To think that anti-vaxers may actually being onto something?

[viiz]

I don't have children myself yet but I don't know what I would chose when the time comes. Most of pro vax/anti vax threads turns nasty with people not even willing to try and look at things with others side perspective. Not willing to even consider points of view different than their own and that's a very silly approach. People believed a lot of things that turned out to be false over the years and centuries. Why not to doubt a little?

I was born in early '80s and not in UK. Myself, my siblings and friends were all vaccinated at the time. I don't even remember what I was vaccinated against but had to be pretty basic. Just a few jabs throughout my whole childhood/teen years and nothing 3in1 or 10in1 or whatever they'll bring next.

Now to the point. Reading through hundreds of threads it jumps at me how many children have neurological, behavioural or emotional disorders. No one else sees it really?? I don't know even one person from my childhood including friends, extended family , neighbours etc who would have ADS or ADHD or any other issues like that. I see their children to have it though.

AIBU to consider there could be a link here??

Please be gentle. I hope to have a discussion here. I don't disrespect anyone's views and I only ask to try and ask yourself 'what if'.

Actually, a lot of people are calling Alzheimer’s “type 3 diabetes”. That’s another direction of travel.

No. It's a proposed term for Alzheimer's caused by insulin resistance in the brain. It's something a substantive majority within the medical community are against.

Satsumaeater
In response to your post this morning. Certain types of chemo not only make a child immunocompromised but also WIPE OUT all previous vaccinations. So yes those children really do rely on herd immunity until they can be re vaccinated. I know this well as my child had acute myeloid leukaemia at 16 months old. The point that he went back to nursery (after being in near isolation for 6 months in hospital) was hugely worrying as was going to toddler groups, the supermarket in fact going out at all. I was worried sick of the frigging anti vaxxers out and about there and the risk to my child.
Also for what it’s worth my child is autistic too and no the vaccinations (he had to have them all done twice due to chemo wiping them out) did not cause the autism. He was born with it.
Also in response to all the comments re lifestyle choices, diet, lack of breastfeeding etc etc causing autism and cancer (as I’ve seen via various posters on the thread). Bullshit again. My child was breastfed, had a crazy healthy diet and still got cancer and is autistic. There were month old babies on the oncology ward who had only had breast milk and were born with cancer.

I need to learn to his these threads as they just make me so frustrated with the ignorance.

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Jemima to you. I cannot imagine how awful it must be to watch such a young child suffer like that.

Anyone curious about vaccines and autism should read up on Wakefield. It's horrifying stuff. He was a gastroenterologist for a start rather than a specialist in immunology. He reportedly had financial conflicts of interest and declined a controlled study into the link. One of the charges against him was that he had a "callous disregard for any distress or pain the children might suffer". The paper was withdrawn ultimately on the basis that it fraudulently misrepresented the data on which the hypothesis was based. All in all, it's pretty awful.

Not this bollocks again. 🙄

There's a WHO fact sheet on the MMF condition (cathmidston linked to above). The link is treated as credible to specific Al adjuvants (hydroxide & phosphate). I wonder if there are other Al adjuvants not clearly linked to MMF.

MMF seems to be a type of very rare muscle lesion linked to chonic fatigue... that almost only happens in France (some in USA, one presented in Portugal). Only first recognised in 1993 (or 1998). There is probably a seminal 1998 Lancet article. Affected patients "usually are middle-aged adults" .

For a condition that IS acknowledged to have a link to vaccines, & (specific) Al adjuvants, there sure are a lot of scientific articles about MMF. It's almost like Big Pharma isn't doing anything to hide the link. I'm not sure MMF casts light on the question of any rel. betw. autism & jabs (or lack there of).

About questioning science.
Do you know who doesn't question science they are not familiar with? Other scientists.
Like we ask statisticians for help. We don't tell them they might be wrong. We respect them as experts in their field.
Like doctors tend to avoid saying much about fields they're not familiar with.
Like architects will respect engineers and vice versa.

By all means read the research and keep a healthy scepticism, but it's ironic that those that "question" the most are the least educated about a subject.

Oh, closely followed by the experts themselves, but in different ways.

jemima

Thank you for your post - I have learnt something about cancer and treatment and immunity.

I am not an anti-vaxxer, my son is fully vaccinated (for his benefit, not anyone else's), but I am anti-compulsion.

Lweji speak for yourself
You know nothing about my background, life, interests, anything infact...other than the fact I disagree with you.
The reason I don’t vaccinate is because over the last 25 years + that I have been looking at this I have come to the conclusion that neither germ theory or virus theory actually adds up. And there are plenty of doctors and scientists that would agree...and obviously plenty that wouldn’t and plenty in between. Here is a link by Stefan !anka... I’ve linked him before and you lot will no doubt have a field day ‘debunking’ him but I find his research fascinating and compelling

wissenschafftplus.de/uploads/article/Dismantling-the-Virus-Theory.pdf?fbclid=IwAR0k78R-so1EN9CxYA_kEzOI3L3jtDFS2OnQWtpRoDlL5CLxfqubCVx1o3A

The immune system is incredibly complex and the notion that we can create health by injecting a cocktail of toxins that are known to cause serious damage and death is ridiculous to me.
I don’t get the flu vaccine ...obviously ....and my job means I’m around people coughing and spluttering all the time.. yet I never ‘catch’ it... or anything else for that matter.
You don’t agree and that’s fine, but my difference of opinion doesn’t make me stupid or too stupid to understand basic concepts... how arrogant ...

This ‘mainstream’ medical community... this the one that still promotes a high carb diet for type 2 diabetes? Or statins? And says saturated fat causes heart disease?

Metabolic syndrome isn’t recognised either

Mainstream medicine is a fairly backward place.

So... what causes Ebola, if not a virus?

What about chickenpox. Since it's not due to a virus. What does cause it?

My husband had pneumonia a while back. Went on for weeks before we realised. Since HIb didn't cause it, the 3 different types of antibiotics he got didn't help. So why did he get better, do you reckon?

Indeed ...dogmatic allegiance to outdated theories
The whole premise of which is to suppress symptoms ...symptoms that are an intelligent response by the body to a particular issue

2005 Article about Metabolic Syndrome in The Lancet . If that's "not recognised", what is "recognised"?

The immune system is incredibly complex and the notion that we can create health by injecting a cocktail of toxins that are known to cause serious damage and death is ridiculous to me

Vaccines don't 'create health' They prevent live viruses from causing illness and death by stimulating the immune system.

As for you never having caught flu, you are very lucky.....so far. As you age, the likelihood of catching flu will increase as your immune system is less robust.

Yeoldtrout... Ebola certainly isn’t following the profile of a ‘highly contagious virus’. It’s mainly concentrated in healthcare facilities actually.... and will undoubtedly have many cofactors associated in the people who are susceptible.

Getting an infectious illness is down to susceptiblity in my opinion. If you aren’t susceptible you won’t deveop it. Chickenpox is considered an elimination process is many circles. My child was exposed several times to children with chickenpox and developed nothing.

The pneumona would have been caused by bacteria breaking down tissue. You don’t catch pneumonia, you develop it.

Since (according to cathmidston's thesis) lack of susceptibiity can't be caused by antibodies to the germs, what does cause susceptibility? Why did my husband get pneumonia from HIb, I got a persistent cough, but my 14 month old son didn't even get even a little cough. You must know the answer. And why did his illness only get better after 3 types of antibiotic?

My Dad had polio, a cousin of my Mum died from measles. Someone they distantly knew from tetanus.

I don't know anyone who died from these as a child of the 1st mass vaccination generation. Do you?

Anti vaccers are playing with death.

Viiz - there aren't 'sides' in science. There's scientific consensus versus opinion. You're going to wind yourself up and go crazy if you're internet hunting for 'evidence.'

The best thing to do is go to the international bodies that lead on scientific consensus, like the UN. In this case your best bet would be looking at the World Health Organisation. You need to find the organisations that will have amalgamated the meta data of scientific work on the subjects. The NHS and BMA in the UK are also non profit motivated so likely to be less biased.

Avoid any websites that also have adverts for overpriced vitamin tablets or 'detox' pills, is my advice.

Ok..I’ll try and answer as succinctly as possible

Your husband wasn’t ‘contagious’ ...if he was, in the conventional sense, then your young son would have ‘caught’ it.. he didn’t. Neither did you, other than developing your persistent cough.. which I’m assuming you didn’t need 3 rounds of antibiotics to fix... and was probably coincidental to his pneumonia

There would have been a biological purpose to his pneumonia. Was he actually tested for HIB? Or was that just assumed?. I’m guessing it was assumed from where they tried out 3 different types of antibiotics on him? The antibiotics would have stopped the bacterial action and thus cleared the pneumonia.
If you are genuinely interested in what I think may have lead to his pneumonia you can Pm me with some more details ..I’d need to know which side, or whether it was diffuse bilateral pneumonia for instance?

Lanka is an idiot, an AIDS denier who thinks measles is psychosomatic.

f you are genuinely interested in what I think may have lead to his pneumonia you can Pm me with some more details ..I’d need to know which side, or whether it was diffuse bilateral pneumonia for instance?

Your medical qualifications are what exactly!

Cathmidston - genuine question, do you use homeopathy?

Bruffin.... I was asked a question.....
he’s not currently ill.... this isn’t a life and death situation... so I take it I’m ok to give an opinion. .... hmm