To say its not a disease its a habit which started with choice. Alcoholism

[TreeFu]

My mother is a prolific binge drinker much to the detriment of myself and others around her, she has accepted she has a problem with drink but cannot be bothered to do anything to change her habits.

She can and does go for periods of time without touching one drop of alcohol, this is when she has no money to access it. During those periods she is just fine without it but as soon as she has access to money, she will binge until it runs out.

AIBU to believe this has nothing to do with disease and is down to her being weak willed, selfish and enjoying booze more than she cares about the wellbeing of those around her.

You cannot refuse help and expect sympathy at the same time

exactly, she's doing a number on you, using her addiction to get sympathy from you and control you.
She sounds highly narcissistic and you are a source of gratification for her, all your emotional responses to her, especially anger and upset 'feed' her and make her feel more powerful

I completely get and agree that it must be incredibly hard to stop once you're in the grips of physical addiction and dependency. I don't discredit the awful withdrawal symptoms that many alcoholics are faced with when their problem escalates to the extent that they cannot function without a drink.

I also get that relapse is a common part of recovery and is in many cases to be expected.

I admire and have respect for anybody, whatever their addiction, who tries to overcome it - but I struggle to sympathise with those like my mother who have never even bother to try, even once, despite having a support network and multiple offers of help.

For my mother to systematically destroy my childhood and continue to emotionally and abuse me into adulthood, through my own pregnancies and births, to then sit in front of me as I cry and plead for her to accept help, to chuckle and smirk in my face finding that funny and saying she's happy as she is and doesn't want to stop - I have no sympathy left for her and believe she's a lost cause and doesn't deserve a second more of my pity.

My absolute respect to others who have fallen into addiction but then chose to put their children/families first and at least try.

Your anger is quite healthy. So why is it impossible to ignore her?

@Squeegle I'm still trying to figure that out myself. I think it's because I'm desperate to have a mum, I've never known maternal love (until I had my own DC) and I crave what most other people have with their parents.

Because of my blind hope until now I've found it hard to disengage because I always hoped she'd change and that one day we could have a normal relationship.

My mother was an alcoholic.
It wasn’t a disease. She had full control over when she drunk and she chose to do it.
She was an arsehole growing up and I’ll never forgive her for our childhood.
She always drank when my dad was on a certain shift pattern or when there was something important like a birthday, Christmas etc.
My mother was (and still is!) a first class lazy bone idle arsehole.

I don’t believe for one minute it’s a disease. Funnily enough when grandkids came along she stopped. Because she knew she would never see them.
Maybe for some it’s a disease, as far as my mum was concerned she was just a lazy bone idle arsehole who used to drink herself crazy for 3/4 days a week so she wouldn’t have to do anything while my dad wasn’t there.
She was a pig to us growing up, nobody forced that shit down her, she made a choice.

It’s not really down to choice. They start drinking. Drinking is socially acceptable, addicts don’t realise it’s problematic and it’s too late and they have an addiction.

And an addiction, it’s not a choice to feed an addiction. I would compare it to feeling hungry. There are very, very few people who could feel hungry, be surrounded by food and other people eating who could resist eating themselves. It’s literally like that, you don’t choose to be hungry, you can’t really say it’s a choice to eat, it’s fulfilling a craving, a need that you have. That’s what it compares to, the feeling of a starving man in front of a banquet.

@Racecardriver I absolutely one thousand percent agree with how you've put that across and that is exactly how I feel about my mother!

@Ffiffime that too, absolutely, that is my mother down to a tee.

Sadly in my case she didn't stop when her DGC came along, she had no desire to.

If however she was told by the DWP that unless she stopped then her benefits would stop (not going to happen I know) I guarantee she wouldn't pick up the bottle then.

She's self serving, self absorbed and drinks because she enjoys it and it's of no great inconvenience to her if she's sloshed 3/4 days a week.

If something was important to her she'd make sure she's sober for it, a job center appointment for example (as evidenced previously) but when it comes to a family occasion or visiting the little ones, zero shits given.

Your anger is very valid.

I'd try to accept her as she is for now. This might be painful and may take therapy. I think waiting for her to recover might sadly be futile for the immediate future, but you can let her know the door is open should she change her mind and want help.

Boundaries are your friend. They protect you and may help you continue the relationship.

I'm reaching the stage now where I'm seeing no contact as the healthiest way to proceed, for me, and I'm ready to take steps to put myself first for once even if that means leaving her to it. I've struggled immensely to get to this point but I have nothing left to give her.

It's been indescribably hard for me to cut the ties as she's pretty much the only family I have left, but having nobody is surely better than somebody if that somebody sucks the joy out of your life.

Just to add fuel to the fire... as someone who has lived through loved ones alcoholism I completely understand your anger and frustration. I have also seen the labelling of alcoholism as a disease be used as an excuse to completely absolve oneself of all responsibility for their behaviour and it’s impact.
The web of addiction is dark and insidious and to label it an illness can also almost give a false hope that find the right pill and voila it’s all sorted.
It’s not simple. It’s not understood. It doesn’t fit easy explanations or causation models. But you have my deepest and sincerest empathy.

OP have you considered or tried al-anon? You can get support for yourself there and will meet a group of people who understand exactly how you feel and the kind of difficulties you are facing.

Are heroin addicts / cocaine addicts / cannabis addicts thought to have a disease, too?

Just wondering what the general consensus is about which addictions are thought to be diseases and which aren't.

For example. Many moons ago when I was using cannabis every day (teenage years) and was admittedly quite 'addicted' to it, I never once saw that as me having a disease and would have scoffed at the suggestion of it being one, even though at my worst I was spending £20 a day on it from my hard earned savings and very much felt as though I needed it.

There doesn't seem to be the same amount of absolving of blame for drug addicts like coke users or other drugs - as there is in alcoholics either, or am I mistaken?

There's alot of "poor bro/sis/dad/neighbour they are a alcoholic and are suffering from a terrible disease" but you never hear of people saying "poor uncle Jim's a coke head, it's a disease you know"

I saw on here the other day.. In a thread where a man had nothing to do with his dc for a number of years, that he'd been on cocaine during the family court process so didn't get custody of one of the children. Nobody jumped to his defence saying he had a disease but he had a lot of people labeling him a druggy, waste of space etc.

I'm just a bit confused as to why alcoholics tend to get more sympathy.

Oh I forgot to add, I haven't been to Al anon yet no but I'm looking into it as it sounds like something I'd benefit from

I think calling alcoholism a disease, is disrespectful to those who have a disease that they had absolutely no say in.
^This. My dad has a neurological disease which is slowly killing him, I'll probably get it to. If I could give up drinking to avoid it, I wouldn't give it a second thought. If I had to give up all food except bread and water, still definitely would. But I have no choice in the matter, if I had a choice of course I would do all I could to avoid it. So in this respect alcoholics have a distinct advantage over me.

I think it can be counted as a symptom rather than a cause, of mental health problems, pain etc. DSS mum is an alcoholic and has regularly chosen alcohol over seeing her son. I don't understand it but it's ultimately her choice to do so although she refuses to accept any responsibility for her actions.

YANBU

As a child of an alcoholic, I see the selfishness and the helplessness. It's a pattern of self pity and self loathing that takes everybody down with it. It is cruel. It destroys families. It breaks hearts.

Because of my blind hope until now I've found it hard to disengage because I always hoped she'd change and that one day we could have a normal relationship

I know it's really really hard but you will have to try and let go of that hope 💐

I've made the decision to distance myself from her after Christmas and fully intend to stand firm on it this time.

I'm sorry to read that others have suffered similarly to myself, it's a desperate position to be in and I wouldn't wish it on anybody.

I was scared shitless of becoming a mother in case I repeated the cycle of not being an adequate parent, thankfully I'm that opposed to her ways the thought of never putting my DC first revolts me and I can say with certainty that they'll never feel the things that I do after having my DM as a mother.

You're going to be ok OP
You can grieve for the Lost relationship with your mother and you can also do things like in a child work to try and just nurture yourself a bit, that kind of thing 🌞

Inner child!

I really disagree with you. It's like saying anorexia isn't a disease because it started with the choice to diet.

Alcoholism is a disease, in every sense of the word, of both the mind and body.

No one knows how alcoholism really works - lots of truth on both sides of the disease vs choice debate. But everyone knows that alcoholics are bad news.

If alcoholism is a disease, it's the only one where the patient suffers less than their nearest and dearest, who struggle far more with the symptoms of pain, fear, depression and anxiety. And they're not numbed out with lovely drink and dope, either.

I see it as Dad's disease that's killing Mum.

@beeefcake I have no experience of anorexia so wouldn't like to pass comment on that, my beliefs about my mother and alcohol stem from me witnessing it in its entirety for the past few years.

I can appreciate I might appear ignorant to some who have different experiences than myself.

My mother is not the stereotypical alcoholic, she's a binge drinker and functions just fine without it, she can spend a week with family (me and DS) at my home and not touch a drop whatsoever or have any withdrawal symptoms, then as soon as she goes home again she chooses to buy booze, just because she can.

@Wordthe thank you I'm sure I will be :)

@LanaorAna2 I absolutely agree.

The drinker gets to numb any and all emotions with drink whilst the closest people to them deal with the crippling anxiety, depression and worry themselves sick.

Whilst my mother has spent her day getting sloshed without a care in the world, I've spent mine anxious and worried panicking about whether she's going to fall and smash her head open again.

I have a young baby and I'm pregnant, I don't need all of this just so she can "enjoy a drink" as she puts it.