PIL want us to live with them

[Rosesaredead]

In their house. Where they live. With GrandPIL too. In India.

DH and I live in the UK where I am from and where we met while he was studying here. We are happy here. We both have jobs here. We have two children who are settled here. We simply don't want to move to India.

But it is the traditional for the son to live with his parents and they are increasingly putting pressure on us to move in. We have repeatedly told them no and at first it will seem like they've taken it on board, until the next phone call when they change their mind again and bring it up again.

We just don't understand how they don't understand! Uprooting 2 children, 2 dogs, leaving our jobs, and going to live with 4 other adults (and very often SIL and her DD who stay over at least every other week for the full week - so often there'd literally be 10 of us under one roof).

They think we should be desperate to live there because MIL and grandMIL would basically take on responsibility for our children (traditionally) and they think that this is great for us as we won't have to pay for childcare. But I LOVE looking after my kids, and I don't WANT someone else to cook for them, feed them, dress them, wash them, decide when and where they go etc. When we go and visit I have to demand to spend time with the DC and it makes me miss them so much and that's only for a few weeks! So I couldn't imagine living like that.

In India MIL spends all day working hard around the house and grandMIL does literally ALL the cooking. If they'd also insist on taking care of my kids I would have nothing to do all day. I couldn't legally work for the first year, and even when I could legally work, I've looked at jobs for mine and DHs fields and if I worked full time I'd earn around £200 a month. DH would earn around £400. As the son, my husband and I would be expected to pay for everything - food, clothes, medicine, everything - for everyone in the house too. So supporting 10 people on £600 a month -even in India this isn't a lot of money. We would never be able to go on holiday again. Our children's education would suffer. We couldn't eat out or go on fun days out or have treats like we can now. It would be really rude if we didn't treat SILs DD as our own, apparently, so we'd never be able to buy anything for our children without buying the same for hers, never be able to take them on days our without taking her DD too. I love spending time with DN and treating her when we visit, but this is just another thing we couldn't afford.

I can't drive in India. The roads are really dangerous and really scary. So I can't go out without DH. As a woman I don't feel respected. If I go to a restaurant, for example, the waiter greets my DH but won't even look at me - he will look at my DH to order for all of us, I won't be acknowledged. I know things like this arent terribly important in the grand scheme of things, but they do upset me.

Oh I don't even know why I'm explaining all of this as I'm sure you all see that the idea of quitting good jobs and uprooting an entire family to go and live on the other side of the world where our quality of life would be much lower, is ridiculous! But my PIL can't. DH is really upset a lot of the time because he keeps having arguments with them about it, or they just emotionally blackmail him and make him feel awful about it. PIL at actually lovely other than this, and in a way it's nice that they're so desperate for us to be close to them. But their constant pressuring is causing so much tension. We have explained time and time again that we won't be moving and they just won't take no for an answer! The other day MIL acted like she understood and we thought all was well, and then the next day she phoned crying that we wouldn't fly back to India for a small local festival that they're having soon. She also phones us upset every time SIL goes home with her DD and tells us how empty the house is and how sad she is.

WWYD about this? This has to stop because it's really making DH sad and making me uncomfortable, but nothing we have said so far has stopped them bringing it up.

[Purplegecko]

Explaining why you're saying no may read as "come up with a solution and convince us" to them. Say no, just no, and if it continues going NC may be the only option. You'd be mad to cave in and miserable if you did. Then you'd be trapped if you changed your mind, how would you afford to move back to the UK on your salaries over there?

[Tistheseason17]

Good luck with your next conversation. YANBU.

[Loreleigh]

I'm with the majority and think you just need to firmly repeat 'NO' you will not be moving etc. I'd tell them to fuck off if they pestered me like they are badgering you, but you sound a lot nicer than me - be firm and stand your ground and support your husband by telling him he is not responsible for every bloody relative he has in India. Do not uproot your kids, get rid of your pets, leave jobs, friends, your life just to please (and financially support) somebody else - good luck

[XingMing]

Why not suggest an annual holiday at a resort for everyone in India? It sounds as if they can afford it; it would alleviate pressure on you, there would be time to catch up with family, and you can return to life in the UK?

[Atthebottomofthegarden]

My friend was in this position.

I suspect a lot of the pressure from MIL comes from friends/relatives who are “disappointed” for her ie enjoy crowing about how their own sons follow the traditional path/will care for them in their old age etc. This is why it keeps on cropping up.

You need to give her a really good reason why you can’t move to India which she can use to boast to her friends - “my son’s work begged him not to go, they just can’t do without him...”. “DGC school said he is the brightest child they’ve ever had, it would be a disaster to move them when they’re doing so very well..” etc!

[murakamilove]

A really interesting post OP!
It’s been eye-opening to read all the responses and the information about a traditional cultural expectation on you.
I think you know that going is not an option as it will make you very unhappy.
Good luck in getting the message across to you in laws.

[secretrugbyfan]

You say all this....but how big is his dunda!!!!!

In all seriousness, cultural issues cause as many issues in relationships as religious ones do. As long as your DH has been clear with his family from the start that he had no intention of conforming to the expected ways of the family, then as bad as it sounds bollocks to them!!!

You have YOUR lives to lead, you clearly love each other despite the cultural differences...so book a holiday together, spend the time that you desperately crave as a family together having a relaxing break, and just remember (and this is a shitty point, but most others are thinking it) the ILs won't be around to try and fuck your lives up forever.

[SlappingJoffrey]

It's not far off being just the OPs decision deeceecherry, if you're correct that he actually wants to go. Which I'm not sure he does.

If she and DH cant come to agreement, one or both of them can ask the courts to make an order. He can't actually just take the kids to India to live if she doesn't agree. The court would be pretty unlikely to make an order that the children should leave their country of citizenship for a place they've never lived in.

So it isn't totally OPs decision in that it would be a judge making the ultimate call, in this scenario, but either parent stands a pretty good chance of enforcing the status quo over a move to India. Would be the same if OP wanted to go and him stay.

[WildfirePonie]

Tbh, i'd be worried about going to visit them at all after all this stress etc. Loads of kids go missing in India every year, what if yours went missing while you visited? And then you were forced to stay to look for them? Or you didn't want to leave? I feel as though they could and would do anything to make you and your DH stay!

[Travellingmamma]

Did you have any conversations about this before you got together? My husband is Indian, he made it clear from the start that his parents when they are elderly will be his responsibility, it’s his duty. Unfortunately FIL passed away much earlier than expected and MIL has moved in with us. Old age homes don’t really exist in most parts of India, so that’s not likely to be an option. It is not easy to get an elderly relative a UK visa, we were extremely lucky and it cost a small fortune, but I was prepared as it was something we discussed before marriage. If your FIL passes away before your MIL be prepared for more awkward conversations. Remember they are his parents, it’s unlikely he’ll want them to be elderly and struggling 4000 miles away, even if you have no intention of moving there, (I didn’t!) he will most likely feel obliged to come up with some sort of plan for the future at some point.

[Ellenborough]

Make it clear that from now on, as soon as the subject is raised, you/your DH will hang up the phone and you will not speak to them for for a week. And then after that week, if they try to bring it up again you will do the same thing.

And mean it. And keep doing it.

[Mamacute]

Do NOT move !
Matter of fact , I wouldn’t even visit there anymore in your shoes.
Absolutely no chance !

[Vivianebrezilletbrooks]

It is a cultural thing, but you need to be firm and just say a firm "NO!" or put down the phone as soon as its mentioned and they'll soon get the message.

[Mamacute]

This !!!!

[OVienna]

@Atthebottomofthegarden has got it.

[choli]

A lot of my colleagues are south Asian and this kind of pressure is common. Every December we have the great exodus as they all go home on holidays. It's a long way from Boston to India so all their vacation is used up on a not very enjoyable trip to listen to their parents nag them to move back. I feel for you.

[Ilfie]

Life is obviously very different over there and having a son means he will be there to look after you in your old age / financially and spiritually. Unfortunately times and the world have changed since your in laws grew up. Looking after your children and doing all the cooking etc is all they can offer and is a generous offer - and they would have been happy with that in their youth.You need to gently thank them but remind them that you are in a different world/life and would be prepared to (perhaps) send them some money if possible from time to time to help them and visit when you can. You need to have control over your own life, especially for the sake of your children.

[Scabetty]

I work in a Hindu faith school in the UK. This is what is discussed most among the female staff. Such pressure

[manicmij]

Change your phone number. Seriously relations need to accept their son has made a different life for himself though surely he must have anticipated this would happen. You both need to be determined. If financial support is needed in India could you afford to send some funds to them.

[numberoneson]

From what you've said, I think moving in with the PIL would gradually destroy your marriage - and cause untold problems re custody of the kids. If you think on that it might be easier to follow others' advice and just hang up on them each time they start asking again.

[UmBankroll]

I feel for you, OP. You and your DH have to stand firm and put up a sort of deflector shield any time the subject is broached.

My MIL is Indian, FIL was Arab (passed away), DH is Arab but spent many a summer in India with MIL’s side of the family while growing up. He sounds similar to your DH in that he disagreed with and rejected a lot of the cultural norms/expectations early on, always made it clear that he wouldn’t accept an arranged marriage, refused to follow their expected career path etc etc... Hence why he married me (a Brit) and has embraced a more open-minded way of life without the restrictions of (often oppressive) societal expectations in both cultures he was born into.

In our case my DH is one of 6, and isn’t the eldest son, however he is the highest earning, so all the pressure from both MIL’s side of the family and FIL’s side falls on him. Neither side is happy with us because we don’t live in India and we don’t live in the Gulf-based hometown where the rest of his Arab side of the family live. So he has essentially ‘broken away’ from both sides of very tight-knit cultures and family setups. We are viewed as the bank by both sides though (I also have a higher earning job than any of DH’s siblings) and they try to use the fact that we don’t live with them to guilt trip us into paying for things; often unnecessary things.

On top of all that we are Muslim, (DH from birth, whereas I converted), so he has always been raised with the belief that ‘heaven lies at the feet of the mother’ and MIL started taking advantage of this; making wildly unreasonable requests and then trying to guilt-trip him ‘in the name of religion’ that he MUST do whatever she wants or he will go to hell, basically. This prompted DH to move out of the family home and to a different city in his early 20s, while still unmarried, which is virtually unheard of in both cultures.

DH put his foot down even further when we got married. We still provide monthly financial support but he made it very clear to everyone that he now had a responsibility to provide for his wife and our future children and that he would not be entertaining anything beyond the monthly financial support. Any time there is even a hint of putting pressure on us in a conversation - whether about our lifestyle, where we live, money, or whatever it may be - we shut down the conversation immediately and back right off. We don’t make contact again (even via WhatsApp) until they initiate it and ‘carry on as normal’. It works for the most part, but honestly the issues will never totally be put to rest, and every so often MIL in particular will try to raise the idea of us living with her, or building a house on the plot next to hers, or leaving our son with her so she can raise him... We just have to put our blinkers up and ignore ignore ignore, and I suggest you do the same. Good luck!

[marylou1977]

I got these words of wisdom from another site. Don’t JADE. Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain. Every time you converse about this subject you give them the opportunity to try and change your mind. Tell them once the discussion is off the table. When it’s brought up you hang up. Put them in a time out. Each time it’s brought up you hang up and stay out of contact for a longer period of time. This is a kindness to them; they need to know it will never ever happen and to purge them of false hope. Good luck.

[SugarNyx]

This reminds me of an episode of black books where Fran meets her Romanian family. There was some pretty sound ways of dealing with it on there. Failing that, you just have to keep saying no and maybe tell them that if they continue with the emotional blackmail, you’ll reduce contact because it’s causing you stress and upset.

[coffeeforone]

YANBU at all!! The 'In India' bit of the first line is the big no no for me.

Would they be willing to travel to the UK for longer periods at a time?

[coffeeforone]

Also OP, I do sympathise as I can totally relate to your situation re holidays, culture, expectations etc. DH is from India, and PIL live there (although spend large chunks of the year with us in the UK helping out as you describe). Reading your post, I can't believe how lucky I am that DH just so happens to have a male sibling living in India that can take this on and we are not under the immense pressure to relocate.