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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that if a landlord evicts you ie makes you homeless to sell you shouldn't get stiffed for cleaning charges by the agent when you move out?

443 replies

Bleddry · 13/04/2019 17:07

Clean your own house if you want to sell it you tightwad.

OP posts:
Smotheroffive · 14/04/2019 03:24

I am truly sorry you are having to end your tenancy because of landlords sale.

I agree with you about the complete and utter disparity between the property owners view of house a quick hoover round will suffice,and the deep clean oyou bastard or you're a dirty scabby minger if you are leaving a rental! Makes no sense OP Confused

Yes, you'll have to leave it deep cleaned from top to bottom,not a speck on wall, skirting, ceiling or floor. Carpets cleaned,bathroom and kitchen sparkling. Windows all washed and gleaming.

I think it's standard from rentals,the cheeky fuckers scummy bags are those that move out and leave their dirt behind for the poor purchasers.

Belenus · 14/04/2019 07:03

I don't have time to go cleaning skirting boards for someone else to sell a house. Made me feel like a skivvy.

Cleaning skirting boards is just standard when you leave a rental place, it's not particular for getting a house ready for sale.

The whole system does stink though. There is often a presumption that if you rent you have in some way been feckless with money or not worked hard enough. The reality is more often that you've not had the lucky breaks that others have had.

As for the argument about people owning the property and can therefore do what they like with it - how often do they own it outright and how often is it mortgaged? Landlords often profit off the work of others. You work to pay the rent, they pay off their mortgage, they then sell at a profit and they then say they worked hard for what they've got. As the saying goes, when someone says they've got where they are through hard work, ask them whose work it was.

JessieMcJessie · 14/04/2019 07:34

Landlords often profit off the work of others. You work to pay the rent, they pay off their mortgage, they then sell at a profit and they then say they worked hard for what they've got.

A bit like people who sell food/clothes/furniture profit because other people use their salaries to buy that food/clothing/furniture?

Except you have to work even harder to earn the money for a property deposit than you do to buy stock for a retail business.

Shoxfordian · 14/04/2019 07:49

You're not homeless

Paying 100 or so for cleaning costs when leaving a rented property is pretty standard

If you own something then you can sell it, it isn't immoral to sell your property

GreytExpectations · 14/04/2019 08:47

It should be written into law that suitable alternative accommodation has to be found for tenants at the landlords own expense in this kind of scenario.

Are you fucking joking?! Why on earth should a landlord have to do that? Tenants are adults so like every other adult they can find their own homes. Private renting comes with a risk and unfortunately that risk is for the individual tenant to manage. The landlord have their own risks to manage too.
Good god the entitlement on this thread is shocking.

WhiteDust · 14/04/2019 08:56

It should be written into law that suitable alternative accommodation has to be found for tenants at the landlords own expense in this kind of scenario.

Another 'Are you fucking joking?' from me.
Are you mad? It is a business not a charity.

AJPTaylor · 14/04/2019 08:59

I completely agree. A house should be left clean and tidy. It should not be to a professional standard and it needs to allow for wear and tear.
And it would really piss me off if I wasn't the one giving notice.

CapeDaisy5 · 14/04/2019 09:04

It depends on the state of the property before you moved in. We were going to be homeless and got moved by our landlord into a new flat. The flat had grease all up the wall, broken cupboard door, a window that had a draft etc. I will be highly upset if they try to charge me for these issues as they were there before we were!! It wasn't professionally cleaned before we went there, I spent a whole day cleaning it the day I moved in.

Asked them about the windows, apparently their maintenance man came round and said the draft is normal!!! Clearly didn't want to pay to fix them! When you stood by them you could feel the draft when they see shut. Apparently fine. We've taped up that window so it cannot be opened and there is no longer a draft. They kept saying they'd send someone to fit the cupboard door - they haven't. The place was infested with bed bugs (the whole building is!!)

But, from my experiences with this landlord and agent, they will claim all these things were done by us or say the place needs painting (even though it needed painting when we moved in!!). Not looking forward to it.

CapeDaisy5 · 14/04/2019 09:05

Ideally, the private housing market wouldn't even exist, but here we are and it's shit.

CapeDaisy5 · 14/04/2019 09:07

Surely the elephant in the room isn't the damn cleaning issue....the poor sod is being made homeless because the landlord now wishes to sell. It should be written into law that suitable alternative accommodation has to be found for tenants at the landlords own expense in this kind of scenario.

Exactly the reason why I 100% disagree with the whole private buy to let bullshit.

Agree

Prequelle · 14/04/2019 09:11

t's happened to me; I would wager it hasn't to you or many others on this thread

It has happened to me. I've been a renter for 10 years and lived in 5 different properties during that time. The difference is I don't feel entitled to someone else's property. I know that the very nature of renting means I haven't got long term security, that my tenancy agreement gives me clear indication of how much notice to vacate I would get. People are making this emotive and that's understandable, but emotions don't change the fact that you simply don't get the same security in someone else's property as you would in your own.

otterturk · 14/04/2019 09:11

Of course you had to clean it OP. Mind boggles that you think the landlord is unreasonable to want to sell their own house.

KissingInTheRain · 14/04/2019 09:12

It should be written into law that suitable alternative accommodation has to be found for tenants at the landlords own expense in this kind of scenario.
Good god the entitlement on this thread is shocking.

I don’t agree that a landlord should have to take over responsibility for a tenant’s life in that way. But there should at least be a long period of notice before sale, a year say.

If owners are going to provide essential services to people, i.e. housing, they should be much more heavily regulated than they are now.

What owners never admit is that the law already recognises their right to use their property against others acting otherwise lawfully: one landowner can’t buy all the land surrounding another’s property and deny access, for example. Why shouldn’t landlords have to accept some greater analogous obligations towards tenants?

BTL isn’t just the exercise of real property rights. It’s the provision of a basic right to people.

We can’t make more land. There will always be a practical limit on housing. Once you’re in the business of putting a roof over someone’s head in return for money you should take on substantial duties. Thinking otherwise is really entitled.

CapeDaisy5 · 14/04/2019 09:13

Perhaps a basic education in economics is in order here - landlords can only charge as much as tenants are willing/able to pay, as otherwise the property sits empty. It’s impossible to charge more than a property is worth because if you find someone to pay your price then that price is what it is worth.

Social housing rents are reasonable rents for the property. Not private ones. Over 1k for a bedist in London? Really worth it when you can get a 2/3 bed social house in London for less. Private is absolutely fucked.

Prequelle · 14/04/2019 09:14

Being made homeless Hmm how? They will have, by law, been given notice. This notice is written in their tenancy and something that every renter should have at the back of their mind because funnily enough we are adults and should be able to stick to the terms of a contract that we signed.

Should a tenant have to find the next tenant when they have to leave? Of course not, because the house being empty and not paid for is a risk the landlord takes when renting. Tenants also accept a risk and should plan accordingly.

Squickety · 14/04/2019 09:16

I've rented and owned and whenever I've moved, for whatever reason, I've left the property as clean as I possibly can. As a tenant you are actually required to do so so it's in your own interests! Once had to leave a rental property quite quickly and with no time to do a proper clean so I asked the agent to recommend and arrange a cleaner and take the cost from my deposit, and it was only 70 quid. The thought of anyone thinking I was a minger for whatever reason fills me with horror!

I have never had money held back from a deposit for cleaning or damages, even where I know I've chipped the paint for example (quite badly in the kitchen of one flat with dark walls). I've found all my landlords have been really reasonable about that sort of thing but maybe I've just been lucky?

PixiKitKat · 14/04/2019 09:21

I've skipped the last few pages so this may have been mentioned.
There is no such thing as a professional clean. There's just no such thing! I hate that phrase. There is no governing body of cleaners who give out certificates those who clean.
I would dispute it with the deposit company and fight for your money back.

popsadaisy · 14/04/2019 09:23

You should leave the house in the state that you moved into. I'm pretty sure you didn't move into a dirty house? It makes no odds as to why they want you out, it's their house they are perfectly entitled to sell it!!!

contentedsoul · 14/04/2019 09:24

@ the posters complaining what I said earlier...
I honestly think your sense of entitlement is far worse.

The private BTL market is awful.
A tenant in council housing would be paying far less rent and have far more security. The BTL seem to think they can do as they damn well please. The landlords have created a rock for their own backs by being so bloody greedy.
I have zero sympathy.

CapeDaisy5 · 14/04/2019 09:28

You should leave the house in the state that you moved into. I'm pretty sure you didn't move into a dirty house?

In my case, I did because otherwise I'd have been homeless and the landlord wanted us out the old flat. We will certainly be leaving it cleaner than it was when we moved in, but I also think they will claim a lot of the damage to the walls was us when it was already there.

Buddywoo · 14/04/2019 09:31

We lived in a rented property for only 3 months whilst we were waiting for our house purchase to complete. We were the first tenants so it was immaculate.

When we left we still had to pay for professional carpet cleaning, oven cleaning and house cleaning. The agents insisted on this and told us if we didn't do it we would have a problem with our deposit.

Evelyna · 14/04/2019 09:38

It’s not right to ruin people’s lives when they haven’t put a foot wrong because you selfishly fancy more money and think it’s okay because it’s your property
It’s not right at all

Why is it selfish for a landlord to decide they need to convert some of their assets into cash? I was a landlord for 5 years - I rented out a small house I had inherited. Then dh lost his job, and we needed the money to continue paying school fees so had to sell. Our tenants had been great, so we were very sad to have to evict them, but there was nothing we could do.

No-one is immune from financial difficulties, landlords included. If this country had laws saying that you couldn’t get rid of good tenants, then the supply of rental housing would decrease massively & rents would skyrocket. I certainly wouldn’t have rented out the house, but would have sold it straight away.

People need the flexibility to be able to convert assets to cash at short notice, because no-one knows what’s around the corner.

winbinin · 14/04/2019 09:42

Reading this has reminded me why, when deciding how to invest DH’s very hard earned money, we didn’t go for a buy to let property. We didn’t want the hassle of potentially dealing with entitled renters who seem to feel that all landlords are grabby, dishonest parasites.

Doggydoggydoggy · 14/04/2019 09:47

We didn’t want the hassle of potentially dealing with entitled renters who seem to feel that all landlords are grabby, dishonest parasites

Most of them are grabby, dishonest parasites though....
Genuinely nice landlords are few and far between imo

KissingInTheRain · 14/04/2019 09:49

I was a landlord for 5 years - I rented out a small house I had inherited.

I think the point that some of us are making is that once you chose to do that you should have accepted that you had locked your property into a use that shouldn’t allow sudden sale.

It may be that the housing market would crash if much needed reforms were introduced. That just shows the social importance of housing provision. A government would need to make substantial interventions to realign the market. Buying BTL properties via compulsory purchase and making them available to housing associations would be an obvious start.

I am generally a free market capitalist, but the BTL system really must be reformed.