SISTER FIGHTING FOR MONEY AIBU

[Deni88]

In November we lost our Mother whom i loved dearly.
I have 3 children under 10 that I'm also trying to console. I have 2 siblings.

My mother left me in charge of her all her finances. My elder sister was not trusted by my mother for various and neither was my brother. My mother knew me to be a completely honest and fair daughter. I am honoured that my mother trusted me so much.

She left a few thousand pounds in my care. I had told both my brother and sister that once all the bills and various outgoings were complete I would equally divide up the money.
My brother had no issues with this and agreed this was the right thing. My sister's attitude towards me gradually changed. She became cold and hostile, freezing me out and her boyfriend became very rude to both my husband and I

She then demanded money from me for "clothes for the funeral to look sharp". It went from that to a visit from her on my son's birthday when she started swearing and slapped me across my face demanding that I split the money immediately. It was very upsetting. It's gone all quite Jeremy Kyle and I'm completely shocked at her behaviour.
I'm fustrated with my brother as he is sitting on the fence not wanting to get involved and his girlfriend is siding with my sister.
There are still pending items that are due to come out of the cash. I am still grieving my mum and feel close to break down over this disgusting mess. I paid some money into my sister's account to quiet her down, but her boyfriend recently threatened my husband for all money immediately.
I could never believe that she could behave like this over money, when we are suffering a huge loss. AIBU, did I do the right thing??? AIBU to want to cut her off for ever, because right now I feel I no longer want her in my life.
Sorry for the long rant, it's been a really dreadful time.

Surely the final bills for "a balance on the funeral and the houseclearance final gas and electric bills" would have been paid by now - 3 months later - if the cash was there. I am not understanding the delay either.

If you have a FT job, your own family, your own grief etc to deal with on top of verbal/physical abuse and bugger all support from your money grabbing siblings, these thing take time. You need to, one example only, write to DWP with the death certificate and wait for a reply to make sure there were no under/over payments. The op needs to make sure it is all tied up legally which can be difficult to know what to do if you are doing it without a solicitor.

3-4 months is nothing. I would expect it to take at least another 2-3 months if it was a cash only estate, and be bloody thankful someone else was dealing with it instead of me.

Sorry for your loss OP. YADNBU

@BrokenWing thank you 💜

It can take a while to sort out even the simplest estate; I've done it three times now. Your sister is being very unreasonable; don't hand over any money until everything has been paid for/dealt with.

If there's no will you really can't assume it's up to you to make decisions about your mother's money. Go to Citizens' Advice urgently.

Your dm was sharp enough to know your sis was untrustworthy. She had that on the nose. She also knew not to trust your dB because he was a complete flake.
Sorry your siblings are behaving like arseholes.
Stop giving your awful sister any more money. She will have to wait until it’s all sorted out. As a side note, if they keep harassing you, definitely get the police involved, and go no contact.
How shameful off your siblings.

I am sorry about the death of your mother. November is no time at all, and you will all still be grieving in your own way.

I think, given that your mother left nothing in writing, at the very least you have to inform your siblings every step of the way.

I think you have probably missed at least the first (few) step(s) by not preparing (giving them) some sort of statement of account right at the start, recording all assets and debts at the time of her death, with evidence, and all known/expected debts arising after her death. You have to record everything, and keep all evidence, and (as you have no official right of executor, over your them) all this information should also be available to your siblings.

Not too late, @Deni88. You could give them all the information up to this point now, with copies of evidence, and an estimate of what has still to be accounted for and when it should be concluded.

In fact, while I understand your concerns about your sister, if you don't keep them fully in the loop, I think that makes you the one in the wrong.

Oh, and when preparing the information, don't forget to show the sums your sister has already had, ahead of time. Those amounts should be included when recording assets, and then deducted from 'her share' before final settlement.

The sister should not have slapped OP, but I don’t think it is a police matter.

There is clearly a lot more to the history than we are being advised here. Normally an individual relative is not entitled to manage the estate alone where there is no will, they have not been appointed as executor and where there is an ongoing dispute about how the financials are being managed.

I really would hand this over to a solicitor, so that you're not the one in the firing line. I know it's extra expense but it really would be worth it. It will also demonstrate to your siblings that it's all above board.

I've been through this process 3 times following my F, then my DH's DGF and my FIL. Thankfully, there was a will in all cases, which does make life easier. It took ages, however, I remember that. Emotions were running high, though, my MIL had a massive argument with her late DH's cousins following DH's DGF's death, over an old family photograph of all things. Things did calm down, though, to reassure you.

Physical violence is never justified, though, your sister was well out of order.

@DeaflySilence As we were a very close family this is hitting me very hard. This time last year I had my mum here and what I thought was a loving family. Of course both siblings know what exactly is the out goings and what has been spent.

I'm sorry to say this but I think my sister just wants to book her holiday ASAP. I'm quite disgusted by it all.

She is possibly jealous that you have been left in charge. Your mother has left a hornet's nest to deal with. There's not enough info here to know what to advise.

So sorry for your loss. It is an awful time. People do behave out of character when grieving, but I don't think your Dsis is, because clearly your mum didn't trust her, with good reason it seems.

i wouldn't justify any further. Just say that as they already know, you are settling the debts, and anything left over will be split equally. Any money that you've already given your sister should be taken off her final amount. Behaving badly doesn't equate getting more. If anything, you should be getting paid, as any executor would, for settling the estate.

After it's all settled I would be going NC for a good period of time, at least until wounds have healed a little.

Sorry for your loss OP. It is devastating to lose one's mother

You really don't need a solicitor if the amounts are small. However, you do need detailed records of everything. The usual way is to collect in all money/assets then pay off liabilities. Anything left over is distributed equally. It might be a good idea to issue a statement to both siblings of the present situation, with an indication of what is still outstanding:
e.g. electricity - final bill not received. Chased by email on xx/02/19. Follow up 25/02/19. That way you are being transparent. I would also include on it the amount you have already given your sister.

There is something about death and money that brings out the absolute worst in people. Before my late stepMiL was cold, DH's step-siblings were trying to force his DF to write a will. Luckily the solicitor saw that he was not mentally able to do this and refused. When FiL died a year or so later intestate, DH had to follow the intestacy rules to the letter, meaning the step-siblings were due nothing. I cannot tell you how many whining phone calls and letters we received from one of them. All this was just 2 months after DH himself almost died abroad, so no sympathy or concern for his wellbeing at all. In the end he gave them a small amount of money and, some 11 years on, we have not heard a peep from any of them since.

"I'm sorry to say this but I think my sister just wants to book her holiday ASAP. I'm quite disgusted by it all."

If that's the case, I'm very sorry that she is behaving this way and your relationship has been affected this badly.

"Of course both siblings know what exactly is the out goings and what has been spent."

That's great, but - given all the upset and your sister's appalling behavior - I would still formalising it a little, by (as I say above) preparing all the information up to this point, with copies of evidence, and an estimate of what has still to be accounted for.

Your work won't go to waste, because you're going to have to do all that later, anyway.

I think you need a solicitor tbh OP. Anyone can challenge the estate, no matter how small the amount is left.
Why don't people make wills, it's not complicated.

How are you able to control your mother's money if she left no will? Aren't her finances frozen by the bank until inheritance is sorted?

When my mother died there was no will and the only asset was money in the bank. Because it was under £30k, the bank didn't require a letter of administration. They were happy for my brother take a letter into a local branch, with a copy of his birth certificate and my mother's death certificate, authorising the bank to release the money into my account. I also had to give them written instructions and provide copy certificates.

I paid all the bills and expenses, and gave him his half, it was a breeze.

I can totally relate to this. We lost our mother last year and as you, thought we had a really close family. Mum didn’t leave a will but had a complex estate so we have engaged a solicitor. She’s done absolutely nothing to help with sorting the estate out, but all of a sudden is arguing over the smallest amount of money at the final hurdle, and causing a shit load of bad feeling all round. She’s in an abusive relationship but it’s got to the stage, where I just can’t take her behaviour or nastiness any more over all this, and just want the whole mess to be done and dusted.

I think she’s already spent the money that she’s getting (also on a holiday), despite not knowing how much it will actually be and no idea when it will actually be finalised.

It’s really hurtful that grief can cause people to be so nasty to those that they supposedly love, when we are all trying to grieve for a terrible loss. I hope you manage to get it resolved quickly.

It took me over 7 1/2 months as it took so long for house to be cleared before it could be sold but my sisters helped me.

Blimey. My mum lived in a council house, and the council wanted me to get it cleared within 2 weeks.

I took 3 weeks in the end. It was a complete pain in the arse as she lived nearly 200 miles away, and she was a hoarder, so I couldn't even stay overnight until I'd got rid of lots of stuff.

I was on first-name terms with all the staff at Milton Keynes tip by the time I'd finished.

@CanIgetoffthebusnowplease

Of course both siblings know what exactly is the out goings and what has been spent.

But with respect, OP, unless you have given them evidence of the exact value of your mum’s financial affairs at the time she died, they won’t know how much was there to begin with.

Giving them receipts is only half the picture.

Stand your ground and involve the police if they become violent/threatening.

I'm currently dealing with an incredibly straightforward estate. I got probate through in less than a month, but the final bills are still coming in, and I'm waiting for two refund payments. I've been dealing with it for 6 weeks and don't think the process will be finished for another 2 or 3.

You don't want to divide it, and then finish up trying to get some of the money back to cover a pension overpayment, for example.

I'd be inclined to email a detailed breakdown of what there is, what has been paid already, and what is still outstanding, and then tell your sister that you will not be communicating directly with her until the estate is settled and ready for distribution. If she has any specific questions (not demands for money) then she can email them to you. Keep it simple and business-like and perhaps make the point that she is welcome to pay to instruct a solicitor if she has concerns about the way you are handling the estate. But do make sure you have a meticulous paper-trail, as she'll no doubt try to claim you've short-changed her.

I wouldn't instruct a solicitor yourself - if it's a very small estate then there might well be nothing left at all after legal fees. I'd imagine your sister would then accuse you of mishandling the estate.

@FamilyOfAliens They have seen the bills and demands for money themselves.

@Lakielady it was a breeze in your family because there was no dispute and your brother was happy to leave all the arrangements to you. This is not the situation the OP is describing.

I feel very sad for OP, losing her mother. The
family arguments would have been avoided had there been a Will and executors. It is not enough to say mum only trusted me.

For those of you saying it should all be sorted by now,
My mother died in June 2017, I still have money set aside for the plausible demand for a mighty sum, thanks to IT. I admit it was complicated. however, just the basic probate took over a year.
This is nothing to do with me & my brothers, its to do with a decision that someone in an office needs to make.

They have seen the bills and demands for money themselves.

But have they also seen bank statements, evidence of savings and pensions, etc.? Because that’s the other half of the picture.

You need to protect yourself against any allegation of financial wrongdoing, sadly.

OP why are you not addressing the questions about whether you have applied for probate/letters of administration. You could be charged with an offence under the Administration of Estates Act unless you do this.

It may be that probate isn't required if it's a low amount, but you have to go through the formalities.