To think we should forgive old people their transgressions?

[lboogy]

Reading a lot of threads here about PILs and parents and how irritating they can be has made me think about forgiveness generally.

Obviously each circumstance is different but for gripes like getting bad presents, being ignored, having rude off the cuff things said should we be more forgiving in the knowledge that parents & in laws may not be around for much longer and wouldn't it be better to ignore/turn the other cheek. After all when we get to that age and much of our support system has died we'd need our remaining family to be compassionate /forgiving to us.

Sorry for your losses Fuzzy

Interestingly, my grandmother was a vile woman and horrible to my mother, but became lovely after she developed dementia.

No and I find I'm getting fed up with how often posters are told to ignore/turn the other cheek/ don't rock the boat/bite your tongue/just get over it when they complain about parents or PILs.

There's a big difference between my mum buying me a gift that isn't particularly to my taste but knowing she genuinely tried, and someone's mum or Mil using a 'gift' to make a dig or send a passive aggressive message. It's often very clear that the so called petty issue a poster is complaining about isn't just about the gift or the rude comment, rather it's part of a long list of crap they're expected to put up with. The person they're complaining about may be 75 now but what if they've been doing it for 25 years?

IMO society already sends very strong messages to women that as wives and/or mothers we should prioritise everyone else, that it's our job to maintain relationships and family harmony and 'Aw but their elderly, they won't be around for ever' is just another justification for telling women they should suck it up.

I do realise Op that you haven't specifically said 'women should' but you're suggesting this on a predominantly female site and clearly in response to the many threads where posters have expressed their annoyance and frustration after the festive period spent with parents and PILs.

No

Speaking as someone approaching their 70s, I completely disagree. Unless someone has dementia there's no excuse for bad behaviour.

I find the assumption on MN that anyone who is old enough to have an adult child and grandchildren must be in their dotage and therefore either suffering dementia or simply too old to understand modern ways. Which is nonsense. Someone posting on here could easily be in their 20's and be complaining about parents or PILs in only their 40's.
And I know people in their 60's, 70's and even 80's who have open and tolerant outlooks. Age is not an excuse for misogyny or homophobia.

When it's deliberate rude behaviour that continues, I don't see why ignore it. And many write here after biting their lip, enduring, trying to understand. In my opinion, it's healthy to talk about your feelings.

I would give anyone a second, third chance. None of us are perfect, however the continuous rudeness from some adults in my life is unacceptable. We raise our children to be kind, polite and well behaved so I don’t think should accept poor behaviour from the older generations. If we do we are condoning it which is a poor example.

A majority of the pil threads are about pil who are around 60 - this is not the same as old aged people who are rude and cantankerous and possibly not of sound mind in their late 80's - these are people of sound mind if working age or early retirement!

As somone mixed race, no I wont forgive my racist grandad just because he is old. The favouritism showed to my white cousins is favouritism at any age. It doesnt feel less worse because he is in his 90s.

You are correct, we forgive the young so much and make excuses for them constantly, yet aging is a slow process that effects us all differently and for this reason we seem to be intolerant of it. The lucky of us will get old and we have no idea what’s ahead, let’s embrace it and give our elders the respect they deserve

How old are you talking op? My mum is only just 60 and after years of putting up with low level rudeness and general bad attitude, I’m now fed up of her doing it and have cut down contact with her. I’ve spent more time with her over the festive period and it’s reminded me completely why I stopped spending so much time with her.
Eg having tea out last week, generally well behaved child at next table squeals. My Mum says very loudly (so they could hear) how rude it is for children to be so disruptive and noisy at the table. I call her up on it and tell her to stop being so rude. Young child’s mother starts having a go at me, (thinking it was me with the bad attitude) which I just took to prevent a bigger scene and my mother just sits there quietly saying nothing.

Should I just forgive my mum of this and forget it. Or should I be frustrated about her lack of understanding to other people and not really want to go out for a meal with her again?
My grandmother on the other hand has dementia and I know it’s her illness that makes her the way she is. My mum has no excuse except a bad attitude.

My 92year old Nan was brought up in a very different world. I do forgive a lot of her beliefs and opinions as they have been indoctrinated in her from a very young age. She doesn't have a nasty bone in her body, just a different world.

A neighbour of mine is 97 and up until about 6 months ago was an absolute delight to spend time with - kind, thoughtful, interesting.

Now he is in poorer health and has just had enough. He thinks and speaks negatively and really doesn't want to be around any more. He is unpleasant and rude. I'm more than happy to cut the poor guy some slack.

Much less inclined to cut my FIL some slack. He has always been a bastard and now he's an old and slightly confused bastard. He can fuck right off as far as I'm concerned.

No.

I generally find people who are nobs in older age were always nobs through out their lives. I just wish they wouldn't all start voting Tory, it's so bloody predictable.

No. My mother has always been a cold heartless sadistic bitch. The fact that she's 98 and in a nursing home now hasn't changed that one bit according to the things the nurses tell me. She's nasty to them too. I hate her and I always will.

Disagree completely.

I was always taught to respect and be kind to elders.

It took me a long while to realise that cruel and nasty young people grow old too. And they don't change - their faces just look like those we associate with vulnerable and neglected. Not cruel and nasty. But nothing will have changed.

My mother could be a bit of a dose when she was old - she was quite demanding and a bit self-centered. My sister and I certainly needed to vent a bit to each other. But we didn't mind caring for her at all because she had been a truly loving, kind, imaginative and funny mother and grandmother and even as a slightly querulous self-centered old person could still make you laugh and would always say how much she loved us and how wonderful we were.

After all when we get to that age and much of our support system has died we'd need our remaining family to be compassionate /forgiving to us.

I live my life based on the idea that I won't need anyone to forgive me in order to care for me. Instead I hope that my children and grandchildren (and indeed my friends and extended family) will like me and not need to forgive me for some shit I dealt them. How about not dealing the shit in the first place?

My mum arrived today for the second period of time she will be spending with us over Christmas/New Year. I offered her wine with dinner...she wanted white. I gave her some perfectly respectable semillon chardonnay (Hardy's Stamp Aussie wine), and she complained that it wasn't a dryer sauvignon blanc. She'll get water tomorrow.

I used to put up with the little PA swipes and comments. Not any more. We pick her up for Christmas every year (from a different country) and take her back. We pay for the overnight accommodation, all the food and petrol involved in her not wanting to get on a Eurostar, and we don't get a thanks normally. My dh is sick of being treated as her meal ticket.

It will come to a head next year when we move back to the UK and are 15 minutes from her. She will expect us to do all sorts of things for her, and despite my saying that neither of us are intending to be her bitch, she doesn't realise that we mean it. Dh is retiring, and I hope to go back to work. We have plans of our own that do not involve running around after her.

Meant to add, I can tell myself til I'm blue in the face that she is this way as she's been on her own too long, post divorce, and we saw the same thing with my paternal gm...but the patience is beginning to wear thin at times.

Not a chance.
Age should bring wisdom and self awareness and it’s not an excuse for bad behaviour.

I can see that it’s hard to change opinions of things you’ve been brought up with, but as the world has changed so much, older people have had time to adjust.

My dad is 70 and the other day, said to DC 10yo, Eeeny Meeny Miney Moe, catch a N**r by its toe.

I immediately said, “dad, that is not an acceptable word to use now, and we do not ever say it and especially not in front of DC”. He got arsy with me, saying I was being ridiculous, but if DC repeated it innocently at school they would be in so much trouble!.

He may be 70 but he does know it’s not an acceptable word now! He’s just a domineering selfish man and always has been. He was annoyed that I called him on it, how dare I?!

I have spent Christmas cutting my mil an enormous amount of slack because unlike some of the elderly people mentioned she has not always been like this.
Sadly I have reached my limit. Me and my kids are still human and I don't appreciate her telling ds2 as he was hanging up his stocking that her parents were much kinder than me and dh because she used to get an entire pillowcase of toys from Father Christmas instead of just a little stocking. And I also don't like being told my clothes look terrible. It made me cry.
I stayed kind and polite throughout and didn't tell her to fuck off home but I am not entirely sure I shouldn't have done.

No it’s not an excuse. My mil has a partner who people have been making this excuse for since he was in his 60’s. Oh that’s just the way he is they will say. But over the years he had been plain nasty and has made it abundantly clear through so called ‘jokes’ and leg pulling that he does not like me. In the end he went too far when he started insulting me infront of my children so I after years of tollerating his bullshit I finally said something and have cut him out.