Neighbours dog has just attacked me and DD.

[katkat90]

Have had issues with them in the past

They are elderly, with two large breed dogs (think Great Danes?). They cannot control them. Honestly the amount of times I have seen them nearly pull them over in the street/simply pull out of their grasp and go bouncing off and jumping all over people is untrue.

Was walking back from the shop and saw them coming from a distance so I stepped to the side into another neighbours driveway and next thing I know- one of them had pulled out of its owners grasp and came bounding over and knocked DD (who is just about getting confident with her toddling) over.

It was over in seconds- by the time I put the break on the pram (was stood on a slopes drive so it would of ran off into the road) and went to grab DD she was already on the floor the dog barking at her- so I kicked it to get it away, and it bit my leg.

I was furious. Owner very embarrassed an apologetic but I’ve said enough is enough and I would be contacting the police and the RSPCA.

Heaven forbid it bounded on the pram and just decided to bite my 2 week old. It would of taken her head off no doubt.

V shaken and waiting for DH to get home to call the police and RSPCA.

I’ve also messaged his daughter on Facebook

Op get some pepper spray next time just in case.

Nooo not pepper spray! Leaves you open to legit legal shit. Deodorant people, carry deoderant. Legal but works a treat. Don't risk a firearms charge because some morons can't control their dogs

Nicola. What’s the ideal course of action? Well it would depend on the demeanour of the dog.

Is it barking, probably with its head up, tail up potentially wagging -in which case it’s just likely to be joining in the excitement. This dog is unlikely to pose any threat.The key here is to make the situation not exciting try and ignore the dog, try and calm the toddler, stand them up )don’t pick them up, otherwise you now have a really tall toddler shouting and waving its arms which could be seen as threatening by the dog.slowly move and block the dogs view of toddler, keep ignoring the dog, walk off slowly,

Dog barking maybe wimpering, ears flattened back tail down tightly, the dog is scared. Move slowly, keep quiet move away from the dog as quietly and gently as possible - do not pick up the child, do not make eye contact maybe lower your head. Keep out of the dogs space donothing to threaten it, do not touch it unlikely to have any issue

Dog barking head lowered lips drawn back over teeth possible looking in pounce mode. This dog is very likely more dangerous. But in all my years of dog ownership I’ve never seen this.Do nothing to trigger attack or let the dog perceive aggression. Move very slowly, get child to stand up, with assistance, again do not pick up, do not kick or otherwise touch the dog, keep arms low and close to body, summon owner if available - you are trying to buy time. Scan area for place of safety or potentially weapon. Depends on size of dog really. If you can see that the dog is reacting to something stop it or reduce it. Some dogs are dangerous but luckily this is very very rare. Do not run or make sudden movements try and summon help

This must have been awful for you op. Hope your daughter has recovered and is none the worse for what must have been a very scary incident.
I can understand why you kicked out at this dog as it must have been very frightening. It is fine for pps to say you did the wrong thing, we all might have done things differently in hindsight.
However, I also don’t think the dogs were to blame, it is the owners who are at fault, and as such dogs should not be destroyed. The owners should have to give up their dogs to someone who can control them to avoid anything like this happening again.
Hope you both recover and get over this soon. 💐

Useless owners like those in the OP are the reason trips to the local park with my toddler make me anxious at times.

I don't think kicking the dog was the right thing to do in these circumstances for reasons already stated, but I do completely understand the knee jerk reaction out of fear that her DD would be harmed. The perfectly rational fear in the scenario would've been magnified by the fact the OP was just two weeks postpartum and had her newborn with her also.

I'd like to hope I wouldn't react in the same way should this ever happen to me but I couldn't guarantee it unfortunately.

Aw that's lovely budgie. Except in your second scenario you are leaving your terrified, vulnerable toddler at the feet of a dog you are worried may attack. Better hope that child doesnt do anything to upset it eh? Like scream, or move.

@NicolaStart could you please quote exactly where I have blamed the OP?

I said the dog only bit after it was kicked. I didn’t blame the OP for kicking.

Are you perhaps exaggerating to fit your own agenda?

I think there are a lot of people on here who are not willing to listen to any advice. There have been numerous bit of advice from people trying to inform people who don’t know what to generally do in such a situation. Everyone had said the owners were in the wrong so the op was in a situation. Everyone has tried to help for future reference. But the mob of dog haters don’t want to educate themselves as in one breath it shouldn’t happen and in another breath it happens all the time.

25% of adults in the uk own a dog, it is likely you will meet them. Like anything that shouldn’t happen but could you educate yourself on how to deal with. But there seem a string of people on this thread who would love to see any opportunity to hurt a dog, yes let’s blind a dog who is no threat by spraying pepper spray cos that would really calm down the situation.

This happened to DH, elderly neighbours dog 'oh, he wouldn't hurt a fly!' sank it's teeth into DH's calf.

He did report it to police, who dealt very well with the whole situation.

You would be right to report it and let them sort it out.

Not a dog hater here. Reactive dog owner at several points. Can still see flaws in your advice. Including the whole thing of fighting instinct to take seconds to read a dog's behaviour which could result in seconds lost to protect your child if you're wrong.

This thread is absolutely batshit. Pepper spraying a dog for being excitable? Really?

Owners - clearly appalling owners and shouldn't be keeping dogs, particularly not large ones they don't have the strength to hold onto. They are entirely at fault for the dog being out of control (and by that I mean not responding to recall/commands or kept on a lead) and are part of the reason there should be some sort of licensing/regulation on who can own dogs, so this sort of thing doesn't happen.

Dogs - don't sound like they've been aggressive, just poorly trained and reactive to being booted which is unfortunate but understandable. Being bouncy and excitable isn't an 'attack'. Grabbing a leg that has just swiped at you isn't an 'attack' either. An attack would be charging at you and biting with the intent to actually hurt. A ripped tracksuit bottom and no puncture isn't a bite. It's less damage than is done by a 9 week old puppy with stupidly sharp teeth learning bite inhibition. It's unpleasant and could be very frightening, but it was a restraining grab with pointy teeth (that should not have happened) not a bite intended to inflict injury. Meaning the dog actively was not trying to harm Op, just stop her from kicking it again. It was a warning before a bite. Do they deserve to be put down? Absolutely not. They need to be re-homed with people that actually care about raising well trained, well adjusted dogs that are under control, because right now they sound like they're a complete nuisance and are at risk of seriously hurting someone, even if it's just due to knocking them over or running in front of a car rather than biting them.

Op - reacted defensively to a massive dog barking at her small child that had just been knocked over. Is kicking a dog that's barking a sensible thing to do? Probably not, but we all react on different ways and if you aren't experienced with dogs it's not always obvious what is playful/excitement and what is aggression. In reality the kick probably did exacerbate the situation, but that's the benefit of hindsight and not reacting to a stressful situation. She was defending her child not thinking of the implications of dog psychology and there's probably very few people that would be totally clear headed in a situation like that. However, highlighting that kicking a dog may cause it to bite you isn't victim blaming, it's pointing out that hurting an animal will cause it to react instinctively and unpredictably, and that doesn't mean the animal is automatically vicious. The blame is still with the owners but it would have been Op or heaven forbid, Op's child, dealing with an injury if the dog had bitten hard so if there's a way to mitigate that as the person on the receiving end why would you not want to know it just in case?

In an ideal world all dog owners would be responsible but clearly they are not. In the same world, other people wouldn't have to learn to deal with dogs because they would be under control, but given that they aren't and dogs are such a normal part day to day life it doesn't hurt to learn a little about them so you don't inadvertently worsen a situation that is caused by a terrible owner. Because not all owners can be trusted. If a dog came after me the situation would be the owner's fault for not having their dog under control, but if there's a choice between walking away unharmed or with a chunk taken out of my leg I know what I'd prefer, and the moral high ground isn't going to stop the latter from happening.

I was walking down a street a couple of years ago when an off-leash staffie ran up at me, jumped up at me and tried to bite my face. It had a second attempt and took a bite of my arm, then my leg, before it ran off. Not my first random dog bite either.

Off leash and out of control dogs are a menace. Sorry you've been through this OP. By all means have a read up on what to do, but truth be told when there are irresponsible dog owners around, no one is safe.

It's the job of any parent to protect their child and I for one and one that has just lost my 13 yr old staffie that was intimidated by an escaped Great Dane that was uncontrollable by his and his mates owners. I would do anything to protect my child so you where right in your actions. Please phone police and report them for having dogs out of control as these dogs deserve a better and more specialist home.

Obviously OP shouldn't have kicked the dog as it was likely to escalate the situation - would have been better to remove DD or get between the dogs and DD. It was an understandable gut reaction in what seemed like a threatening situation (which was caused by the owners poor handling of their dog). To be fair the dogs sound badly trained and excitable rather than vicious or excessively dangerous but I wouldn't be taking any chances. The owners obviously can't cope with the dogs and it's potential dangerous even if the dogs aren't aggressive .(Large dogs knocking people over, running into the road etc).

There are just too many dogs we need to restrict the numbers, also the breeds and the number of pets per household
for one thing it would get rid of all the shit everywhere

Belinda, where’s the downside in pepperspraying or using deodorant or chilli powder on a dog? It stops them focusing on you and yours as a target.
If the dog doesn’t want to be kicked again, why doesn’t it run away?
Dog ownership rules are getting more restrictive over the years, certainly since the 60s. There will come a time when they will all have to be on short leads and muzzled in public spaces and only allowed freedom on private land or dog parks. And mandatory insurance for damages.

Owning a dog should be a privilege not a right
you should have to demonstrate that you are able to provide a proper environment for the animal

You did the right thing both in reporting and protecting your children. I'd kick out too with a toddler and a newborn, you did nothing wrong. I wouldn't have waited around to work out the demeanour of the dog, nope get that dog the hell away!

I hope you and your toddler are ok.

That must have been a very scary experience OP. Hope you and your little girl are recovering from the shock.

The thing that strikes me about MN threads where posters put the words "dog" and "attacked" usually ends up being nothing of the sort. This is why dog owners become defensive. It seems people who don't have experience of owning a dog or, even worse, those who blatantly hate dogs seem to consider any experience regarding a dog as a dog "attack".

We see it here all the time.... "I was walking with my children in the park and suddenly this dog run over and attacked my child". On further reading it turns out that mum and children were walking in the park and a young dog run over to them and got jumpy, with excitement. It's not ideal and I'm the first to say dogs should be always kept under control whether verbally (like mine if off lead) or if not trained dogs should be kept on lead around people and other dogs. This is perfectly normal behaviour for a young dog who has not yet mastered - or has not been taught - to ignore others. It is definately not an "Attack"! By people using the word attack for any misdemeanor it minimises the meaning and intensity of the word.

In this scenario OP says "Neighbours dog has just attacked me and DD". I opened this thread half expecting the OP and her DD to have been hospitalised, bleeding and stitched up after being attacked by some snarling, biting, lip curling, teeth showing, aggressive dog.

Turns out dog got free from owner. Spots OP and runs over to her, expecting to be petted. Dog oblivious of its size/strength managed to knock a barely walking toddler over. Dog barked in excitement, OP didn't know what to do so lashed out. Dogs instinct is to catch something, heading towards his face, in his mouth. OP claimed to be bitten, but no broken skin. So obviously hasn't been bitten.

Cue dog haters calling for 'dangerously out of control dog' to be put down. It's not the dogs fault. It's not OP's fault - I totally get that she was scared for herself and her children, as she obviously cannot read dog language. The person at fault is the dogs owner.

Did you call the police OP? How are they going to handle it?

Exactly, the reaction to a kick that I would expect from a well trained dog is it at yelps and runs away

A well trained dog will always defer to a human, it wouldn't attack unless commanded to do so by its owner

this dog took matters into its own hands it decided to punish the human who kicked it, as I said a well trained dog would only ever attack if commanded to do so by its owner

a well trained dog accepts it's position as subordinate to all humans and it does not feel entitled to punish a human
ever
The larger the dog breed the greater the damage it can potentially do(broadly speaking)
therefor the larger the breed the greater the need for it to be properly trained

Otherwise it is nothing but an out of control predator

Blue you might not consider it an attack but you can bet your sweet ass the police will

Of course you could argue that the police don't know what they're talking about when it comes to dogs
given that the police force contains highly skilled and highly trained dog handlers I don't think they'd be too impressed with that attitude

No, the dog did not attack you. You've massively over reacted to a playful dog accidentally knocking over your not fully steady walking toddler and YOU got aggresive and kicked it! Totally deserved to get bit under those circumstances, poor dog.

Where’s the downside in pepperspraying a dog???? Jesus wept! Are you the sort tgat puts poisoned meat down for dogs! So you advocate animal cruelty. Nice! And people are worried about aggressive dogs? Presumably you would do the same to a bunch of teenage lads in the park you perceived to be threatening?? Or maybe the jogger who runs up behind you making you jump?

For the most part, I like dogs as I do most animals, but they are hugely dangerous. We need to bring back the dog license. Every dog owner should be required to attend training with each new dog they have. Insurance should be mandatory and something closer to strict liability brought in for most dog bite injuries.