Anon. members - Forums open to court action??

[justasking111]

Was quite shocked to see this. Will this be a test case? Mumsnet is such a tame well run site compared to the comments I see in the online press. Is the writing on the wall for free (cough) speech or is it a culling of trolling. Personally I think that something needs to be done, some folk have no filter or are just plain nasty.

news.yahoo.com/transgender-activist-wins-court-ruling-forcing-parenting-website-reveal-identity-alleged-online-abuser-121317596.html

It would be deeply problematic if obtaining a GRC means you could conceal past convictions, maybe including ones for violence, on the basis that referring to them is deadnaming or transphobic.

Which is why this Defamation act case needs to go ahead

Of course. Why deny your past? Doesn’t it make you what you are today? If you have something to hide though...

What gets me is that a male can then put in a job app with, say all their qualifications (but in a male name), say that Mary Smith has had no convictions of CCJs. Mary turns up to the interview with a beard and is obviously a male - but it’s frowned upon to ask to see any qualification certificates, ID not ask about a previous name (as women are often asked this anyway as a matter of course). So we have to pretend not to notice? I worked at a nursery school once - bells would be ringing all over the place of a male arrived to interview for a job as ‘Mary’ and we just couldn’t ask about their past.

People have tried on other threads, so it's a bit disegenous to claim "they never do."
They do. Any trip to the hundreds of other trans threads clearly show that. They're quickly shouted down and ridiculed though if it's an answer you don't like. Which I'm sure you know really

Surely they would have to give previous name for a DBS and in any setting where it was an advanced DBS those previous name convictions would preclude them ?

Or does the GRA give them more rights than any other man or woman?

And as part of basic identity checks any employer would need to see the certificates in support of qualifications - which would have the original name on.

Or does the GRA give them greater rights than everybody else on identity checks ?

What about KYC and MLR checks ? Surely GRA does not override them?

At which point, stating the birth name of somebody who has changed it cannot be defamatory. Surely ?

Two different cases, Prawn:

September 2018 in the UK:

A transgender offender is seeking to delete from her record two crimes that could only have been committed by a man.

“I do not wish my gender history to be more widely known and do not wish to disclose my trans status to employers,” the woman, who asked to be identified only as Helen, said. She wishes to launch a judicial review to remove two convictions for “importuning as a man” when she worked at a Soho “clip joint” in the 1970s and 1980s.

A right to removal, if established, could cover rape, another crime that can legally be committed only by a person with a penis.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/trans-offender-seeks-to-wipe-crimes-as-aman-from-record-qfk5w68lb?shareToken=61c007f39eed6fc72d5ed9843feec685

October 2018 in Ireland:

A District Judge is to consider legal submissions as to whether a transgender person could be properly before a court on a charges under the Misuse of Drugs Act, having been charged as a male but was now registered under the Gender Recognition Act of 2015 as a female.

The solicitor for the defendant, Ms. Fiona Daly, objected to the application by the State to amend the summons brought before the court against the defendant under the Misuse of Drugs Act.

It was Ms. Daly's contention that the person, who was named on the summons, did not exist and any attempt to amend any summons would compromise that person's constitutional and human rights under the Gender Recognition Act.

Due to the sensitive nature of the case the court asked that the defendant not be named publicly.

The person had changed their named by deed poll in June of 2016 and had obtained a gender recognition certificate.

Superintendant Joe McKenna said the State would argue that this was one and the same person.

www.con-telegraph.ie/news/roundup/articles/2018/10/03/4162881-judge-to-consider-legal-points-in-mayo-case-involving-transgender-pers

Lime

Any thoughts on my post above?

I'm (once again) dumbfounded that a few people have posted to say "Mumsnet is transphobic" and "it's transphobic here" and every single one of those people have point blank refused to respond when asked to copy and paste the transphobia or explain what they actually mean.
If you think Mumsnet is transphobic, but have absolutely no examples of this transphobia and can't explain what you mean, I must assume that you're 'playing nice', as it's easier to avoid tricky discussions than examine some deeply uncomfortable truths.

You can't "copy and paste it" transphobia when blatant ones get zapped,

Team Lies is very funny

I think you mis-read, it said Team Hayley and Team Les.
I read that as a Coronation Street reference - Hayley being a transwoman, and Les (I'm presuming Battersby? Unless there's another Les there as I don't really watch it lol)

I have been shocked at how transphobic MN has become.

Shocked, shocked I tell you.

Cuppy - can you tell me why you think the rapist Karen White is a woman? Thanks in advance.

Thanks in advance

"I'm all ears" is going to be trotted out next, isn't it. Are you not actually listening to what people are saying? People aren't engaging as you and others clearly don't want to listen.
That much is evident from the completely mis-read of Hayley and Les as to Team Lies (it never said Lies
and the utterly bizarre rant about turkeys upthread.

Are you not actually listening to what people are saying? People aren't engaging as you and others clearly don't want to listen

Listening to what?

You are not explaining why you think the rapist Karen White is a woman.

Explain it and we will listen. We are here, waiting for the explanation.

aprilviolets, no need to be dumbfounded. The problem with responding to your invitation to provide links to transphobia is that transphobic threads get zapped - which people on here loudly denying it know very well.

FFS

Sorry acis cross posted, wasn't a FFS at you lol

People on these threads always bring up the safeguarding issue using the same extreme examples. How about going for a rather more representative example and explaining what's so scary?

Limekiwi the blatant ones get zapped because mumsnet is doing their job - responding to reports and removing offensive posts and content while, presumably, warning/suspending/banning offenders same as they do with racists, sexists, disableists, trolls and the like. What else do you want them to do? You’d rather leave it up so you can have your ‘gotcha’ moment in the sun and thus be able tar the entire forum with the ‘transphobe’ brush?

Of course there will transphobia here same as there is homophobia, racism, sexism, ageism, disablism but as long as there good faith efforts to If I were to say ‘I have been shocked at how racist MN

Is Karen White a woman?

Are you happy with people like Karen taking over women's spaces? Yes or no?

Thing is there are always people who will abuse this...like Karen White,

However for most trans people there isn’t the intention to abuse...they want to live their lives as they choose without being harassed or denied.
I am not familiar with what’s happened as I tend to stay off the trans discussions. I am not familiar with Stephanie Hayden either However if I was to come across her I would have no issue with calling her by her chosen name and chosen gender.

My son who is 16 and NOT trans has actually picked me up for “assuming gender” ...this is because I assumed a long haired teen at his school was a girl when he’s a boy. My fault entirely but I’m old and my eyesight isn’t what it was. But it shows that the younger people are discussing this and are actually far more accepting of difference and equality than some of the older generations.

I may be completely wrong and I accept there are issues which still need addressing but I have always gone through life on the basis of live and let live.

Sorry hit post before finishing.

If I were to say how racist MN had become because of a minority of racist posters that would be unfair on the vast majority of posters here who aren’t racists.

However for most trans people there isn’t the intention to abuse...they want to live their lives as they choose without being harassed or denied.

People on here are saying that they accept men as women, with zero evidence.

the issue with this is that any safeguarding is done with the assumption that 'women' means 'women'.

If in fact 'women' means 'anything' then the whole of the safeguarding risk assessments go out the window.

Saying that using Karen White as an extreme proves our point, not disproves it. As you are admitting that he is a man and as such it is an 'extreme' example.

If your ideology states men can be women and to disregard all safeguarding, than that applies to all men.

acis I think that’s Jan Morris? Who rightly doesn’t think that they actually are a woman.

JM has had full surgery which would make me feel more comfortable with them in a setting such as a changing room to some extent. However they are not a woman as they themselves have said.

What scares me, since you ask, is that as well as the physical danger posed by intact men in female spaces, we are being denied the right to speak biological truth.

Also having had surgery, JM is not at all representative.

they want to live their lives as they choose without being harassed or denied

And you know what the TRAs call many of the trans people who don’t get involved in the TWAW nonsense?

Truscum. They are abused and called traitors.

What else do you want them to do? You’d rather leave it up so you can have your ‘gotcha’ moment in the sun and thus be able tar the entire forum with the ‘transphobe’ brush?

No, it's others who's said "link it then" I never said anything about leaving it up.
I just said you can't link. As any blatant comments gets zapped.