Brownies, a waste of time!

[Growuppeople]

My daughter has been with brownies over a year, they have been on one overnight trip. My DD wants to do scouts but she’s so shy around boys. She wants to do camping, building campfires, adventures! Not knitting or art and crafts! I pay nearly £50 for uniforms, £10 for the “new book” and now I have to go bowling with them. I thought they would learn independence, health and safety among other important life skills. Am I wrong in thinking I’m wasting mine and my daughters time, she is learning absolutely nothing, or is she just with a rubbish group? What do all your brownies do?

“Isn't the definition of stupidity to keep repeating yourself and expect a different outcome?”
Actually, I prefer a definition of stupidity which involves something about thinking straight white men are a disadvantaged group......

Anyone else is free to do so if they wish.

Except they aren't.

There's the example I mentioned above where boys were told they couldn't run for a cause of their choice because it was exclusive.

My son's boys (U9, if I remember) football team had to become mixed sex when the female coach stopped coaching. Protests of mothers of girls counted but voices of mothers of sons were quashed.

The Masons get short shrift.

Can you name a male-only space except the higher echelons of business and politics ?

“Can you name a male-only space“

I run a boys only book club at our Secondary school.

Can you name a male-only space

The Boys Brigade
Most of our local Football/Rugby teams

You didn’t ask for figures. That said...drumroll please...1 male leader, the remainder female. Females there, every week, year in, year out, keeping the whole thing going.

I see nothing wrong with male only spaces. Sadly it turns out volunteering was a ‘female’ thing.

And scouts opened up to girls due to falling roll - turns out there weren’t enough boys who wanted to be in said ‘boy’ spaces.

Someone wanted to raise money specifically for “white boys in basketball?” Which organisation would they give the money to... I didn’t think sports leagues were segregated by skin colour?

(Misses point of thread)

Can you name a male-only space

Some Boys Brigade groups are male-only (although some are mixed)
My sons went to a single sex school.
My DCs primary school had a boys only cooking club.

So they are out there. Quite rare, I accept, but that’s doesn’t mean you can’t gave one. Perhaps there just isn’t the demand (or perhaps there are not enough adults wiling to run one)

Haven’t RTFT but no, brownies are lovely. It’s the white chocolate “blondie “ that’s the travesty.

Is that supposed to be funny, GoFiguire?

@SalrycLuxx

I think we have a different idea of "figures" but nevermind. Thanks anyway.

"turns out there weren’t enough boys who wanted to be in said ‘boy’ spaces."

Or parents who sent them or it could have been to do with certain scandals around that time.

I do think you might have a little point though. Boys are less precious whereas the pearl-clutching sorry, robust explaining of mothers of daughters is clearly illustrated even on this thread.

@Russell

"I run a boys only book club at our Secondary school."

Wow. It just shows how someone's persona online can mislead... you've always seemed like such a die-hard oppressed sex, patriarchy, never trust the bepenised type poster.

@budgiegirl

"perhaps there are not enough adults wiling to run one"

I suspect that's the truth. No one in the public light would be stupid enough to do so. Suggesting that males are in any way disadvantaged could be career ending.

@QwertyLou

I suspect they were looking to provoke or prove a point. I don't think any careers are segregated by sex or skin colour (in any way you can prove) but that doesn't mean there wasn't a 'girls in science international day' last week.

Also, money raised doesn't need to be passed through a charity or organisation when we're talking about relatively small amounts. The school itself could potentially have facilitated the 'giving'.

When I was at Brownie Camp, Snowy Owl and Brown Owl had a drunken fist fight and were arrested, we were sent home and Brownies was cancelled.

Those were the days

And what point was that? That they're not very bright and don't understand how class prejudice works?

“Wow. It just shows how someone's persona online can mislead... you've always seemed like such a die-hard oppressed sex, patriarchy, never trust the bepenised type poster.“

Interesting that you’re saying that not “But surely boys only groups are not allowed- how can this be?”

I’ll tell you how. It is absolutely fine to “discriminate” if the intention is to increase participation by any group that is underrepresented. Like girls in science. If you wanted to run a campaign to encourage men into, say, primary school teaching or nursing that would be fine. You could run a boys only knitting club if you wanted to. Some schools do boys only cooking clubs.

The problem is, it’s tricky to find areas where men/boys are under represented that they want to join. They tend to look at things set up to support women and say “That’s not fair-I want some of that” while missing the fact that rhey’ve got it already.

Is that supposed to be funny, GoFiguire? confused

Is that supposed to be nasty, belittling or are you genuinely confused about the poster’s intent, Stop?

I'm a mother of sons and vehemently believe in Guiding as a female only space.

There's already a male only campaign in teacher recruitment at the moment. The cash incentive has pissed off a lot of female teachers who already have struggles with interviews if a penis is present. It's pretty much a guarantee of a job.

It was supposed to be belittling, Tilda. When someone comes onto a thread where people are having genuine discussion about important issues and starts waffling about cakes, it's a bit childish, don't you think? And certainly not funny in the slightest.

I think it depends on the individual child, my dd has been through rainbows, brownies and guides and thoroughly loved it all. She has 2 brothers at home and I think she really enjoys the time and the girly things she does there. Outside of guides she's loud, adventurous very outdoorsy....

It was supposed to be belittling

Well that’s pretty horrible.

Goodness me. Get a grip

It's horses for courses. Dd1 is v committed to brownies. Dd2 quit rainbows for martial arts.

But since women are so underrepresented in STEM in the UK, isn’t holding a girls’ science day a logical response?
Maybe the school can have a “Men in Caring Professions” day to balance it out.

I’m the mother of a boy and wouldn’t be bothered at all if girls joined his Cub troop or cricket team. I would be if he announced he was raising money for “White Boys in Basketball” though!

Anyway, it’s a bit weird that a thread about Brownies has turned into “What about the boyzzz!” so I’ll stop derailing.

Thanks so all the hard working Brown Owls and others. It’s amazing what you do

Why is that nasty? If you have a penis, you're more or less guaranteed a teaching job over someone without one. At least in my area. That's not being nasty - I have a husband and a son, both with penises, both who would probably get a teaching job over someone without, if they qualified.

“Especially in the face of research which shows over and over again that when given free choice, men and women gravitate toward typical careers of their sex.”

Link please.