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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Why don't men get 1 year paternity leave?

376 replies

Catinthetwat · 02/03/2019 14:41

I was just wondering what people's thoughts were on this?

I think it's hard to defend unequal access to parental leave. This is important for men, women and for children. The only argument against is an economic one. Is that a good enough reason?

The government are currently looking into extending the 2 weeks paternity leave to around 12 weeks I think - which would be a start.

So, men should be given 1 years paternity leave with pay and benefits equal to women - aibu?

OP posts:
ILoveMaxiBondi · 02/03/2019 15:26

From a personal perspective (I had relatively trauma free births) 9 months was more than enough. I had 5 months ML with baby 1 and 9 months ML with baby 2. If I had a supportive partner taking over at home at 6 months I’d be more than happy to go back to work. If I was having to leave them into childcare I would take the full 9 months.

daisypond · 02/03/2019 15:28

In my day it was only six months' maternity leave, so the idea of a year is wonderful. With people I know, it seems quite common for parental leave to be shared, especially if the woman is the higher earner.

Chocolatecoffeeaddict · 02/03/2019 15:28

The mother is usually the primary carer. You don't need two people at home constantly to look after a newborn and many households wouldn't be ok financially with maternity/ paternity pay if it was both parents.

AssassinatedBeauty · 02/03/2019 15:28

The gender pay gap would improve if men took leave just like women do. That's the point of increasing paternity leave, to have becoming a parent have as much impact on men as it does women, in terms of work/career. By seeing parental leave as just for women, where if men want to take some it has to be given by the woman, that exacerbates the issue.

BikeRunSki · 02/03/2019 15:28

I think 1 year which can be shared should be the option.

This is exactly what shared parental leave is.

Knitclubchatter · 02/03/2019 15:30

Canada has this shared leave, I believe up to 18 months. 12 months at one rate or 18 at a lower rate. It’s a government program that is part of employment taxes everyone pays. You have to have worked X amount of time before being entitled.
It’s to make up for the lack of childcare options for babies, and to encourage breastfeeding.
Men know it’s available but I’ve not met any who’ve taken more than a few weeks to help out. Only 1 partner can claim at a time though.

RomanyQueen1 · 02/03/2019 15:31

Men can share the leave already, and the women I know who have recently had babies want the full maternity themselves, and won't agree to their partners sharing it.
i don't blame them neither, it's them that have given birth, breast feed, and need the rest and recuperation. Not that you get that much with a newborn.
Men have after/before work or weekends to bond with their baby, there's nothing wrong wih them taking over 100% of care when they are at home.

SoyDora · 02/03/2019 15:32

We have a 7 week old (and two older children). DH got 6 weeks full pay, which was great.
I think the issue for some with shared leave is that the man only gets SMP, whereas often women get enhanced maternity pay, so there is a financial barrier.
I don’t think any baby needs 2 parents at home to care for it for a year.

clairemcnam · 02/03/2019 15:34

OP since leave can currently be shared between the mother and father, what you are really asking for is for the leave to be extended to two years, so both could be off for a year.
That is a lot of time away from work, and for most a year of little money coming in, as many only get statutory.

Purpletigers · 02/03/2019 15:35

Yes you’re being unreasonable. Women carry , give birth and feed babies . That’s why they get 9 months ml. It’s doesn’t take two people to look after a baby .

EvePolastriBaby · 02/03/2019 15:37

Men don't carry and birth babies. Men can't breastfeed babies. The "fourthly trimester" is a thing.

*Men don't recover from birth complications. Men are not biologically designed to be the baby's carer for the first year of life.

Wait until you have a DC yourself then come back and try again. HTH*

They haven’t gone through the physical changes the woman has gone through, and consequently they don’t need any time to recover from that and the birthing process.
So no, can’t see why they should be entitled to the same amount of leave the mum.*

Yep- this.

And adoption leave is a different process, there needs to be time for bonding etc. So let's not take anything away from people who have gone through the huge adoption process.

Men can't and never will be able to have babies- women are designed for it hence why maternity clothes, leave, pay etc is only for WOMEN!!!!

Purplecatshopaholic · 02/03/2019 15:38

This is what shared parental leave is for. Fewer couples take it up than was hoped for because generally people feel they cant afford to and (whisper it) the men dont want to say it, but dont want to.

Rosieposy4 · 02/03/2019 15:38

Shared parental leave already exists, totally up to the parents how they split it, and rather sexist to assume male is higher earner.

Purpletigers · 02/03/2019 15:44

Also who pays for it ? I wouldn’t be happy with public sector workers being paid for more than a week or two at most . Private employers can do whatever they please.

Meandwinealone · 02/03/2019 15:45

I think that workplaces/ work opportunities/ marriages/parental relationships

Would all be a lot better if it was shared.

As much as one wants the full option to take the time, in reality it really would make for a better world if it was shared,

Meandwinealone · 02/03/2019 15:46

@Purplecatshopaholic
Actually in my person experience it’s the women who don’t want to give it up.
The men tend to feel that’s the norm, so don’t really kick up a fuss.

TheSmallAssassin · 02/03/2019 15:47

Men at my work (including senior managers) have taken their share of parental leave. My husband and other men have gone part time to do their share of childcare. Men are quite capable of looking after babies on their own. If you've had a straightforward birth, you don't need a year to recover!

SoyDora · 02/03/2019 15:49

The issue for us with shared parental leave wasn’t that DH was a higher earner (we earned basically the same), but that I received enhanced maternity pay (full pay for 3 months, 75% for 3 months and half pay for the remaining 3), whereas DH would only have got statutory pay.

NannyRed · 02/03/2019 15:49

When a man squeezes a baby out......no, I’m not even going there.

Yabu.

clairemcnam · 02/03/2019 15:49

In fairness, a lot of men are not that active in looking after their babies. I would not want to leave a father at home either who did the bare minimum.
Although I do know men who work part time and share looking after their kid equally.

Sassysolly08 · 02/03/2019 15:50

Op - I think that men and women should have equal paternity rights. After all, giving birth is stressful; not sleeping for the next two years is extremely stressful!!!! Having your partner there to help goes a long way by means of support with feeding/changing and giving mum some much-needed rest and vice versa (when taken in turns). Is no rulebook that comes with having babies/DC and is many that struggle in the outset with a newborn. Apart from that having an 'adult conversation' can go a long way to keeping your sanity. . .

SarahAndQuack · 02/03/2019 15:54

I agree women need time to recover from giving birth, and to establish breastfeeding if they're doing that, and therefore women have much more need of leave than men.

However, I do think children would benefit if there were more of a culture of fathers sharing leave. I know they can do it, but many people just find it's financially difficult (men are more often higher earners).

For non-ideal, job-loss reasons my DP and I ended up with both of us at home with our DD for nearly all of the first six months. It was financially terrifying and then DP lost her job three months after returning back, and that was terrifying again. But I do think it was lovely for our daughter and for us both bonding with her, and I can't look back and say I would wish to change what happened.

MarinaMarinara · 02/03/2019 15:57

Shared parental leave is a thing. DH and I took 6 months each with our first. I went back full time, he didn’t. Plus (and yes, I know, repeating) women don’t get a paid year (hence me returning when the enhanced pay ended after 6 months).

clairemcnam · 02/03/2019 15:57

Maybe there should be the option for both parents to be off at the same time for 6 months?

Meandwinealone · 02/03/2019 15:58

Sadly I think there are a lot of women for who it’s “my” baby.
The most successful couples, the parents with the best relationships with their children really did share equally.
But that’s just in my circle. And I know many things work differently for others.