Is it mean to make DD (11yo) buy her own stuff?

[InconsistentlyFestive]

Very quick post as I need to dash to work and likely won't see responses until hometime, sorry!

Just had a bit of an argument with DD.

We're not 'well off'. Have about £50 'leftover' each week for non-essentials which I save for things through the year such as presents or days out in the summer.

Dd has lost about 4 lunchboxes this year. This morning she got upset saying she cannot bear her current lunchbox another day and wants a new design (she LOVED this one three weeks ago). She assures me no one is picking on her about it but she just hates it herself as it's 'too orange'.

She also wants me to buy her new school skirts, cardigans and a school bag because she no longer likes the style of them (again - these are all items she selected and LOVED at the start of the summer).

AIBU to start telling her that I will only buy her what's needed for school at the start of each year/through the year if things necessarily need replaced? If she then loses things or changes her mind about liking them, she has to use her own savings (gift money etc.)?

She's also doing this with non-school stuff. She wants me to buy her new trainers because she doesn't like her black ones anymore (they're Nike ones so it's nothing to do with branding/trying to fit in with peers - purely their colour!). Again, AIBU to tell her I will buy her shoes when needed (a few times through the year when her feet grow) but if she changes her mind and wants ones of the same size but a different style, she needs to buy these herself? Likewise, with coats, clothes etc?

I understand she's at an age where she's trying to fit in and trying to find her 'identity' through clothes so will change her mind a lot, but I feel I need to set a precedent not before she starts her teen years/secondary and this expectation becomes worse!

You have to say 'No' if you can't afford things. Needs are one thing, whims are another.

I don't think it's a bad idea to give children responsibility for buying things with their pocket money. My friend gives her child £12 a week, but they have to get their school uniform, school shoes, and school equipment out of it, as well as all of their clothes. They also have to keep a budget of what they have spent each week, to teach them to manage money as adults. The children actually weigh up the financial decisions they make really carefully - and look after the things they have bought.

I would echo a lot of the advice you have here, you cant just replace something on a whim, and I would strongly encourage you to do as you propose and discuss with your daughter how she will spend her pocket money, which is item she hates the most, if for example she chooses the trainers she will have to save a lot , the lunch box she could do in a week if she does her chores.

With my kids I buy good quality school shoes and runners when they need them, at your dd age if my daughter wanted a say red pair she wouldn't dream of buying nike she'd be looking at the cheap fashion shops. When it was her money the amount she'd spend was a lot less than if mum was shopping,. She has also in last few years become far more environmentally aware, so a month or so back, when she hated her bag as it was hard to get things in and out of it without pulling everything out, I had a freebee backpack I was given that was perfect size and great straps, inner zips etc so she spent about £8 on fabric paints (to paint over the freebe bag logo- loads of paints left), and got some fabric badges to funk the bag up , attached a keychain she had to zipper, and she loves it, its still not fashion forward but she likes it and thinks its cool. my youngest ds also loved it so she's promised him she will do a job on his current school bag. So maybe a discussion with daughter about how she could change some of the items she doesn't like without binning them.

Personally, I think it'd be fair to give her set chores that need to be done apart from a set allowance that she gets each week. It's not so much that the chores must be done to earn the allowance, but that both are expected and routine.

From that money that she receives, it is up to her what she wants to do with it, but that you cannot afford to replace things that are still perfectly fine. Not only that, but it might be worth introducing her to the environmental impact of these choices as well.

YANBU.

She need to learn that she can't just expect new gear because she's changed her mind and 'doesn't like it' anymore.

Talk to her about money (and the effect waste has on the environment).

Love @Toooldtocareanymore's idea about upcycling or swapping with schoolfriend.

Sounds like she needs to learn that 'losing' stuff isn't a sensible route to getting something new all the time just because she is bored of it.

I agree that you shouldn't just replace things when it sounds like she's just indecisive and impulsive about what she likes and I would say that whether you could afford it or not - the waste is simply criminal. They say that it's young people that are driving a lot of concern for turning us all against the damage to do to the planet, but she's certainly not one of them.

But I'm not sure that even making her use her savings to buy the things she wants is the solution, because she might see those savings as for spending now on these unnecessary bits rather than saved for something like driving lessons, university, holidays, first car or whatever, because that's all too far in the future for her compared to new lunchboxes or whatever her latest obsession is. So you could find that she gets to 18 without the nest egg that you'd hoped for because she's spent all the money hopping from one trinket to the next through her teen years.

I don't know the answer.

Suggest she buys skirts etc. second hand.

Have you had a look in lost property for the lost ones, I’d be waiting for the orange one to accidentally go missing too.

I'd tell her to save her pocket money up to buy the one she wants

Even if I was a millionaire I would have my children pay for things they want out of their pocket money etc.

It teaches them to budget, that money doesn't grow on trees and you can't have something you want if you can't afford it. You need to save and get it when you can.

My DH's parents never taught any of their children how to save/budget and they're now all adults and terrible with money because they've copied the parents bad habits (with the exception of DH - we moved in together quite young so he had to learn fast ).

Thinking about it. At secondary school I just had a plain Tupperware box for my lunch that I slung in my bag every morning. I had that till I left school. Can’t imagine having a new lunch box every year. I had a new bag when mine wore out but nothing fancy and never branded. But I wasn’t too fussed I guess. My kids just a toddler but I certainly wouldn’t be replacing those kinds of items. I wonder if she’s being bullied because I can’t see an eleven year old fussed out these kind of things. Kids can be so nasty.

Absolutely fair. DD9 has been told this from the start. She loses it, she pays for it or goes without. She breaks it, she replaces it or goes without. The only thing I will replace is shoes as she can’t help wrecking them.

For me it’s not a cost issue as I can afford it, it’s about getting her to take responsibility for her stuff. I refuse to buy her stuff “because my friends have it” I encourage her to tread her own path. We’ll have a discussion about it and look at her reasons for wanting/needing stuff and take it from there. Sometimes she will get the stuff, sometimes not. She is more likely to ask if she can spend her own money on things than ask me for it.

On the surface - if everything is as your dd is telling you - then you are definitely NBU.

However, losing so many lunch boxes, getting so stressed about clothes...I would be concerned that she is being picked on.

yanbu - DD's clothes only got replaced when they didn't fit/had worn out. Even if money wasn't an issue, it's not a good thing to let her just have what she wants and when, she has to learn the value of money and be grateful for what she does have.

YANBU. I think an allowance system like Weenurse describes is a very good idea; kids need to have some money in order to learn how to manage it, and I think they think more carefully about how much they really want/need things if they know it's coming out of their money and they have a finite budget.

We are well off( by now). Our 13yr old DS would never dare come to me with this. It has nothing to do with money being tight or not. It's the principle. You chose it, live with it.
He gets clothes, shoes as and when he needs them. We bought 3 t-shirts in Antwerp in July, as he had grown so much in June that it was only apparent on holiday that they didn't fit any more. Until then it was school uniform and 2 tshirts over and over again.
2 months later he refused to wear them as he didn't like them any more. I refused to wash his other t-shirts until these were the only ones. And yeah, he wore them, felt good in them and no problem since.
Now that he had another growth spurt I'm wearing those tees :)

I'd never put up with such fancies!
We are renting, so we are trying to keep our belongings to a minimum, that is another "excuse" we use. (khmmmm a whole truck was needed when we moved, so not sure how that's working out)

YANBU

It will help her to appreciate money, I’m not saying that she doesn’t now but paying for her own things will build more appreciation of the money.

Does she know anything about budgeting, do you talk about family finances and the cost of running a home?

I think you need to gently explain the cost of things in relation to what else needs to be bought with money, in a very simple age-appropriate way. As adults we have so much insight (and pressures on finances) so it's easy to get annoyed with what we see as frivolous eg changing lunchboxes every few weeks just because of not liking colour.

On the other hand my DM was the school of tough love when it came to that, she would have given me short shrift about it even though she could have afforded to indulge me every now and then. It might have made me appreciate the value of money/set my expectations low, but I wish she'd been kinder about it or bothered to explain about finances more in a "we're all in this together as a family" kind of way. Then I would have had more confidence that it couldn't be helped rather than her being mean on purpose (it was hard to see the difference as a young teen).

MTG you sound pretty much like my DM! (see my previous post above).

I'd just say, please try & be kind about it too. When I look back on my teenage years I feel full of resentments for the attitude of "I'd never put up with such fancies!" from my DM. I wouldn't say I have the ultimate best relationship with her as an adult either as the somewhat dictatorial air carried over into other areas of our relationship, not just the matter of clothes-buying etc, it was an easy stance for her to take - easier than reasoning with me. Just "My rules, so hard cheese."

Also, as soon as I started earning my own money I spent a disproportionate amount on clothes (still do if I don't watch it) so I'm not sure it worked all that well . You can teach the value of money whilst being kind at the same time.

Your DD's requests or demands sound like whims rather than necessity. The fact is the family can't afford to pay for whims. I'd explain this to her gently.....if we get new coloured trainers and a new lunchbox then it means we can't have a nice day out or birthday party etc, because all the money is spent. Kids do need to learn that families have finite resources. So, yes, I'd dig in. Say "sorry we can't afford it" but if she chooses to spend her birthday cash on a fancy lunchbox then that's her choice....I think you'll find the need soon dissolves.

My granddaughter is 13 and loves to buy stuff with her birthday/Christmas money, she gets all her other needs provided for, if she wants logo-fest things she has to buy them!

Just say no. If you can't afford it, you can't afford it.

My mum used to say I want doesn't get. I think as parents we need to stop this mentality of a child always wanting things and expecting to get it.

My parents had very little money worked 6 days a week I was raised to appreciate the value of money and the hard work that goes in to earn it.

I'm sure your little girl is amazing and it hurts to say no when all we want to do is make them happy but as you have said in your post it only makes them happy for a while then they want more.

Remember I want doesn't get

If she wants new hard plastic items and school uniform on a whim mention the environmental impact. Most pre teens are very into protecting the environment but forget in the heat of their wants. Look up how long a lunch box and synthetic school clothes take to degrade, and how much water and other chemicals are used producing them (applies to cotton too).

My eldest got an allowance in place of pocket money from turning 13, and took great pleasure in writing up and haggling over a contract stating in great detail what's her responsibility to pay for and what's ours - we didn't sign until we all agreed

She buys all her own clothes (but we don't have uniform) but we buy a pair of trainers and a pair of boots of her choice once per year or when she goes up a size (though I hope her feet have stopped growing) but she pays for any further shoes bought for fashion/ personal taste. She buys and toiletries and cosmetics for her sole use but is free to use joint/ family bulk bought stuff. She pays for her own phone. She pays for friends' birthday presents and social stuff. We pay for school supplies but if she loses or breaks things she pays to replace. Various similar rules around sports equipment etc. We'll stick with this until she's 16 then review depending on circumstances then.

It’s very odd she’s lost so many lunch boxes. You know your dd. Is she normally that careless? Clothes and shoes, no to new stuff right now. I’d want to ensure she was ok at school. Is she yr7?

I don't think you are being at all unreasonable to want to say this to her.

There are two important life lessons for children here. One is that you can't always have exactly what you want all the time and the other is that money doesn't grow on trees.

My DDs have had part time jobs since their mid-teens. Even if to start with it was just a morning paper round to earn themselves enough pocket money. They know that money has often been tight for us. They aren't perfect and were/are perfectly capable of making similar demands to your DD. My regular answer now is "Yes, you can have x, IF you pay for it yourself".

Funnily enough, that can mean that the desire magically dries up. Often they suddenly don't seem to want said item as much as they have made out that they do. I wonder why?

It is up to you to put this to your DD in a consistent and kind, but firm way. 11 is old enough to understand this sort of thing in a basic sense.