To think that things were different before 2007?

[Haarrieett]

Just happened to see that the new Madeleine McCann documentary is trending on twitter - I clicked on it and saw that hundreds of people were saying things along the lines of "Who would leave their children alone in a foreign country?"

I was slightly at this because dh and I honestly used to do this all the time. My dc are a few years older than Madeleine - when we went on holiday to resorts in places like Greece and Spain, we would often leave them alone in a hotel room (often with a window/patio door open for fresh air) while we went out for dinner.

Obviously, after Madeleine went missing we never did it again, but I do recall it being pretty common behaviour at least among our friends.

Did anyone else used to do this in the pre-MM era?

No, it wasn't more common then. There was a huge immediate reaction of 'how awful', followed quickly by 'who on earth would leave their very young children alone while they went out for dinner'.

No way.
I went to the Blakeney Hotel with my parents when my dd was 10 months. We had a tortuous dinner on the first night where we used the listening service, but I couldn’t stand it and ended up running upstairs to check on her lots of times during the meal. Just kept thinking how unsafe it was as any psycho staff member or ex staff member could have to the room.

After that we ate in the hotel at lunchtime and got chips on the front in the evening with dd I her buggy. This was 2005.

I'm in shock that people actually did this. I know for a fact my parents would never have left us alone when we were younger.

Even without the risks involved, what if the kids woke up and were scared because they didn't know where their parents were?

My parents didn’t even leave me alone in our country. Leaving children alone and unconscious in an unsecured place isn’t really good parenting,

No never. Our parents just took us out in prams/buggies let us sleep. Not normal at all.

Although they did leave us in the car in the pub car park on a Sunday afternoon with a bottle of coke and a packet of crisps. We were probs 8/9+ though when that happened.

MM's parents and their friends should have been prosecute for neglect IMO

When we were little our main holidays were always in Jersey, and it was a great novelty that we were allowed to stay up late. My parents never left us in the hotel room. That was the very late 70s/early 80s.

On our hols when DC were small we would normally eat dinner around 7. If they wanted to they would stay up for the mini disco and then probably go back to put them to bed. We would then play cards/read with a drink on the terrace.

I know it's been said many, many times but the idea of leaving a 3 year old and younger children in an apartment is completely unacceptable to me.

My parents never did this in the 80s and the family I babysat for as a teen took me on holiday with them, so they clearly didn't think it was a good idea either!

Definitely not. We camped in the UK until dd was 4 or 5 so in the evening we were either inside or just outside the tent. Then it was Center Parcs or holiday cottages and again I never would have left her. Even on holiday abroad at 7 I would go back to the room with her and read when she went to bed. She’s 19 so this was well before the McCanns.

I echo all the pps who said that had the McCanns been working class or unemployed and left three toddlers to go to the pub for fags and a piss up, they would have been absolutely crucified.

I judge, WYP, and did at the time. There was a pool in between. The door was unlocked. Babies and toddlers alone. Fucking hell. There's any number of things that could have gone wrong. As for the 70s, I knew more than a few kids who got into very serious accidents, 3 who died and several more who were sexually abused (2 by older kids/teens) with all the 'freedom' we were given that was supposedly so marvellous. My sister's a few years older, her best friend was like 'in charge' of her little sister when my sister's friend was 8 and the latter was 6 because the former was 'sensible'. This was in 1975. The younger one wound up getting hit by a car and killed. Her sister always blamed herself, her life was fucked by this and she ended her life in her early 20s. But hey, it was a wonderful time with all that benign neglect freedom.

Nope never did it on holiday

Did once leave them for a few hours at a family wedding in a hotel

Ds1 had a phone and they were checked on every 15 minutes and had the hotel baby monitoring system in place as well....still felt dreadful

And no I don’t judge the McCanns. I can’t imagine their level of Spain. I’m anxious and there are some things I can’t take risks with, which sometimes pays off and sometimes is w pain.

What gamer said

Absolutely not in the same way I wouldn't leave my child sleeping at home while I went to dinner up the road.
This isn't a new thing when I was going on holiday as a child 30 years a go my mum would never of dreamed of being so neglectful.
If it had been a working class family who'd left their kids to go to a disco instead of a middle class family who left them to go and drink wine with their mates they would have been crucified by the press.

In fact it's so reckless I find it difficult to believe you're even telling the truth.

I wasn't a parent back then so I can't comment on that, but my 18 month old can reach a standard height door handle and sometimes turn and open it. Likewise a few of her friends the same age. I'd never leave her somewhere unlocked for this reason, even though she's a good sleeper and about as sensible as a baby that age can be.

I was at a wedding in 2003 where the bride & groom left their 2x under 4 DC upstairs in the hotel on own. Everyone knew the kids were up there asleep on own & only checked occasionally.

So I'd say it was completely ordinary.

People only talk about MM because they want vengeance, though. I'm sick of it.

My children were born in 1998 and 2000 and I don't ever remember it being the done thing to put them to bed and go out for dinner on holiday. I remember once when they were about 3 and 5 staying in a UK hotel who had a listening service and we went down to the hotel bar for a drink once. We only lasted about 20 minutes because we were worried about them waking up in a strange room and being scared. I think there was less of a fear of strangers back then but as others have said you still worried about an accident happening.

I was a child of late 70s early 80s and I remember being left alone on holiday in evenings. I don’t know if there was a listening service or not.

We were also left in the car to wait while my parents went shopping for about 20 or 30 mins.

And from age 7 I walked home 15 mins from school, let myself in and had house to myself for an hour before anyone else got home. (Not every day but several times a month).

However I do not parent in same way. Mainly because of the McCann case.

Couple of times in this country at black tie events, I booked a nanny service for the evening.

Abroad, never! Why would you when its so normal for kids to eat out with parents late at night in med countries.

(mid 90s)

We used to go to our neighbours for a drink, taking the baby monitor with us in the early 2000s. We once met up with friends with similarly aged DC in a UK hotel and we all used the baby listening service when we had our evening meal. It might not have been common but it certainly wasn’t unheard of. Lots of hotels had baby listening services.

Hotel where I worked had a babysitting listening service, so parents could use the restaurant for dinner. This was common in hotels at the turn of the century.

@coffeeismyspinach I am sorry you obviously had experienced that made you more wary.

And I don't think my parents were getting pissed. We were in the car after all (no seatbelts mind!) it really was different then. You could not go into pubs. (It feels so strange to think that).

Back to the McCanns. I really feel that the only thing they were guilty of was being taken in by the Mark Warner brand. Honestly this is what their holidays were sold on. And they were not far way from the room. Why that company did not come off worse I do not know. Must have had some PR spin behind it. Are they still going?

@Matilda15 good point re the drowning. That would have probably been my first worry.

I'm amazed how folk talk about 'back then' and 'in those days' as if it was 40 years ago. It was 2007 for heavens sake! I don't see how anyone could think it was acceptable.

My folks tell a story of being abroad with me in the early 90s and the couple in the next apartment left their kid every night to go to the bar. Twice she got out into the balcony screaming and my mum had to go and get the parents, who were less than pleased at being disturbed. I'd have given it to them with both barrels personally.

I don’t think it was common. Children often stay up later on holiday and in Med countries it’s normal to eat late so it would be more normal to just take the kids with you to dinner.

I don't think it was common. I remember an immediate public reaction of "WTF, who goes out and leaves their kids alone on holiday??" when MM disappeared.

Agree with this. My children were a few years older at the time, and this was definitely the view of the parents I knew.

I don’t know anyone that would leave their toddler/ babies in an apartment abroad alone every night while they all went out down the road to dinner.

I don’t know how parents can enjoy themselves eating and drinking wine, socialising while their young children are down the road on their own?

We have been going abroad a lot for holidays over the last 12 years and it would never occur to me to go out without them. The risk is massive for all sorts of harm to come to the children.

Is it really worth the risk to be able to have a child free dinner?