To wish universities wouldn’t give out so many unconditional offers?

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Dd is in Year 13 and applying to university.

She’s reasonably bright but has never been super-academic or interested in school. She has decent but not stellar predicted grades and ok GCSEs. She probably could have done better if she’d worked harder.

She struggled to decide what course to apply for at university (she’s never been particularly devoted to any of her subjects - she’s not someone who would go away and do extra reading) but eventually settled on modern languages.

She sent off her application at the end of October - to unis along the lines of Birmingham, Nottingham, Sheffield etc.

Within a month she had heard back from all 5, with four making her unconditional-if-firm offers and one (probably the highest scoring in league tables of the 5) offering her a place for AAA or BBB if firmed.

I’m quite concerned that without the pressure of needing to get the grades to get her place, she isn’t going to have any great motivation to try in her A-levels this summer. She already didn’t do much work over the Christmas holiday.

AIBU for wishing universities would get rid of these bribing ‘unconditional-if-firm’ offers? If they need to get bums on seats, could they not just be lenient on Results Day and let in students who miss their offers?

I also don’t really understand why they’d be happy to take her even if she bombed in her A-levels - as long as they were her firm choice - but they might end up refusing to take her if it was her insurance choice and she only missed the offer by one grade. If they’re so keen on her application that they want her whatever her A-levels then why doesn’t that hold true if they’re her insurance?

Things in Scotland are much different- students are offered places on actual results not predicted.
They take the bulk of their exams required for University in their penultimate year at school- a whole year before they start University.

But my understanding is that many students then coast and get poor grades in their advanced highers.

The same report also states that in 2018 the applicants predicted BBC were the most likely to receive unconditional offers

Surely wether you get an unconditional offer is directly proportionate to the difference between an applicants predicted v entry requirements?

So for instance a candidate is predicted AAA but applies For a courseasking for ABB or as in UCAS’s example, predicted BBC but applies for a course requiring BCC. Both are more likely to receive ‘unconditionals’, than perhaps their counterpart who trades upward or equivalent to their grades.

Can’t think of any special reason other than that as to why anyonepredicted BBC would be more likely to get an unconditional. Unless in around about way they’re trying to imply that someone predicted BBC is more likely to apply to a ‘Lower tiered’ Uni which is then more likely to be desperate for bums on seat?

I suspect this will become another barrier to social mobility if students are picking institutions on the basis of having an unconditional rather than aiming for the best university they can (or the best one for them). If students slack off at a-level because of the unconditional, it’ll affect their graduate job prospects. I don’t run a grad scheme but take on grads each year and I look at a-levels and also sometimes GCSEs as a way to differentiate. When you’re getting hundreds of applications for a few places you become ruthless. It does young people a disservice to say employers only care about your last qualification.

Shimy they don't give the reasons why, but I suspect it is a bit of both.

Last year DD changed her mind about her university course, so we looked in clearing. None of the higher rank universities had her course in clearing. Interestingly some of the lower rank universities were still advertising courses in clearing after the universties had gone back. So I do think their is quite a large element of bums on seats for the less popular universities.

Bit poor of them to give a blanket statement like that without giving any reason behind it. It would be interesting to know though, all those getting unconditionals, what were their predicted grades v what were the entry requirements for the course they applied for, purely out of interest to see if there is any correlation somehow.

I suspect that they don't know the reasons yet as they haven't conducted enough research. The report is linked to in an earlier post on here by FlipF

I was astonished to see looking at course for d's last night that one uni still offering last year's course so either still places or drop outs

Sons careers teacher was telling son not to aim too high. He then picked two uni's with her that A are low in the ratings. One facing bankruptcy. And B a nightmare distance, travel wise road and train wise. We were steaming

justasking no university would take people this late in the academic year. They may also do a January start? Or someone hasn’t updated the web page!

Also, careers advisers will be advising your son based in predicted grades and in an impartial manner. They would have suggested appropriate courses based on these and his stated interests. Unless you were in the meeting with your son you only have his version of events ......as an ex-careers Adviser I speak form experience on this!

*from

The predictive nature and self confidence will skewer any research. DS1 did AS last year his AABB match is predictive grades of AAB. He has an unconditional from his first choice but does not feel the pressure in taking the offer. If, however he had predicted grades that were higher than his end of year exams I could easily imagine him accepting a third or lower choice in case the predictive grades are just too out of his reach. In his group of friends (mainly at different sixth forms) it is those who didn’t do well at last years exams taking the unconditional offers. What is hard to know is if the do not get the predictive grades is it because they already have a place or were they never on course to anyway.

justasking - Are his predicted grades in line with those entry requirements though? Is there a more highly rated uni where they are asking for similar grades? i think sometimes, schools are guilty of wanting to just ‘play it safe’, and manage expectations. One person’s ambition is another person’s aiming too high.

Some of you might be interested in this re an article in The Times this morning:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/higher_education/3478841-lecturers-want-pupils-to-apply-after-a-levels

• arising because of concern over conditional offers.

We are looking at this in our uni atm. For us it is all about social mobility. Persuading students from disadvantaged backgrounds to sign up with us instead of somewhere else offering lower entry grades.

My eldest DS got 5 offers, all of them conditional, 2 yrs ago and is at Southampton. My youngest has just had 2 conditional and one unconditional to start in 2019.

He knows the unconditional isn't a licence to slack off and that he still needs to aim for his grades but he certainly feels less pressure even though his first choice is a conditional offer. His brother sails through exams with little effort whereas he puts way more effort in and achieves lower grades. His course is lots of practical though.

The fact is that there are fewer people applying for uni, and fewer 18 yr olds in the next couple of years anyway. University's are struggling to put bums on seats and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future. There are rumours of staff cuts and closures. You can't really blame them for using whatever means to ensure their continued success.

Hate this conditional offer thing. My SIL is in her second year of uni and applied for a few unis got an unconditional offer from a pretty crappy uni for her course but because it was guaranteed she took it.

She's on a sandwich course with a gap year for work and now is really struggling to find a placement. I don't have the heart to tell her it's because she's fighting the students from the better universities that are better known for her course.

Ipchill- You make a very good pointthere with reference to finding a Placement! I know this from personal experience. Couldn’t get aplacement and ended up doing 3yrsfull time,infact overhalf of us couldn’t get a placement. I don’t want that to happen to DS so have guided him chosing his Unis VERY carefully.

Don't you mean unconditional Ipchill?

"I think sometimes, schools are guilty of wanting to just ‘play it safe’, and manage expectations."

DD's school didn't think like this. They encourage the students to aim as high as they can. They like to boast that loads of students get places in RG universities.

They do unconditional offers now based on possible grades? What if they don't get those grades? They still get the place?

That doesn't make sense to me. I went to uni just over 10 years ago and I got a conditional offer to a few unis based on if I got my grades predicted. If I didn't, I didn't get in. I got over the predicted thankfully and chose the best uni out of the lot.

Doing unconditional based on nothing seems pointless. You could just fail everything and still get in.

Lonicera - Yes definitely not all schools, I should’ve said “some”. We’ve had Russell Group hammered into our ears at ds’s school from day one infact Oxbridge in particular. But there are some schools, perhaps schools in deprived areas (I don’t know if justasking’s school fall’s intothe category), where the schools almost thinkthey’re doing the students a favour by setting their expectations .

They do unconditional offers now based on possible grades? What if they don't get those grades? They still get the place?

Yep - that’s why they’re called unconditional... no conditions

The unconditional offers may have made a bit more sense when students were still doing AS levels as it was easier to tell which students were more capable. Now that they are going on GCSEs and predictions it seems ludicrous.

It's getting increasingly common for people to do a masters with a 2.2 or even a third these days.

I haven't RTFT but what subjects are these?

I grew up in the US and all university offers are unconditional. Every university entrance exam is taken by Nov/Dec of the year before the student wants to enter so their coursework and marks up until that point are assessed. Offers are given in April. The reason students don't slack off between Dec and Apr is that they could get accepted onto the waitlist of their favourite university, and if they've shown consistent or improved performance in that period it can move them up the list. My SIL got into her preferred university because she was originally on the waitlist but then smashed some of her final exams.

One of my cousins who grew up in the UK had told everyone she was going to LSE so I was confused when she ended up at Bristol. That's when I learned what conditional offers were and it seems horrifying to me!

Sorry I'm totally missing the point...just a different perspective.