To think that plane seats are WAY too small?

[HennyPennyHorror]

I've just flown long haul...a 7 hour and then a 12 hour journey.

I am a small person, short and light....about a size UK10. It was AGONY. My back hurt and my legs hurt and I was so uncomfortable on the 12 hour stretch that I thought I'd go loopy.

I really felt for the man next to me who wasn't at all fat but was a very big guy....tall and with huge shoulders and all that. He was obviously worse off than me....how on earth do people who're larger cope? It must actually hurt them?

I think having three seats together as they do on Emirates is awful...and that as people are now larger than ever, they should seriously consider making them bigger.

people have a choice and can pay more if they wish' is just ignorant and repugnant.

Except that is not what people are saying, is it.

People are saying that you can't expect BMW product for Mini Metro prices.

If you want BMW, pay BMW.
If you can't pay BMW, accept what you can pay or do something different - for example different trips, connections, airlines, modes, times, dates...

(And many pp are saying that Mini Metros are actually perfectly decent options anyway, which they are!)

Gemme, because premium economy is more expensive often on an upgrade, than fitting 8n the seats with the pitch and size that used to be common just a few years ago. The maths is easy. Add up the cost of flights of passengers in an economy cabin now. Look at how many seats you can fit into an economy cabin with the standard pitch and size from a few years ago. Divide that new amount of passengers by the cost of flights calculation. The cost you end up with per passenger will be less than the price charged to premium economy passengers.
And that is because premium economy passengers get more space and usually some extras that standard passengers did not get just a few years ago.
Premium economy is not the same as a standard passenger seat just a few years ago as some are claiming here.

Another point about having fewer seats / increasing prices is that, to work at all, it would need a lot of major airlines to agree to do it at the same time - and competition means that won't happen

Granted a few might welcome this, but for the majority who book largely on price it would be a brave airline who stuck their neck out as the first to charge more

Buzzpeak, what people are paying for is a mini metro that has been made smaller. But the mini marketing people have kept quiet about this.

Buzzpeak, what people are paying for is a mini metro that has been made smaller. But the mini marketing people have kept quiet about this.

Yes, they haven't exactly shouted about the 'smaller' part of "new and improved" seats, I agree! they'd be a terrible marketing team if they did! There have been some improvements though, in construction, noise levels, wellbeing etc.

But planes still run full all day every day, and as pp have said, (a) people want to pay least and accept they get least; and (b) it would be a brave (suicidal) airline that decided to make economy better (but not quite premium) and charge more for it. You can be assured beyond doubt they have run numbers on it time and time again. It just doesn't stack up financially or competitively.

Branson once said the easiest way to become a millionaire is to already be a billionaire and then start an airline. How true that is!

I much prefer the current seating arrangement to having marginally more space in return for increased ticket prices. Think about it, if they remove one in every 10 rows, that would give an additional 3 inches of space, but would also add 10% to the ticket price. Now also remove one seat from every row to allow for increased seat width, that would add at least another 10% to the ticket price (assuming a 3-4-3 configuration)

Personally, I prefer to be mildly uncomfortable for 10 hours, rather than pay 20-25% for an extra 3" of leg space and 1.8" of seat width.

@amandacarnet I understand the formula. I’m asking you to input actual data to prove your theory.

I spent years in aerospace. I think you’re wrong. But I’m willing for you to prove otherwise. You seem sure. So...show your working out with real figures.

Just because you are uncomfortable doesn't mean the rest of us should have to pay through the nose, which we would if the amount of seating were reduced
Exactly what I was about to say.
There are different classes for different level of comfort, just choose one.

We frequently fly Emirates. It's the angle of the back that gets me. Just reclining a tiny bit makes it soooo much better. The seats are bolt upright. I dont have an issue on size in long haul, but European short haul are pretty tight.

Trouble with the "dont recline if the lights are on" is it might be YOUR morning, but I've not been to bed at all that night (leave home 10pm, flight at 2am, landed 3.30 my time, 4.30 local time, and fly again at 7am). I NEED some sleep. I dont fully recline tho, because I accept others think its morning.

I really felt for the man next to me who wasn't at all fat but was a very big guy....tall and with huge shoulders and all that. He was obviously worse off than me....how on earth do people who're larger cope? It must actually hurt them

I'm tall with broad shoulders and, yes, standard seats do actually hurt. The hurt becomes excruciating pain when the person in front tries to recline their seat. Non reclining seats are a Godsend.

How do we cope? We pay extra for more legroom and for book as early as possible to make sure those seats are available.

Business class preference isnt repugnant. It's just thay, a choice. Nobody HAS to fly. I don't fly economy at all because I hate it and can afford to make the choice. Lots of people who are much richer than me fly economy because they don't give a shit and are tight. On the other hand, I prefer a premier inn to a ritz, people think I am mad. It's what you prioritise in your own life. If you don't like small seats, don't fly economy on shittojet!

I'm 5'10 and a size 12. Economy isn't beautifully comfortable but it is tolerable. Taking out seats to make more room would add to the cost, and for some people £30-50 a ticket would make a difference between going or not going, especially if you're paying for family. The classist assumption argument cuts both ways.

If you're happy to pay a bit more (but not premium economy more) for a nicer seat you can book extra legroom.

I should say, it's tolerable for me. If I was 5 inches taller it probably wouldn't be tolerable and I'd cough up for the extra legroom.

The extra legroom seats are pie in the sky for parents, as it's emergency exit rows with extra leg room, and those are not for kids

So as parents of kids, over-tall DH and I have not been able to book those for, oh, the last 15 yrs or so....

I don’t think the size of the seat is the problem and I am bigger than the OP. The problem is being sat for a long period of time without the ability to move around.

If you were sat on your sofa at home bolt upright for 12 hours you would feel like shit too.

The only way to get through long haul is get up and move around regularly and if possible avoid night flights, although almost every long haul return I’ve done has been just that!

I can't physically sit in an aer Lingus plane seat!
I'm 6'7" and there isn't physically enough room to sit bolt upright with my legs forward. Anyone sat in front of me on any other plane cannot recline their seat at any point, as it just hits my legs and won't go any further.
I can put up with it for an hour or two, but any further and I have to upgrade. BA have economy plus, and that makes all the difference

This is why I always fly first or business, plus no bloody whinging/crying kids.

Airlines run on a financial knife edge. They go bust all the time. If you forced them to put their prices up in this way then that might make the difference between someone being able to scrape enough mom while to travel home to visit their family and not being able to make that trip.

Does anyone have experience of Virgin Atlantic Economy Delight vs Premium Economy, i.e is it worth it? (The oracle that is Google does not supply an answer)

@BorneBackCeaselesslyIntoThePas

If is is not much more extra money then go for it. But it not really worth it, a few inches at the most, still the same crap food as economy. You get on the plane a bit earlier, after premium get on but that's all.

Sorry ignore me @BorneBackCeaselesslyIntoThePas I read it wrong.

If it's not too much more premium economy is much roomier than delight. I was disappointed with delight it felt no different to the economy seats and not worth any extra money.

This is why I always fly first or business, plus no bloody whinging/crying kids

I don't know about first class, but business class is no guarantee against whinging/crying kids.

I'm 5'3" and a size 6-8 and I completely agree OP!

I flew back from the UK (to Ireland) last week and was stuck in the second last row on a Ryanair flight. I was in the middle. Thankfully both people beside me were slim. Girl to my left not much bigger than me and a slim man to my right, but he was 5' 10" ( we got chatting, I didn't measure him ) which isn't particularly tall for a man and his knees were stuck to the seat in front of him.

I'm convinced the further back you go on a Ryanair flight, the smaller the seats get.

Once you have flown in a Qatar Airways suite, you can never fly even basic business again. It is indescribably lovely.

Jasmineallenestate

Whats a typical cost of one of them say London to Any major Austrailian city?

@Justaboy £10,000 to £12,000 return each