Being prayed for

[BuckingFrolics]

I'm an atheist and my DM knows this - indeed she and my DF raised me as one. She "found god" when my DF left in my early teens

She says she prays for me.

AIBU to tell her to stop, as I find it offensive?

Once a question is raised (and that is inherent to the notion of us discussing whether or not there is a God and whether you believe there is one) you choose a to take, or not take a position on it. You can choose to believe there is one, isn't one, or choose not to believe anything on the matter.

There is no involuntary spasm involved there, it is a choice.

But if you believe belief is not a choice then why berate people for believing in God? Rather cruel really.

Fair enough. I enjoy talking about stuff like this. But not with game players. That’s just boring.

birdflyinghigh

But if you believe belief is not a choice then why berate people for believing in God? Rather cruel really

Eh ? Are you referring to me? I haven't "berated " any one from believing whatever they want. What I object to is being co-opted in to their belief. I don't want anyone praying for me.

You can choose to believe there is one, isn't one, or choose not to believe anything on the matter

There is no involuntary spasm involved there, it is a choice

It is absolutely not a choice.

Read my earlier posts did you mean to be so snippy?

I explained that part of Christian beliefs involves the belief Christ is in you. So He is always present and witness to everything thought and said. So to acknowledge that means any purposeful thought occurs with the knowledge God is the audience to it. Thus purposeful thought becomes silent prayer and what is purposely thought & said aloud spoken prayer. It's not really a downgrade just a more constant state of being

Should we ever meet and should you feel compelled to pray for me could you do it silently and keep it to yourself? Your god is not present in my life.

Should we ever meet and should you feel compelled to pray for me could you do it silently and keep it to yourself?

No problem.

It is absolutely not a choice.

So why does other people believing something you don't appear to annoy you so much? Why do you berate them for it? If it is involuntary?

And if they dare to open up to you about their beliefs because they believe it might be helpful to you, why then berate them for that belief? If it is involuntary.

What I object to is being co-opted in to their belief. I don't want anyone praying for me.

What if they believe (involuntarily) it is the right thing to do?

Nobody is berating anyone. You are twisting saying I'm not in interested and do not believe in your god to "berating"

Believe in whatever god you want but telling someone else you are praying to that god on their behalf is virtue signalling. It's all about the person doing the praying.

And if they dare to open up to you about their beliefs because they believe it might be helpful to you, why then berate them for that belief?

The only berating I can see is from you actually. It's pretty arrogant to assume your god would be of any interest or help. I don't as it happens go around forcing my lack of belief on anyone. You seem to think you have a, presumably god given right, to preach about your god.

Birdflyinghigh

What I object to is being co-opted in to their belief. I don't want anyone praying for me

What if theybelieve(involuntarily) it is the right thing to do?

How many times do I have to say they can believe in whatever god they want, but keep it to themselves. It is the height of arrogance to ignore that.

Nobody is berating anyone. You are twisting saying I'm not in interested and do not believe in your god to "berating"

Thank you. That's nice to know. 🙂

Believe in whatever god you want but telling someone else you are praying to that god on their behalf is virtue signalling.

I would only do this if I believed they would find it supportive. As I said earlier. If I knew someone was profoundly atheist I would probably just say, 'I hope...(something good happens)' if they were seeking support but essentially, to me, it means the same thing (which I have disclosed for the purposes of this thread I would only discuss that with someone if the subject came up).

It's pretty arrogant to assume your god would be of any interest or help. I don't as it happens go around forcing my lack of belief on anyone

Ah, the difference between distinguishing between arrogance and a strongly and passionately held conviction. Can be difficult to discern in someone else especially if that conviction conflicts with your own.

You seem to think you have a, presumably god given right, to preach about your god.

You've got me 'banged to rights' there but it's something I believe. A belief which you've indicated you think is involuntary. So I can't help it, can I?

How many times do I have to say they can believe in whatever god they want, but keep it to themselves

Even if they (involuntarily according to you) believe that would be wrong? Do you go against your conscience and do stuff you believe to be wrong?

Even if they (involuntarily according to you) believe that would be wrong? Do you go against your conscience and do stuff you believe to be wrong?

What on earth are you on about? I can't answer the above point as I literally have no idea what you are trying to say.

And if they dare to open up to you about their beliefs because they believe it might be helpful to you, why then berate them for that belief? If it is involuntary

As I said the only person doing any berating is you. I have no right and no intention of "opening up" about my lack of belief to a believer because I "believe it might be helpful to them".

You seem to think you have a, presumably god given right, to preach about your god

You've got me 'banged to rights' there but it's something I believe. A belief which you've indicated you think is involuntary. So I can't help it, can I?

I believe you are wrong and deluded and your god does not exist.

However I would never say that to you unless you were rude enough to carry on preaching at me after I had told you I'm not interested in your god. I would never seek to impose my beliefs in the way that you seem to think you have a right to.

I would never seek to impose my beliefs in the way that you seem to think you have a right to.

I don't seek to impose my beliefs either. But they're not a secret or something I'm ashamed of either. I talk about them if someone asks / shows interest. I don't if they are likely to offend someone. I might get it wrong sometimes, though, as everyone does with regards to sharing personal opinions and beliefs or lack of them.

What on earth are you on about? I can't answer the above point as I literally have no idea what you are trying to say.

People generally do what they think is 'right' in a given situation. What they consider 'right' is a value judgement and a culmination of their beliefs. You say you believe beliefs are involuntary. Yet criticise people for acting upon their beliefs. I was merely prompting you to consider whether it was fair to expect people to act against what they deeply believed (involuntarily) was the right thing to do. If you question the voluntary nature of beliefs you are in turn questioning the voluntary nature of people's actions. And if their actions are involuntary why would you criticise them for what they cannot control? Criticism which is implied when you say:

"unless you were rude enough to carry on preaching at me after I had told you I'm not interested in your god. I would never seek to impose my beliefs in the way that you seem to think you have a right to."

Which I wouldn't do, not that that makes me in any way superior if the belief which informs my action is completely involuntary.

I believe you are wrong and deluded and your god does not exist.

Even believing that, you would have to accept the nature of the God I believe in and hold high (as I understand it) affect my own beliefs and subsequent actions. So my God exists in me as part of my belief and world view. Which affects you, as we engage and interact, and also the rest of the world as I impact on it.

^To an atheist, God is not a force of evil
But to many atheists worshipping a 'god' is a force of evil^

No, most athiest aren't idiots. The danger of religion isnt in charitable Christian prayer for their loved ones. If a person sees all worship as evil they are unlikely to have any Christian friends in the first place

It's win win. You can't lose by it, and you might win. Why are you bothered?

"It is absolutely not a choice."

This is one of the oddest responses I've seen. In what way is choosing to believe, or not believe something not a choice?

Do you not discriminate, evaluate and choose which things you do/do not believe?

Your comment seems akin to 'people absolutely don't breathe air'

birdflyinghigh It would seem you have taking the stance that subjective opinions & beliefs are as equally likely to be true as subjective facts & data because because they are all a function of whom you trust. They aren't.

Which doesn't leave any room for intelligent discussion and a genuine search for the truth. Sadly.

You have never explained how you 'choose' what you believe? I get the impression its either random or you just believe what you were brought up to 'believe'. I guess you are afraid that any actual examination of facts would be terrifying for you.

At the moment you are not open to understanding the harm praying for someone against their will can do. "A life spent in pursuit of ideology is a life spent hurting people". My thoughts are with you & I hope you open yourself up for some critical self-examination in the future.

Opps, that first paragraph should have read...

"It would seem you have taken the stance that subjective opinions & beliefs are as equally true as subjective objective facts & data because because they are all a function of whom you trust.

They aren't."

Walkingdead

Ha! Ha! Your 2.44am post gave me a good laugh!

Opps, that first paragraph should have read...

I think you were right the first time...