to think that Labour's stance on moped ramming is stupid

[longfingernails]

The Metropolitan Police have been knocking over moped muggers with their cars, and releasing the footage as a deterrent. It's a fantastic idea which has cut moped crime dramatically.

Predictably, the Shadow Home Secretary has said 'it shouldn't be legal for anyone'.

Why is Labour's instinct always to side with the scumbag criminals over the victims, the police and the decent people?

Violently attacking criminals and treating them as if they have no rights doesn't cause a lower crime rate.

The USA is a perfect example of a draconian, violent police state with more murders per capita and more gun crime than all the less fascist states put together.

Violently attacking criminals and treating them as if they have no rights doesn't cause a lower crime rate
No one is violently attacking criminals, the police are just doing the minimum necessary to stop, detain and arrest the scumbags. More power to them. If they get hurt in the process its their own fault. Its called choice.

Criminals aren't being "violently attacked" though are they?

This is a tactical option to arrest a suspect that it trying to get away from the scene of a crime. A suspect that will match a description and has failed to stop.

I'm also willing to bet that officers are trained to carry out the tactic, that the tactic had been risk assessed and that the officers also do a dynamic risk assessment. There's no human rights at stake here, unless one of our human rights is not to be arrested.

I think it's a great idea.
The muggings are getting out of hand, they are also very violent and carry things like acid.

Interestingly, the tactic is actually illegal

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/nov/25/police-risk-prosecution-for-moped-crime-tactics

I think it's a good idea. And I know that's unpopular, but I live in a semi rural area where people ride non road bikes all over the place, in towns at night, through estates and they are used for a quick and less detectable get away after a crime. The police were effectively powerless to stop this happening and escalating, the criminals didn't wear helmets and therefore couldn't even be chased. The police just had to basically sit and watch.
Well one guy, after I think a child being narrowly missed or possibly even hit, had had enough. He belted one of them with a shovel. Damn near took the lads head off.
That's what'll happen more and more if the police don't get control of this situation.
It's not being proposed that police officers just start driving into mopeds just in case they're muggers. The police can use force, of necessary, to stop and detain a suspect. Now if a police car gets on my arse and is flashing lights and sirens, I'm going to stop, if you don't stop then you risk being stopped.
It's no different in principle to a police officer chasing a suspect on foot and bringing them down with a rugby type tackle, or using a tazor or pepper spray. Yes the stakes are higher, but to my mind, the minute you commit a crime and then decide to run to escape the concequences, you accept the risk you could be injured or killed by the police attempting to bring you to justice.
If you don't want to accept that risk then a) don't commit the crime and/or b) stop when you're told to by a police officer.
If you don't then you accept the concequences quite frankly.

Interestingly, the tactic is actually illegal
OMG, is it actually illegal for police in the UK to catch criminals? We need a change in the law immediately. Maybe we should deport them all to the EU where they will be able to claim asylum!

"applies equally to the emergency services and members of the public who are not trained in advanced driving techniques and police tactics"

Interestingly, the tactic is actually illegal
From the Guardian article the way I read it is that it is legal providing that you are trained in advanced driving and/or police tactics.

Otherwise by the same logic TPAC would also count as illegal

Maybe we should deport them all to the EU where they will be able to claim asylum!
If Britain starts deporting criminals to the EU, you can expect to see an unprecedented crime wave over the coming years.

@GySgtHartman

Makes sense, thanks

I think it’s terrible that we’ve got to this situation. I was shocked to see the video. However I cannot see another way to capture these criminals beyond using guns, which is far worse. Something has to be done about this crime wave. These muggers are often hurting people. And then there’s the acid attacks. Very frightening.

Actually it has MrsP rates have dropped by 36% since introduction of this technique by police.

They thought they'd found a way to mug people without consequence. The police are not running them over, just stopping the he same as they would block a car

Well i think we need police back on the streets...20,000 police laid off? No wonder London has gone feral. I alnoat had a heart attack when i saw a bobby on tbe beat yesterday in Bristol...such a rare breed.
So your basically saying that lets have less officers but make the few left more violent.

Lets not forget austerity plays a part in rising crime. Im not saying these criminals are ok....tbey are nit and they need to be clamped down on...but that requires human resources..and hence money.

Just read a few articles about this...some say a severe cut in youth services ( and jobs in general) has lead to a violent crime wave. The police should stop these idiots but we need to get to the root cause.

Yanbu. In my area it is rife and so dangerous to the public. Someone is going to get seriously hurt or killed by these thugs. I'm pleased to hear it is working as a deterant.

Totally disagree. It’s incredibly dangerous and could also result in innocent people being hurt. There’s way too high a possibility of collateral damage.

Some whiny robbing git will probably sue and they'll have to stop.
Officers I know who are blue light trained are skilled drivers.

I’m totally fine with this policy. The moped mugging sand acid attacks were escalating and there’s bugger all else to be done.

And yes - it is lawful if done by properly trained drivers who take into account the situation.

We either need to give the police the ability to stop the criminals or resign ourselves to vigilante justice. Because people in affected areas are fed up and would like to have their right to go about their business unmolested enforced.

Most of them appear to run away, there is a chance one will get seriously injured but I’m sure this is done after the police ask them to stop and innocent or guilty if the police ask you to stop you should. I’m sure this will make them think again about doing it and cut mooed crime. This doesn’t only reduce the initial crime it reduces the chance of someone walking or cycling down an alley or footpath being hit Oman’s injured, I’m very happy if the risk sits more with the person who has committed an offence, even if sometimes they offence may be failing to stop. Short of lettting them get away with it what other tactics do the police have?

Why? Surely you're not concerned with human rights of the criminals?
If you really care about human rights you care about them for everyone.
Criminals are innocent until proven guilty you can’t just drive over anyone you like just because you think they’ve done something. Where are the checks and balances to make sure no one gets seriously hurt or killed.
Yes moped thieves are nasty little scrotes but is it a crime that deserves death or permenant disability? Is the risk of seriously hurting or injuring an innocent person a risk worth taking?
I think not.

Actually in the fastest turn around in MN history having read the full thread and seen the detail I think if it’s only used in active pursuit and only done by specially trained drivers it’s ok.

We have police being openly attacked on the streets, a kid with a zombie knife was allowed to walk free from court, and police numbers have been cut way too much.

Something has to give and I would hope this policy makes people think twice about people using mopeds to commit crime, as opposed to the free for all it appears to have been so far.

To the poster who said about people in Islington being robbed, I live in a fairly deprived part of North London and a young woman ended up in hospital with severe head injuries after being attacked by moped muggers in Broad daylight on a residential street.

This is a GREAT policy. 100% behind this. Think it is ridiculous how many people on this thread are more concerned for the scumbag criminals.

Totally agree with the police knocking them off their bikes . These moped muggers now know the risk , their choice if the want to hit the pavement face first at 40mph .Its about time someone took control in London.

But yes a few well off chaps get their phones nicked on a night out in Islington and yeeha lets run those fuckers down

This is the state of politics, make it no only a Gendered issue, but also a wealth one to dismiss the fact About put her foot in mouth again not knowing the police already have rights to enact this policy and it's not illegal, it also brushed aside that a lot of acid throwing a have been done via the Back of a moped, but apparently only come about because "muh rich man" got robbed