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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To have left

117 replies

Whatisthisfuckery · 19/02/2019 14:17

On Sunday my sister invited me and DS 11 up to spend a couple of days with her and her two DC. I thought me and DS could do with a change of scenery so we went yesterday morning. Train tickets cost £70 and the journey was crap, standing all the way.

Anyway we went for a meal at a local pub Before we left we popped to the toilet. My sis called her DS, also 11, into the womens’ toilets. I said to her that I didn’t think it was right that an 11 yo boy should be in the womens’ toilets. Her DS is tiny and he’s no bother but we were in a busy family pub and the toilets had people in and out all the time. She said she didn’t want her DS in the mens’ by himself because it’s not safe. I told her I still disagreed and that he’s too old and he should learn to respect female space.

When we got out her DD 9 said ‘if I saw a boy coming out of the womens’ I’d think it was weird.’ I said to my sis that she’d just heard it out of the mouth of her own DD. Sis went nuts at this. All the walk home she was shouting at me. I still wouldn’t agree with her that it’s fine to allow her 11 yo boy in the womens’ toilets so it went from I don’t agree with you because of x y and z, to ‘you just can’t accept anyone else having an opinion can you.’ I pointed out that I can, I just don’t agree. Then she went batshit, shouting right up in my face, throwing accusations and waving her arms and stamping her feet. She really lost it.

By this time my DS was like wtf? Can we leave, this is crazy. I told him to grab his kit and we went outside to get a taxi.

Sis then comes out twice to try and get us to go back in and stay and I said ‘no, I’m not putting up with that behaviour.’ Then the third time she came out and said sorry she’d lost it and could we please just stay, it was 9:30pm by then. I was about to talk to her and reconsider when she shouted,’’my two kids are in there breaking their hearts because of the way you were shouting,’ so I said ‘no, you’re still blaming me for your behaviour so no, I’m not having that.’

When she went in and we were waiting for the taxi DS said that the last time she’d come out she’d bought her DD out holding a heart shaped love cushion thing. I’ve got bad eyes so I didn’t even see.

So what I want to know is was I being unreasonable? I was so bloody angry that she couldn’t have a disagreement without having a massive toddler tantrum, but more over, that she’d shown her DD that her feelings didn’t matter and gone on to kick off in such a way that completely undermined her DD. Then she’d bought her DD out to use her as emotional blackmail to get us to stay. IMO she behaved terribly but am I over reacting.

OP posts:

MissLanesAmericanCousin · 19/02/2019 14:48

PlainSpeakingStraightTalking Christ on a bike.

I just love this saying! I haven't heard it in years! My Dad use to say Jesus Christ on a crutch! when he got really mad! I just wanted to say, Plain, that this really put a smile on my face and made me think of my Dad. I was crying over him yesterday, because I heard a song, that reminded me of him, a song I had not heard since his funeral. It is just nice that today, I am thinking of him and smiling. Thank you! x

Nesssie · 19/02/2019 14:48

There’s a lot of background of sis being treated like a doormat by men and I can see her DD growing up to believe that she should be a doormat as well.

Not sure how this is at all relevant to the argument but didn't you treat her like a doormat by expecting her to agree with you? She actually stood up for herself against you?

reallybadidea · 19/02/2019 14:51

I understand that she has her way of doing things just like I do,

You obviously don't, because:

she is undermining her own DD, showing her that her feelings don’t matter and I can’t stomach that.

You disagree with your dsis's parenting and have interfered with something that has nothing to do with you. I'm not really surprised that she reacted strongly. And you were her guest!

PBo83 · 19/02/2019 14:51

I agreed with an 11yo boy not belonging in the female toilets...then you lost my support.

You mentioned it to your sister and then you should have moved on. Instead, you orchestrated an extended slanging match in front of 3 children and spoilt an occasion they were probably looking forward to.

By all means, if you want to have a petty squabble in your own time then knock yourselves out. To deliberately inflate the situation, involve the children, spoil their time and then repeatedly reject a resolution is disgusting behaviour.

CrispbuttyNo1 · 19/02/2019 14:51

“ I can robustly disagree with someone then just drop it and talk about something else but she cant”

That comes across to me as you are the type whoalways thinks they are right. And are unwilling to listen anyone else’s point of view. You say what you think but nobody is allowed to voice an alternative opinion.

MitziK · 19/02/2019 14:52

And... this is why I actively avoid pubs full of families, having worked in one for far too long twelve weeks between permanent jobs.

Give two women access to alcohol when they're with their kids and it almost inevitably descends into a slanging match about who is the better parent.

birdlover1977 · 19/02/2019 14:55

Honestly both of you behaved appallingly to each other but you definitely started it. You should never have questioned her decision to allow her son to use the ladies toilet in front of her children. That is her choice. But she shouldn’t have reacted the way she did either. Then when she apologised you should have let it drop. Leaving was a massive over reaction.

RiverTam · 19/02/2019 14:56

you told your sis that an 11 year old boy shouldn't be in the women's loo and her own DD's statement backed that up.

Fucking well done OP for standing up for women and girls' spaces. Brava! You're a great aunt to that little girl and I'm sure she appreciates you.

Ellisandra · 19/02/2019 14:56

Respecting women’s spaces?
I think this is so very important - but honesty, you sound like you wanted to be right on and just jumped on a bandwagon to start a fight!

You said that she called him into the ladies toilet - so she was there too.

I don’t have an 11yo boy, but if I did and I was with him, I’d probably prefer him not to be alone in a men’s pub toilet. I would check the ladies, usher him in, wait for him, usher him out.

So no woman in there would be facing a young accompanied male, and I wouldn’t let him out of the cubicle if any women would using the common area to change.

It sounds like you’re the one who stoked this up.

Beansandcoffee · 19/02/2019 14:57

You have embarrassed your 11 year nephew. Yes he should use the men’s. Yes your sister was wrong but in the grand scheme of things dies it really matter and if the 11 year old feels safer than in a pub I would be ok with it. If it was swimming changing rooms then yes he shouldn’t be there. I think you need to apologise to your nephew.

littlemissquiet · 19/02/2019 14:57

I think you both sound as bad as each other! You only need to read the news to understand a lot of sexual attacks happen in public toilets against children and maybe your sister is aware of that and wanted to protect her son especially if he appears younger.
She probably took offence because she felt you were attacking her parenting and she tried apologising yet not to your standards, so maybe you were partly to blame too, neither of you should have had such a heated row in front of the children over a difference of opinion, it sounds like you're both very stubborn and both wanted to win the argument which in all honesty shouldn't have happened! Everyone parents differently, you may do things she doesn't agree with too? I would send a message apologising she may have shouted the loudest but if she felt under attack I don't blame her, life is too short to fall out over something so petty. Imagine something terrible happens and this was your last memory of your time together you'd regret it for the rest of your life.

sagradafamiliar · 19/02/2019 14:58

I'd have thought the train journey was irrelevant but the fact you mentioned it makes me think you were already pissed off and tired and you took it out on your sister.

Penguincake · 19/02/2019 14:59

You both need to reflect on your behaviour and grow up. You sound very immature.

AllTheFours44 · 19/02/2019 15:06

How much did you love it when her daughter backed you up, OP? I could feel the smugness coming off my phone screen.

yossell · 19/02/2019 15:06

Men's pub's toilets can be pretty shady. I'm big and scary-looking, but I have to gird my loins figuratively and literally every time I have to go.

Dimsumlosesum · 19/02/2019 15:07

You went way overboard. You had the nahnahnaaaanah! attitude when you shoved it in her face about what her 9 year old said. It's not like it was her adult husband going in with her, you didn't have to be a dick about it.

RiverTam · 19/02/2019 15:09

so because men's toilets are scary the answer is for women and girls to budge up? And anyone who doesn't agree with that should just shut up?

AliceLiddel · 19/02/2019 15:15

Why do you care so much? You should have privately suggested to your sister (away from DN) that you think hes too old for the ladies. When she told you she didnt think it was safe in the mens thats the end of it. She has her opinion, you have yours. She is trying to be a good parent clearly, however she sees fit. You may disagree with her actions but how would you feel having someone critique your child safety choices without you asking? I really don't understand why it was your business? Yes you are allowed an opinion but you only need to say it once (if you feel the desire to say it when its not been asked for).

TrueFriendsStabYouInTheFront · 19/02/2019 15:30

No wonder she went batshit at you! Why did you need to cause an argument? It's a pub toilet which presumably had cubicles? If he was sticking his head under to take a peek I'd understand, but honestly, a boy having a wee in the women's?! What the fuck is the world coming to honestly. All this right-on modern feminist bullshit is fucking pathetic it really is.

Those poor kids were probably scared shitless over a pathetic argument that didn't need to happen at all. You parent your kids and let her parent hers.

TrueFriendsStabYouInTheFront · 19/02/2019 15:33

@RiverTam I actually laughed out loud at your comment. How has an 11 year old child using a toilet become an issue for the women and girls of the world?? Fuck me.

ChakiraChakra · 19/02/2019 15:37

I'm all for women's spaces needing to be free of men, but this is an 11 year old child! What the heck does anybody think an 11 year old boy is going to see, do or expose in a pub toilet?! It presumably has cubicles. Is washing his hands in the same sink going to taint the water?!

You criticised her parenting choices in public. In front of a presumably then awkward feeling child. You then used her 9 year old daughter as a weapon to undermine her Do 9 year olds always get it right, having understood the subtleties of human relationships and dangers/lack of dangers of pub toilets, the ones she's likely never been in?

If she had a history of being treated like a doormat because she wouldn't stand up to others how exactly has you insisting that you are right about her parenting choices helped facilitate her to get better at standing up for herself?!

With respect, you might not be as good at holding your own stance without contributing to it escalating as you think you are.

You criticise her parenting to her mum too! Maybe butting out unless you have serious welfare concerns would be the best thing to do.

RiverTam · 19/02/2019 15:40

True you've got the internet at your disposal. Use it. You don't even have to go that far. This thread shows that one 9 year old girl wouldn't like it - do you think she's the only one? Funny, isn't it, to think of young girls being made to feel uncomfortable? Such a hoot.

YouSayPotatoesISayVodka · 19/02/2019 15:44

You both sound as bad as each other, those poor kids being stuck in the middle, in public, with you 2 carping on at each other.

ChakiraChakra · 19/02/2019 15:45

I mean, to be honest I wouldn't like to hear (another woman) farting and pooing in a public loo, but I would understand that it's not an unreasonable thing for somebody to be doing in a public toilet, just like I don't think a supervised male child in the ladies loos is unreasonable.

AtrociousCircumstance · 19/02/2019 15:47

You were way out of line here.

Apologise to your sister.

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