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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Being prayed for

605 replies

BuckingFrolics · 22/04/2019 09:17

I'm an atheist and my DM knows this - indeed she and my DF raised me as one. She "found god" when my DF left in my early teens

She says she prays for me.

AIBU to tell her to stop, as I find it offensive?

OP posts:
birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 07:29

I determine how much confidence I have in that evidence and base my conclusion if any from there.

That determination involves belief! Any test, as part of your thought processes, you apply to something, to ascertain it's credibility, is based on past phenomenon which might not be applicable in the same way in the present.

one of my first thoughts would be that my senses were incorrect.

Those thoughts would involve belief!

BertrandRussell · 27/04/2019 07:57

If I think something is true but I am then presented with compelling evidence that it is not, I will stop thinking it is true. I won’t say “nevertheless I believe”.

birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 08:15

compelling

That is the operative word, Bertrand.

BertrandRussell · 27/04/2019 08:17

Don’t understand.

birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 08:23

What a person finds compelling is individual to them. It is based on the deeply held individual beliefs which form their word view.

BertrandRussell · 27/04/2019 08:25

No it isn’t. It’s based on objective data.

birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 08:26

Ha! Ha! Get over yourself!

birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 08:31

So you find your life partner very 'compelling'. Is that based on objective data too?Grin Or the latest film? Grin

Just because it is the objective data (which forms your evidence) that is 'compelling' it doesn't make the 'compelling' aspect any less based in your own individual beliefs and privately held world view. How you interpret the data is affected by belief.

birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 08:35

To find something 'compelling' is an emotional response.

BertrandRussell · 27/04/2019 08:55

I don’t believe I love my partner. I know I do. I don’t believe Sense and Sensibility is my favourite film. I know it is.
Compelling is not an emotive word. It just means very strong.

LassOfFyvie · 27/04/2019 09:05

I haven't read the whole thread but I agree with OP.

nteresting responses thanks. I guess I experience it as patronising like offering help that's not wanted. Or like she thinks she has some magic influence over my life. So if something good happens for me, it's not because of my hard work, or luck, but down to her prayers. So it kind of discredits reality

I also see it as a huge "virtue signal"

I would find it really annoying. I don't agree with the posters who said it's just the same as saying "thinking of you".. it isn't. It's very far from that as it's all about the person publicly declaring their faith.

VoteJadot · 27/04/2019 09:05

Compelling can mean both intellectually and emotionally persuasive. I think the two of you are using it at cross-purposes.

BertrandRussell · 27/04/2019 09:08

Yes. I mistakenly assumed meaning was obvious from context.

justarandomtricycle · 27/04/2019 09:11

I feel like people are muddying the waters here between belief and faith, which are not always the same thing.

I wonder what those people believe privately, though. Religious practice and belief has certainly survived various attempts to stamp it out it in the past. It was just driven 'underground'.

Oh definitely, bullying will do this - it's the same as domestic violence, political repression etc: you can bully people into keeping silent for so long but then one day you will wake up and your victims will have ltb or voted to upturn the status quo. Of course killing people makes that a lot less likely.

LassOfFyvie · 27/04/2019 09:11

but you can still choose not to believe in it.

How do you think someone "chooses" not to believe in god ? I didn't. I don't believe in the existence of a god- "choice" never entered into.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 27/04/2019 09:15

I suspect that many Christians would be the first to complain if someone 'did something' religious or faith-based (not their faith) 'for them'. More to the point, if person X does A for person Y when person Y had clearly said 'I don't want you to do A' then person X is clearly a bit of a cunt.

LassOfFyvie · 27/04/2019 09:16

No I wouldn't pray for you unless you asked me to. I respect others religious beliefs or lack thereof

I really don't follow the posters who say it's just the same as thinking of you. Surely prayer is much more than that? If you are a believer you are speaking to your god. It seems to be making light of that to downgrade it to just thinking of you.

justarandomtricycle · 27/04/2019 09:29

I wouldn't put it that way exactly ^ but yeah. I might pray for someone who is an atheist that objects to it and not antagonize them with the fact, because causing them distress, especially in the name of God, is not on.

I will admit I have told someone I will pray for them when they were being really nasty and afterwards looked at myself in the mirror and thought hey hang on, that wasn't good or selfless to do that at all, I almost used that like a weapon. I'm ashamed of that, because that is not the purpose of prayer. I am quite a sensitive person about these things normally (outside aibu 😜 ) so I can see how other people would fall into that trap.

As I said before, I think if someone is antagonising you with it, and you have said "thanks but I don't want to hear about it", then they continue, well you can flat out ask them if they mean to push people away from God in tiny increments by antagonising them in his name, and then drop it rather than spiralling into an argument. I think for a real believer, that when they go away and think about this, or when they next have a proper dedicated prayer session, it is likely to resonate.

I think generally if someone prays for you it is lovely. The purpose of it is not to advertise it to you though, so I think people can respect the idea of not doing that if it causes distress.

I think like a lot of situations, if you are kind and reasonable about it you will get much better results than being scornful or PA about, and that counts for both sides of such a discussion.

justarandomtricycle · 27/04/2019 09:30

My arrow was at @yetanotherspartacus comment

GottenGottenGotten · 27/04/2019 09:31

How do you think someone "chooses" not to believe in god ? I didn't. I don't believe in the existence of a god- "choice" never entered into

Would you say people choise to believe in God?

LassOfFyvie · 27/04/2019 09:54

How do you think someone "chooses" not to believe in god ? I didn't. I don't believe in the existence of a god- "choice" never entered into

Would you say people choise to believe in God?

I have no idea what motivates someone who believes in a god or why they believe or what thought processes , if any are involved. It's nothing to do with me. But talking of "choosing" not to believe in a god is meaningless as far as I'm concerned. It makes as much sense as saying I chose for example to find fried liver disgusting and inedible.

birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 10:02

Yes. I mistakenly assumed meaning was obvious from context.

Hmm an assumption, doesn't that involve a degree of belief?

BertrandRussell · 27/04/2019 10:09

Yes. I foolishly assumed this was a civilised conversation and not a “gotcha” opportunity.

birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 10:09

Surely prayer is much more than that? If you are a believer you are speaking to your god. It seems to be making light of that to downgrade it to just thinking of you.

Read my earlier posts. I explained that part of Christian beliefs involves the belief Christ is in you. So He is always present and witness to everything thought and said. So to acknowledge that means any purposeful thought occurs with the knowledge God is the audience to it. Thus purposeful thought becomes silent prayer and what is purposely thought & said aloud spoken prayer. It's not really a downgrade just a more constant state of being.

birdflyinghigh · 27/04/2019 10:11

I foolishly assumed this was a civilised conversation and not a “gotcha” opportunity.

You think I've caught you out there then? Don't worry I'm sure your pride can survive it.Wink

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