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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Are gun laws U?

282 replies

Backwoodsgirl · 16/03/2019 10:59

In light of recent attacks in NZ, the increase in knife and gun crime in the UK, shootings in the US and France. What do people think are reasonable options for weapons related laws?

It's clear that none on the current system around the world are perfect.

I am a Brit in the USA, and a gun owner, I also have a concealed carry permit. and I am interested to see what people see as reasonable.

OP posts:
Backwoodsgirl · 16/03/2019 12:21

Yes it would be impractical to buyback that many guns.

Plus there would me a massive number op people "loosing" their guns in a canoeing accident

OP posts:
havingtochangeusernameagain · 16/03/2019 12:23

I'm British and I find the idea of people being allowed to carry guns at all totally ridiculous

This. Yes, people use knives (and acid) instead, but it is far less easy to carry out mass murder without guns being easily available.

And it also means that if you get into a row with someone it won't escalate ridiculously.

Backwoodsgirl · 16/03/2019 12:26

And it also means that if you get into a row with someone it won't escalate ridiculously.

Firearms also de escalate situations

OP posts:
SeaToSki · 16/03/2019 12:29

Exactly, the most practical laws for the US are ones that work with the principal that guns are a part of society. So requiring every school to run gun safety classes, restricitng gun ownership from certain classes of people, making sure databases of people in those classes match and are freely available to all stakeholders in the system of managing gun ownership. Etc etc. In other countries, where existing gun ownership is lower I can see more preventive laws working. But fundamentally violence will be present in any human society, people will use weapons to support their violence and so if you remove one class of weapon, people will find another to replace it. I’m not sure any legislation can/will prevent all violence

kenandbarbie · 16/03/2019 12:29

The majority in the Uk are happy with the gun laws as they are, as am I. There is no need for a civilian to carry a gun - US laws are crazy. It's a non issue in the UK and Ireland.

So what if all the guns couldn't be removed in the US, going forward there'd be less guns and less shootings and suicides.

LakieLady · 16/03/2019 12:37

UK gun laws work just fine imo.

I know lots of people who shoot game, they seem to find that UK gun laws work ok for them. One of them also has a licence for rifles (he culls deer) and the laws seem to work for him too.

Mind you, the first time I encountered men carrying shotguns while out walking the dog, I nearly shat myself. I'd only just moved to the country, and if you met people (other than armed police) with guns in Croydon, where I used to live, you'd be very worried!

LakieLady · 16/03/2019 12:40

*And it also means that if you get into a row with someone it won't escalate ridiculously.

Firearms also de escalate situations*

I've yet to witness a situation that couldn't be de-escalated by a bit of sensible verbal intervention without a firearm, and I've been in some right dodgy dives in my time.

milienhaus · 16/03/2019 12:44

*And it also means that if you get into a row with someone it won't escalate ridiculously.

Firearms also de escalate situations*

I don’t see how this follows - if no one has a gun then situations cant become that escalated anyway?

donquixotedelamancha · 16/03/2019 12:45

There isn't really a debate to be had here. Any reasonable examination of death rates due to gun violence between countries will lead to the conclusion that the US system is the worst option and a system which discourages gun culture, limits availability and mandates responsible use where necessary is the best option.

We can never eliminate the small number of determined nutters who might do something horrendous, but we can try to stop them getting guns.

YouBumder · 16/03/2019 12:52

I am proud of the UK’s very strict gun laws.

I appreciate people may want to use guns for hunting/sport or need them for work and the U.K. gun laws allow them to have those. Beyond that no one in a civilised society needs a gun. No one. Mentioning the UK’s gun crime problem in the same breath as the USA’s is beyond a joke. If that horrific massacre yesterday had taken place in the USA it would barely have made the news here because these attacks are so common there.

If guns are so great for self defence how come we never hear of any would be mass murderers being stopped in their tracks because the good guy gets to his gun first? Bloody nonsense.

PregnantSea · 16/03/2019 12:55

I don't think weapons laws are the issue. Tightening up laws isn't going to stop anyone who really wants a gun from getting their hands on one and shooting a bunch of innocent people. I don't know what the solution is to be honest.

YouBumder · 16/03/2019 12:58

Tightening up laws isn't going to stop anyone who really wants a gun from getting their hands on one and shooting a bunch of innocent people.

Well it’s going to make it a whole lot less likely than where guns are widely available and fetishised surely. Look how much less gun crime we have here compared to the US. The difference being how much less available guns are here.

Merryoldgoat · 16/03/2019 12:59

Firearms also de escalate situations

Is this a joke?

themoomoo · 16/03/2019 13:01

Firearms also de escalate situations

hahahahaha. Just for a moment I thought you were serious, you joker, you

TheSpottedZebra · 16/03/2019 13:02

OP, I think you're trolling us. Which is a bit sick given what just happened in NZ, and indeed all the deaths that have occurred.

lyralalala · 16/03/2019 13:11

Gun laws in the UK make it much harder to have a massacre. The Cumbria one was the first since Dunblane. It was a reminder, IMO, that even strict licensing can’t stop everything as the perpetrator of that held his firearms legally.

However, the changes made after Hungerford, Monkseaton and Dunblane meant that there wasn’t available the kind of weapon that allows huge numbers of shootings very quickly. I think that’s the biggest difference.

I find the whole “well criminals will find a way” angle of discussing gun laws quite odd. Burglars find a way into houses, but it doesn’t mean we all just give up and leave doors open. Ditto car theives, people who clone bank cards etc. I’m glad the UK doesn’t make it easy for folks to get their hands on guns,

JustAnotherPoster00 · 16/03/2019 13:22

If the Americans want to exercise their 2nd amendment rights then they should be given a black powder rifle/musket, thats what was available at the time of writing.

In Britain if someone had a gun pulled and the ARU attended they would have a pretty good idea who the 'bad guy' is, arm everyone and repeat the same situation who is the 'bad guy' in this situation?

If guns keep you safe then why is there such a huge % of the US population killed by guns? If you cant answer any question answer that 1

DGRossetti · 16/03/2019 13:26

I'm British and I find the idea of people being allowed to carry guns at all totally ridiculous

The British are the reason for the second amendment ....

WarpedGalaxy · 16/03/2019 13:59

SeaToSki There are studies that indicate it’s closer to 400 million and that less than half of households have firearms. The real figure is unknown as is the figure of those who own them for the simple reason there is NO central agency where they have to be registered or indeed any requirement in law to register as a gun owner. None.

That to me is a glaring issue: we don’t know how many there are and we don’t know who has them or where. So, yeah, OP, I’d say that aspect of gun law is really fucking, outrageously unreasonable.

We own firearms, DH grew up on a farm with a hunting family, he was also in the military. He’s very passionate about his second amendment rights. He also believes all gun owners should be properly trained and licensed just as car drivers are, background checks should absolutely required and, in certain circumstances, licenses (and firearms) should be denied to people. From his POV he’s not a danger to himself or others, he’s always had guns, he’s expert in handling and firing them and it’s part of the culture he was brought up in. However to me that’s not a sufficiently good reason to have so many firearms so freely available and at large in the wider community in the hands of people who don’t have his experience and training. I’d happily have no guns at all, anywhere even if it meant him losing his.

He thought it important for me to be able to safely handle and shoot firearms because we have them in the house so I went on a gun safety course. I enjoyed the course, I learned a lot, I enjoy shooting at the ranges we go to, it’s a lot of fun. DH also has a concealed carry permit because he goes hunting with his family but that’s the only time he would carry a firearm outside of our home or a firing range.

Even if we didn’t shoot for sport or hunting in DH’s case, DH would probably still insist we have at least one firearm in the house, this is because he believes anyone who is likely to break into our home is also likely to be carrying a gun. I have mixed feelings about this.

He insists I should be able to defend myself but, even in fear for my life I doubt I could ever point a gun at another human being. In fear for a loved one’s life, maybe, but it’s not that simple. Gun safety 101 teaches you never to point a gun at anything you don’t intend to shoot. Even if I could work up the intent to shoot a living person, I doubt my capability, while in a state of probable panic, to be able to aim and fire my gun accurately. Frankly, I’d be a bloody liability if I had a gun in a crowded mass shooter situation, someone innocent would very likely get injured or killed if it were up to me to take out the attacker.

Like I say, I am conflicted, there are no one size fits all answers here, many states are working towards ever increasingly restrictive gun laws and that’s good. But there is massive pushback from the NRA and many gunowners and they have immense lobbying power in Washington so I sincerely doubt we’ll ever see an Australia type withdrawal in my lifetime.

Backwoodsgirl · 16/03/2019 14:17

I don't think weapons laws are the issue. Tightening up laws isn't going to stop anyone who really wants a gun from getting their hands on one and shooting a bunch of innocent people. I don't know what the solution is to be honest.

That's what I have been thinking also, there is no good solution

OP posts:
Backwoodsgirl · 16/03/2019 14:17

@WarpedGalaxy

Your post pretty much echoes the thinking in our household

OP posts:
Backwoodsgirl · 16/03/2019 14:19

@JustAnotherPoster00

Are gun laws U?
OP posts:
longwayoff · 16/03/2019 14:33

Its very impressive that the USA is practically crime free due to its gun laws. Sounds like its one of the safest places in the world to live.

FiveGoMadInDorset · 16/03/2019 14:38

Why do you need a small gun in hunting season, everyone manages over here just fine

MarshaBradyo · 16/03/2019 14:40

I don’t know how anyone can see the stats from the US and prefer their approach to gun law

UK is good on this

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