Why the the leavers so scared of a second vote?

[StrumALum]

I don't get it.

The leavers were fed some lies, that much is obvious.

What I don't get though is that if the leavers are so sure of themselves then why are they so worried about a second vote? If it's 'the will of the people' then it will be the same outcome anyway.

Or are they panicking because now the lies (like the bus) have been exposed, people are now more clued up and they were relying on people not being clued up to get the vote through in the first place?

The aren't contentious. Physical border infrastructure is. A camera is bit different from a sandwich board offering currency exchange

So differences in VAT, excise, legal, & currency aren't contentious but when you add customs to that list its contentious?

Its not a case of a sandwich board or a camera, the cameras are already there, so nothing physical actually changes. Are you saying the GFA will be destroyed because a bit of software calculates a business is due to pay any tariffs?

Are you saying the GFA will be destroyed because a bit of software calculates a business is due to pay any tariffs?

There is no technological solution currently in place. Border infrastructure has already been explained to you.

It isn't the OP's job to set out the 'facts'. That is the government's job

This made me giggle.

But in every other thread leavers are piled on because they didn't think through every possible thing before voting brexit
"Well what's your solution to Northern Ireland? Didn't you think that through before you voted" smug face
"what about the shortage of insulin? Didn't you think of that before you voted?!" bigger smug face

So it's the Governments job to sort shit out for remainers, but leavers must know everything

Double standards much?

The DUP want full regulatory alignment

The DUP agree with the CTA, I have no idea what you are arguing about.

FFS stop bloody whinging just because you didn't get the answer you wanted. I voted leave and full well knew what I was voting for. I didn't believe the £XXX for the NHS, I did my own research and STILL voted leave.

Don't be so ignorant to think people who voted leave didn't know what they were voting for.

Look at other EU land borders and the infrastructure required and in use - if there were suitable tech solutions, those clever Swedes would be using them.

why do you think is NI going to be any different?

Obv when a FTA with a strong CU element is negotiated then of course, its not needed BUT leavers don't want that do they.

There is no technological solution currently in place. Border infrastructure has already been explained to you

And has also been explained there is no reason what it couldn't be put in place without a hard border. But you are never going to admit that as you need it as an excuse to keep us in the EU.

The DUP agree with the CTA, I have no idea what you are arguing about.

Because you cannot comprehend the unique status of the NI border.

And has also been explained there is no reason what it couldn't be put in place without a hard border. But you are never going to admit that as you need it as an excuse to keep us in the EU.

Can you show me an example of another country that uses tech to carry out customs checks at borders without any physical infrasture?

There are loads of reasons why technology can't be used on the NI / RoI boarder.

Firstly, technology of that complexity does not exist.

@bellinisurge

I absolutely don’t want a ‘no deal’ brexit, but that is an option... You may as well not have a referendum if that’s not an option.... And also, much as I think a ‘no deal’ brexit would be bad, the undemocratic society you seem to be advocating would be worse.... Who are you to decide what people should or should not be voting on? Should we only vote on matters that have your and your likeminded friends’ seal of approval first? It’s this arrogance by the liberal elite that played a large part in the ‘leave’ vote, and also Trump’s election in the US. Much as I voted remain, and abhor Trump, your haughty attitude perversely facilitates that which hate.

FFS stop bloody whinging just because you didn't get the answer you wanted.

Nothing stopped leavers whinging for decades after the last referendum. Apparently they can dish it out but can't take it.

Which you hate

No, neo liberalism is an unfortunate word for those who seek to defend the last 40 years of social and economic decline in the UK.

And you being pro EU shows you have very little understanding of the term...

The assessment reports are one of many warnings given by various sectors and individuals on Brexit. Businesses are already leaving a can see that with my own eyes. Brexit is no workers revolution.

So we have reverted back to personal anecdotes, the reports which you apparently read, which was done by various sectors still in worst case scenario put us with a -0.5% growth YOY, I suspect you haven't really read the reports in any detail, or want to listen to them but have read a Guardian headline and try an appeal to authority.

MaisyPops

Just going to put this

You mean like the Leave tossers did after 1975 ?

here to show that the "sensible, nuanced, open debate with a certain subtype" is balanced with remainders as well.

Can you show me an example of another country that uses tech to carry out customs checks at borders without any physical infrasture?
As already explained the current border already has cameras.

technology of that complexity does not exist
I have heard experts explain it is possible, I have not heard any expert explain what specific bit of the technology is impossible. All you ever hear is remainers/politicians stuttering, but, but, but... its to hard we have to ignore leavers and stay in the EU.

Regarding cameras at the border, perhaps someone could explain how it would work... just saying ‘we have the technology for it’ doesn’t really cut it as answer, as surely technology is only part of the solution.

And you being pro EU shows you have very little understanding of the term...

Nope, I just understand that throwing the baby out with the bathwater i.e. Brexit isnt the best way to challenge economic inequalities..

put us with a -0.5% growth YOY,

To clarify, that should be -0.5% from growth yoy, it will cost us 11bn by 2030, that is including all the 100,000, 50,000 thousands of job loses in the banking sector.

Personal anecdata is admissible as I can easily cite a massive investment of job growth in the IT sector.

@Walkingdeadfangirl - I sat through the HoC select committee hearing on this. Even the lightest touch smart border requires some kind of physical infrastructure.

If it exists please tell us where.

Just saying "yes it does" does not make it true.

This is a complex, intricate boarder.

As already explained the current border already has cameras.

Which will not cut it as checks post Brexit.

As already explained the current border already has cameras

Along each of the 300 odd border crossings? Aye right...

Surely we just need a referendum choice between May’s deal and remaining in the EU? What’s so constitutionallly challenging or undemocratic about that?

If May’s deal wins, then we leave, and we simply slink away a bit smaller, more insignificant, humiliated, voiceless, pound weaker etc but we will have left the EU - job done.

The Tories will be voted out of office on a permanent basis and any young scientists or entrepreneurs will go through university with a view to leaving the UK as soon as possible - not unlike some of the challenger Eastern European states in the 2000s.

History never stays still - we had it very good for an uncharacteristically long time. It would just be our time to slide into long term decline. Sad but hardly undemocratic.

Nope, I just understand that throwing the baby out with the bathwater i.e. Brexit isnt the best way to challenge economic inequalities..

No you don't, otherwise you would not have cited GDP growth and railed against it as you did during the last GE, you are just as ill informed as the brexiteers you rail against.