Farmers dogs on public footpath

[Cuppateeee]

Just been on a lovely walk in the countryside, only to be spoiled by a shouty farmer. Need a different perspective on it otherwise it will just wind me up. Will include picture.

Walking with my dog on a lead through a field, staying on the public footpath when I see two border collies barking in the distance. I stay where I am to look for a farmer to check if they are aggressive or not, no one in sight, they are staying where they are but still barking and in the way of where I need to walk, so I went back and walked down the other side of the fence.

I get to the bottom and see the dogs have gone, also notice the gate was open so they could have got to me anyway, never mind I’m there now and go over the stile back onto the public footpath.

Only then I notice the dogs have come back, so again I check to see if I can see the farmer because whilst they weren’t growling they were barking which is intimidating enough.

At this point there is a fence between us so not a problem but I check to see where the public footpath leads and you’re supposed to join the farm track but their gate is open. The dogs are following me and my dog down the fence, still barking, so I decided to walk away from them not wanting to risk what would happen when we reach the open gate. I am at this point on the farmers field.

After a few steps a farmer comes running shouting for my attention, I stop and see what he wants. He said ‘the footpath doesn’t go along there, you’re damaging the crops’. So he was clearly watching me, and would have been able to see that I was uncomfortable with his dogs around.

There is snow on the field so I wasn’t sure what I was walking on but either way I said, sorry I appreciate that but your dogs were being aggressive towards me and my dog so I felt I had no choice.

He kept repeating that if I can’t stick to the path then I shouldn’t go on the walk, which in normal circumstances I totally agree with, but in this case I felt it best, to protect me and my dog.

He insists his dogs are not aggressive, they are with him at this point, still barking but I admit not growling or coming closer, just staying with him, but I said again that I was not to know this and didn’t want to risk anything happening to my dogs.

In the end I walked away because he clearly could not see my point of view.

So was IBU waking on his land or was he. And if he was is there anything I can do to stop if happening to someone else. Sorry for the long post, thanks for reading.

I live in a big farming area and have always been brought up with the countryside rules of stick to the footpath/bridleway, close the gates etc and stick to them. Farmers word is law here and with this also being a bit of a tourist place with second homes, holiday cottages and the like it can get frought when farmers are constantly closing gates to expensive livestock, dealing with injured and dead livestock after out of control dogs have attacked, telling people that are straying from the path and damaging crops and getting a gob full, picking up litter that poses a threat to livestock, and having to repair damage or erect expensive gates and fencing to keep the bloody quad bikes and off road bikes from tearing up the land, crops and footpaths. I can totally understand why the farmer was annoyed with you, but I can also see your pov, you weren't to know that the dogs weren't under control as it appeared they weren't, the farmer must have been close enough to see what was going on, but he probably didn't give it a second thought about his dogs because he was there and the dogs were alerting him to your presence. I think he maybe could have been a bit more understanding, but in your situation 90 mins or not I'd have probably turned back rather than walk across the crop, if I was really worried about the dogs, but then in reality I probably wouldn't be worried because I know if the dogs are there the farmer isn't far away - I realise though that not everyone would know this.
I think your answer is not to walk there again, find a different route. I know which routes round here are 'safe' and which might cause an issue, for instance a bridleway goes through a few livestock fields, we ride that one up until calving and then don't until the calves are moved because we know there's likely to be an issue with cows going at the horses if we go through the field at that time of year. Yes, as it's a public bridleway I have the 'right' to do it but it's just not sensible to do so and puts me, my horse and the cows at risk. I'm just out for a ride, those cows are the farmers livelihood and I respect that. I also avoid that field when out and about with the dogs because of the same reason.

surely he should have to have his dogs under control on the parts of his land where the footpath goes through

I suspect that in legal terms he can do what he likes with his dogs when they are working on his land. And you haven't written anything that indicates that they were out of control.

So was IBU waking on his land or was he

Of course you were. You should have stayed on the public footpath. And if you can't cope with barking dogs maybe don't walk near a farm?

Thing is, you may have been the tenth or the hundredth person to trespass off the path onto his land & his crops.

I loathe farmers

ODFOD. You win the award for stupidest comment I think I’ve ever seen on mn, well done! Idiot. I suppose you also loathe them working non stop to provide you with meat, veg, cereals, too? God, the wankers!

OP, you were out of order. I bollocked a group of runners for leaving the path and sprinting across the crop one year. Inconsiderate as hell. Farmers get utterly fed up of dog walkers insisting on cutting across rather than following paths. The one near us has sown the crop right up to the border to try to stop people doing this and has stopped replacing the stile that the shitty little boy racers on dirt bikes keep breaking down.

The idea of crops being fenced off so they don’t inconvenience the public just made me spit out my tea

There was a case a few years back where the landowner was so bloody fed up of the gen pub deviating from the public footpath that he fenced it off so people were obliged to walk on only the path. He fenced it off with huge spiky fencing as I recall.

@cowjumping if that was the case, which I’m sure it was with the way he spoke to me, then surely he’d want to do something about hence why I explained to him why I felt it necessary to do what I did. I didn’t want to damage his crops neither risk my dog being bitten. Unfortunately I chose my dog. I wasn’t going to risk going near the gate in case his dogs continued to become more aggressive.

And for those who think dogs barking and jumping at a fence continually when you can see they will be able to get to you shortly is not intimidating nor aggressive then I can see you’ve probably not been in a similar situation.

Also for those who think there are no farm dogs who will nip/ bite become aggressive when you go on their land which is also a footpath, then I hope you never have to learn the hard way

@maelstrop I can see this and too think it is out of order, I didn’t just willy nilly walk onto his land, I really felt scared of the dogs. I stopped and tried to see the farmer on numerous occasions but couldn’t.

Others have told me to shout so next time this is what I will do, but I feel that people don’t respect farmers much because most of my experiences with them have been negative.

YABU OP - there's no justification for what you did.

There's really little argument to be had here, but if you're a townie, I suppose it's going to take a while for you to understand.

The farmer has more right to be there than anyone using the footpath in my opinion. Border collies love the sound of their own voices especially when they're working. They were just telling the farmer that you and a strange dog were on the land and may have presented a threat to his livestock.
It would have been much nicer if he'd told you without shouting but you also really shouldn't leave the path as it is trespassing.

Farm dogs bark if someone is coming. This is pretty much in their job description - a non barky farm dog is pretty much a failure. They are there to guard against thieves and trespassers, alert farmers and depending on the breed, deal with livestock.

In future stay on the footpath. Talk to barking dogs as you get close to them - (my personal dialogue goes something along the lines of "hello diggy dog, well aren't you a lovely dog then, your doing a jolly good job there" etc etc) to reassure them that you are nice normal non thieving person. Don't try to approach them, or touch them, just go on your way. They'll know where you should and shouldn't be.

Keep a hold of your dog. Normally farm dogs are pretty well socialised and apart from possibly trying to herd you away, they shouldn't really give you any grief. (But do stay well away from all livestock because they are a different kettle of fish).

I’d like to assure everyone that I have learnt my lesson and won’t do it next time.

But I do hope at farmers can at least see that public footpaths are allowed to be used by anyone, including townies, who have no idea wether you’re dogs are safe enough.

Shouting at me made me feel no sympathy for you. And if you continue to ignore the fact not everyone is used to being around farm animals, as annoying as it is then, sooory but people will continue to feel the need to walk elsewhere.

Most people ignore signs but some don’t, I read signs like the one that told me to put my dog on a lead as I was entering your field. Please let silly city dwelling folk like me know that your dogs bark but don’t bite and maybe that will save your crops being stamped on.

Even if it only stops 1 in 1000 people surely for the price of a sign it is worth it?

You certainly wouldn’t have had to get angry at me.

You were intimidated by these dogs, so it was an exceptional circumstance, it’s not like you set out to have a jolly in his field. YWNBU.

that public footpaths are allowed to be used by anyone

Of course. But you didn't stay on the path, did you?

OP: WIBU?
Posters: YABU
OP: but, no, I can explain. IWBU but not really because I am speshul

OP, you won't win on here with this. I had a farmer firing a shotgun over my head for deviating slightly off the footpath. I did it to avoid a flock of resting ewes and their lambs but he didn't give me a chance or opportunity to explain this. I am a country person and like farmers but he was just completely out of order. Loads of people on the thread thought he was totally justified though.

This is why I don't walk on farmland, too many dogs (not just farm dogs but other off lead dogs bounding at you, running at you on country lanes etc). And cows. And rams. And geese. Too many potentially aggressive animals around farms!

We farm thousands of acres and here there are no public footpaths or bridleways through farm ground or even private property, and after reading this I'm very grateful for that.

FFS.

Being a farmer does NOT give someone the right to have their dogs in a public place, out of control and in this instance, the OP had reasonable apprehension of aggression/injury from those dogs.

It isn't a good idea to walk off the path and across crops, however to avoid the obstruction the farmer has placed on the path - ie, his uncontrolled and potentially aggressive dogs - i think you reasonably had no other option.

What the hell do mumsnetters want here - in one thread, its not reasonable for a dog to as much as LOOK at a member of the public and in the next, the MoP is supposed to approach and pass dogs that are giving her EVERY reason to suspect they may attack/bite, and only deal with it when it happens rather than take sensible evasive action.

Unfortunately some farmers are proper cunty fuckers and probably are so because theyve had so much shit off people who assume public footpath - come picnic on my land, use it as your dogs toilet and generally fuck things up - but that does not make this right at all.

YABU.. CF farmer IBU.

Report to the rights of way officers, that loose, aggressive dogs are blocking the path, routinely and whose dogs those are. They will deal with it. Ditto the dog warden too!

YANBU. I know of a farmer who deliberately put his vicious, slavering dogs in the yard where the public footpath goes through in the winter, because in his pig ignorant opinion people shouldn't be using the footpath in winter, it's bad enough he has to put up with it in summer.

Have come across bulls, padlocks and knotted rope being used to deter people from legitimately using public rights of way over farm land as well.

Some farmers are anti-social bullies who think they are above the law.

Argh, YANBU! Sorry typing too fast.

This was one farmers reaction to people straying off the footpath!

Being a farmer does NOT give someone the right to have their dogs in a public place

It's not a public place, it's private land that the public have 'right of way over'.

Much like many terraced houses have right of way over each other's gardens to put bins out. Doesn't stop your neighbour from letting their dog out into their garden, but the neighbours may choose not to walk through it whilst it's out.

The fact that the public now believe they have entirely unrestricted access rights across private farmland because there is a 'public footpath' (most of the time its actually a ROW not a PFP) is one of the main challenges to a modern family farm. It's a biodiversity and health and safety nightmare.

And for that matter 'right of way' means: you may pass through

It doesn't mean: let your dogs shit and run all over the field, come sledging over our crops, have a picnic under the oak tree at the far end of the field from the footpath, play football, let your kids ride their mini BMWs.

That's what public funded parks are for

*biosecurity not biodiversity. We quite like biodiversity!

It does, however, mean that you have a legal right to pass through that land, using the footpath, safely and unmolested. Whether the farmer likes it or not.

When I come across deliberate obstructions or dangers to the public right of way I report them. The time we were charged by a bull (while with our 2yo) I reported it to the police who came and took a statement.