that was more convenient.

I'm not sure if you've got my posts mixed up with someone else's @formul1isSoBoringNow? I've no idea where I've given this impression at all.

My point was that, I'm my opinion, it's much better to know what you're letting yourselves in for before offering rather than fannying around afterwards, and incurring more solicitor costs etc. I worked in estate agency for 12 years (in Scotland, way back, so no doubt things have changed) and it was generally a given that this was the case.

You ask your solicitor to get her to provide evidence of an RSJ. and yes, she is totally expecting you to try and negotiate the price again because you are, aren't you?

That isn't how house buying works. Houses are worth what people will pay for them

That isn't how house buying works. Houses are worth what people will pay for them.

Absolutely true.

And it is your solicitor who asks about a rsj not you

Having bought and sold lots of houses never ever dealt with other side directly, that is what estate agents and solicitor are for

But you can walk away at any time and don’t have to buy the house

Sorry op in my opinion yabu!
Just put yourself in her shoes. She still lives there with her family after all. And for you to come in measuring stuff and with builders I'd think you can do that when the house is actually yours. The day the money is in her account. I don't think she's trying to hide something. Its just weird for you to do a second viewing after your offer was accepted. You should wait till it's yours or just pull out.
Make up your mind. And next time do the second viewing before you put the offer in.

@sootspritez
I've not read the full thread, I dont have time. But if you want a second viewing you do this before you put in your offer. It seems crazy to me you only saw it once and offered full asking price. Why didnt you you have a 2nd look befote offering? Also, it's best to do a survey before you submit the offer or say offer is subject to survey.
The way this woman is acting I would definitely pull out. There are always other houses. And start low when offering usually a seller will meet in the middle.

I think you’re getting a hard time on here because people seem confused by your use of “second viewing”. It’s not so much that as a “the survey has raised some questions about the structural integrity of the house and I need a professional to check it out before I make the biggest financial decision of my life” viewing.

I’d be blunt with her - you’re not proceeding any further until you’re satisfied. If she still refuses, I’d walk away. I’d also be wary that she doesn’t decide to try and hold you to ransom at the last minute to get more money out of you. Trust your instincts and walk away if needs be.

You won't be able to see whether there's an RSJ or not. Ours is completely encased in fire-proof boarding. You would need to remove sections of wall or lift floor boards and then poke about further. If you absolutely must have this house I'd investigate how much an insurance bond on this would cost. I imagine you'd need to know how long ago the chimney breast was removed. Given the seller's attitude I'd be strongly tempted to walk away.

Catchingbentcoppers yeah sorry think I did misread yours.

my post was more to put across the point to some posters who were basically saying "tough shit OP, you should have done that at X time" I was pointing out OP isn't obliged or bound to continue to proceed just because she messed up with the order in which she should have done things.

"We have been advised not to proceed further by our solicitor due to wanting to clarify issues raised in the survey."
Take their advice. Honestly, I would walk away from buying this house. Possibly run.

I suspect her builder husband may have done some quick&dirty work on the house and it would cost a fortune to correct. A variation on 'the cobbler's children go unshod' - you'd think they'd do their best work on their own home, but often that is not the case.

"She has told the EA that she thinks we are inflexible and both the EA and the branch manager have apologised to us for her behaviour but obviously won't challenge her on it. "
Contact the EA and tell them you are withdrawing your offer. Let them ponder whether not challenging it was worth the loss of their fee, since they won't get paid until it sells. But DO NOT let them think if they talk to her that it will change your mind on this house. Just walk away, it's bad news.

Having sold & bought many times, this is why she is saying no;

“ I don't want to move forward with the sale until I can check on how much this is going to cost with a professional.”

Thank you to all the people who fucking get it! Feel like nutjob vendor has cloned herself and attacked the thread, jaysus

Why go on AIBU if you only want people to agree with you? Isn't the whole point to get perspective on the other person's point of view. Sometimes it is a whitewash YANBU but this isn't one of those times. The way you are describing her as a nutjob etc is in itself unreasonable.

Catchingbentcoppers yeah sorry think I did misread yours.

No worries @formul1isSoBoringNow.

Thank you to all the people who fucking get it! Feel like nutjob vendor has cloned herself and attacked the thread, jaysus

You'll always get a mix of views on AIBU @sootspritez , there's no point posting on here if you just want everyone to agree with you (I don't think I've ever seen that happen! ). Even most posters who do not agree with you have expressed valid reasons for doing so and that's fair enough, surely?

I think you’re getting a hard time on here because people seem confused by your use of “second viewing”. It’s not so much that as a “the survey has raised some questions about the structural integrity of the house and I need a professional to check it out before I make the biggest financial decision of my life” viewing.

I’d be blunt with her - you’re not proceeding any further until you’re satisfied. If she still refuses, I’d walk away. I’d also be wary that she doesn’t decide to try and hold you to ransom at the last minute to get more money out of you. Trust your instincts and walk away if needs be.

Agreed.

I'm surprised so many think it's I advance to go for repeated viewings of a property you are buying. Admittedly we have only bought two houses, the first was unoccupied and the 2nd a new build but both times we went back again. The first time it was to check things out, measure up etc not because we wanted to haggle on the price but because we new work needed doing and we wanted to get it arranged for as soon after exchange as possible.

The second time it was to measure up for curtains, furniture etc.

Years ago we were buying a house (vendors pulled out in the end over issues in their new house) but they let us go back a couple of times after the offer was accepted.

Op, I would pull out, it feels like she is hiding something here.

Hmm I think there is fault on both sides here.

I don't think a second viewing is that weird after offer, and I agree that she is being awkward about it. There's nothing to be gained by that, although why haven't you gone at the times she's offered?

On the other hand I think you, as buyers, are being flakey and unreliable. You made an offer, you then reduced your offer after survey (both perfectly fine) but even though that reduced offer was accepted you're still not sure you're going to proceed with the house. Costing up any work needed and maybe pulling out (or further reducing your offer) is then potentially wasting her time. You're still viewing other properties. You're not committed to this at all.

After the survey was the time to get the work costed up and decide based on that what sort of reduced offer to make or to pull out. That's where you've gone wrong, and are coming across now as a time waster.

Imagine this from her point of view?

AIBU? I put my house on the market and had 10 viewings and two offers in one day, the second one for the asking price. I immediately accepted and took the house off the market. They did a homebuyer's survey which showed some issues that indicated a reduced valuation of the house, and asked if I would drop the house by that much. Although I had a lot of interest in the house and thought I could possibly get more by going back on the market, I agreed to reduce the price significantly to keep the sale moving as I've already found a house I like. They're now demanding access to the house to bring a builder to cost up the work that needs doing and I've heard from my agents that they're still viewing other properties. I've already dropped the price to what was requested and I now feel like they're just angling to get more money off, and are likely to pull out anyway as they're obviously not committed. AIBU not to go out of my way to accommodate this request?

I've bought and sold a few houses in my time.
I'm afraid, op, that if a survey has pointed out possible major structural issues (and I would include an unsupported chimney in this), I have always walked away, simply because I don't want the likely expense and hassle of putting other peoples bodges right. I have always bought at the limit of my budget and I simply didn't have the money to do anything other than a bit of decorating initially.
Also, I have always allowed people to come and measure up, likewise, people have allowed me. I really can't see the problem with this. However, perhaps I have been lucky in that no buyers have felt the need to bring a builder with them. If they had suggested it, I would be worried they were trying to get the price reduced.
I would walk away from this one tbh.

It's fair that you reduced your offer because that's what the survey and mortgage valued it at. What's not fair is then to want to come in with builders etc because you're not sure the house is worth your second offer (sounding like you're now wanting to haggle the price down further). This should've been done before you made your second offer. Don't make offers if you don't mean it, you're time wasting. It's fair to ask to measure ovens etc that you're going to have to replace, but it has to be at a time that's convenient to the owner and her family. It's more normal to bring builders in once the house is yours.

Just get the sale complete as soon as possible and sort out the contractor once the house is yours. There is no reason to inconvenience her by having your contractors traipsing through her home. Even though she is selling, it is still her home until the day of completion.

She is BU for not allowing access to assess structural issues. That is a normal request, you’re right.

However YABU for making a revised offer after you knew there were issues but before you knew the extent of them or how much they’d cost you to put right. That’s bonkers.

Just get the sale complete as soon as possible and sort out the contractor once the house is yours.

Woah So the OP should just go ahead and ignore a potentially costly structural issue?