AIBU to ask what you think poverty is?

[Rayn]

In a way this follows on from the 'did you
Grow up poor' thread. Just been on the news that on average a third of all children in my region are in poverty. When I think about the children in my son's class it makes me sad. I can think of one or two maybe but a third??

I just wondered what is classed as poverty in today's world in the uk.
Food, clothes, the basics?

What about the children in your son's class makes you sad?

Having a single basic candle lighting the room because there is no money for a replacement light bulb.

Good description of what it means here

"A child is said to be living in poverty when they are living in a family with an income below 60% of the UK's average after adjusting for family size."

www.childrenssociety.org.uk/what-we-do/our-work/ending-child-poverty/what-is-child-poverty

I've never felt that's a "good" description tbh

Homeless, no food etc.

Going to school in shoes that are too small, having food that is cheap not nutricious. Knowing you can't have what others take for granted and feeling shame and embarrassment. Constantly worrying about how you will get through the week. Always feeling anxious and inadequate. A home that is cold, dark, insecure and dirty, and knowing that the next thing to break can't be fixed.

Its all relative. A child can live with two parents who earn good wages but still be living on the breadline as the parents are in debt and/or live beyond their means.

Being homeless

Yeah I don’t think that’s a great measurement either- we have a fairly low income (partner works 24 hours a week minimum wage, I’m on maternity leave from a minimum wage job) and while we’re obviously not well off, I would never say we’re close to poverty. Poverty is not being able to provide the basics- heat, food, shelter.

It's all relative, but to me, poor means not having enough money for food, heating, clothes and hot water. Struggling to pay rent and council tax. Not being able to pay for internet access or phone. Never being able to go on holiday or for days out. No money for Christmas or birthdays.

A lot of children are now deprived in a different way. Time related poverty. Their parent/s are time poor. They tend to be the children from higher income brackets.

the problem is that absolute poverty and relative poverty are completely different things and it serves neither of the definitions that the same word is used for both. I consider poverty to be the appropriate word for absolute poverty which i believe is defined by the world bank as living on less that $1.90 a day. In those terms I would hazard that no children in the UK fall under that definition.

Relative poverty by the very nature of how it is calculated will always exist, therefore is not a massively helpful definition IMO.

It exists, D but it isn't as neat as that definition.

Mumshappy - what do you mean time related poverty?

Not having secure accommodation and not being able to afford any of the following:

Fresh food
Shoes and clothes that fit and are fit for purpose
To wash and dry your clothes
To heat your home
To save for emergencies

Not enough money to meet basic needs of food, shelter, lights, heat and, water.

When the child worries about money.
When the house isn't heated
When the child is sent elsewhere to save money (to eat at a friend's, stay late at school, stay with a relative).
When their clothes don't fit or are damaged and can't be replaced.
When they can't wash themesleves or their clothes as often as they need.

I agree that the relative poverty definition more about inequality, but I think that's the definition used for the figure of 1/3 that OP quoted.

Two experiences have stood out to me as "poverty"

A TV show where the father declined party invites for his son because they couldn't afford a gift.

A woman at toddler group mentioning her feet were wet because she couldn't afford to replace trainers with a hole in the dole.

Awful in this day and age.

It makes me sad to think that some children don't have the basics.
Hit the nail on the head saying that children live on poverty as parents have debt problems/spend on other things.
Personally I feel poverty for children is not having the basics, but my friend thinks that poverty is not taking them for days out/ school trips or having access to a computer or other electronics. I suppose she has a point but I would not necessarily see it as poverty.

Where the children see little of their parents due to work commitments.

Not being able to pay for internet access or phone. Never being able to go on holiday or for days out. No money for Christmas or birthdays

Seriously?? Not having a holiday or gifts is poverty .... not sure most people in actual poverty with no home or heat would agree.

Thinking about children at school: not being able to easily replace school shoes. Cheap school bags breaking and not being able to replace them. In ill-fitting or inappropriate clothing. Rubbish packed lunches (often just a packet of crisps). Children not doing any positive activities out of school.

I'd say a lack of those things is more like deprived rather than poor. They are missing out on a range of experiences,life and social skills that could set them at a disadvantage socially and/or academically.

Poor is when they lack what they need,and it's a spectrum in my eyes.