To think we need a congestion charge in every major city?

[impossiblecat]

The traffic is getting insane.

It's dangerous and bad for everyone's health.

With the exception of the disabled and people who live within the limits of said congestion zone, obviously.

I'd have all money raised ploughed into public transport.

OP your grasp of the reality of this living in or close to inner cities is shockingly naive.
Working from home should of course be encouraged but for the large part is not available to the majority. Let's be honest if you are working shifts, on minimum wage or lower income bracket etc your choices are immediately limited. Your assumption that everybody working within London receives London weighting is really off point too.

I challenge anyone to find poverty within the greenbelts of any major city
You cannot be serious surely?

We don't need a congestion charge in Cardiff☺️

There are a lot of people here talking about the poverty of other people, not themselves.

Anybody here earning £16k or less (gov definition for benefits) and commuting into the center of a major city? I can't see how it would be viable.

It's almost like using poor people as human shields.

@user1457017537

Go home.

Still think a surge tax would be a good alternative- pollution over a certain level - collect a fiver from everyone driving in that day. Polluter pays principle

There's probably dozens of other people who need cars and work at BCH - JUST ONE BUILDING, in just one of the Cities you mention. It's so ludicrous to just throw out a wild statement about how EVERYBODY can use buses to get to work.

Imagine if the only cars on the road were delivery vehicles, mass transit, and key workers. It might actually be safe to cycle and pleasant to walk. Anyone doing a day shift in one place does not need to drive to work.

I’ve recently been to Birmingham. It’s absolutely choked with traffic. How many journeys are essential? Picking up the dc from school because it’s raining? Driving to work because there are smelly people on the bus?

The oil & car industries are the new big tobacco, insisting everything is fine and we NEED cars while we all slowly choke to death. But hey, as long as they’re making money, right?

There are a lot of people here talking about the poverty of other people, not themselves.

That will be a poverty that - for the purposes of this thread - remains tantalisingly undefined

Imagine if the only cars on the road were delivery vehicles, mass transit, and key workers. It might actually be safe to cycle and pleasant to walk. Anyone doing a day shift in one place does not need to drive to work.

This. So much this. Pollution is killing us and we simply cannot cope with the sheer number of vehicles.

One reason I left my previous job was the fact it was in London and I had problems breathing the air there. Literally. I had inhalers, had to plan low emission walking routes, struggled on the tube.

Then I left and my breathing problems stopped. Just vanished.

It’s not just those in poverty it’s the JAMs too and those above that.

It would cost us both £300 extra a month to bus in. Actually more as I’d have to quit my job due to lack of services. We couldn’t afford that and we have a decent household income. We’ve just coughed up for a Cat 6 car to use everywhere. Our budget only goes so far. Busing it would mean going back to a dirty car for everywhere else and restrictions on our income elsewhere.

impossiblecat

I think that the reason why people are getting narc'c with you is that are refusing to see the bigger picture. the adverse knock on effects of the CC to those outside of cities and in to rural areas.

So what about people who are unable to walk/ride a bike?

I certainly can’t longer distances at the moment

UserX

Imagine if the only cars on the road were delivery vehicles, mass transit, and key workers. It might actually be safe to cycle and pleasant to walk.

Until the first cyclist tries to undertake a lorry turning left.

Manchester is happy without a congestion charge thanks 👍🏻

I love the idea that everyone can just get the bus to work everyday, like they don't have other commitments that need to fit around the bus timetable!

What about people who have childcare commitments? Lots of nurseries and before school clubs don't open until 8am, so they couldn't get a bus earlier than that, unless it went past the childcare/school.

Then say they drop the kids off at 8am and have to be at work in the city by 9am. It's a 40 minute drive so perfectly manageable by car, but the next bus doesn't leave until 8.15am and takes over an hour because of all the other stops it has to do on the way.

Lots of people work in jobs where they don't have flexible working so they can't just work 9.30-5.30 instead, primarily because their childcare closes at six and they need to leave work by 5pm at the latest to go and collect their children.

Yes, most inner city schools will be on a bus route but it might not be the bus route you need to get to work, and the times might not work for your hours or your needs!

It’s not just those in poverty but the JAMS and those higher than that. It would cost us £300 extra a month if we both took the bus and I’d have to quit work as our bus system wouldn’t get us there in time. We pay that much in bus fares for our dc and Id have to can that and drive them to the other city they go to school in. Totally defeating the object.

Aside from that I assume these mythical buses you speak of are electric. The power stations powering them burn the same fossil fuels just elsewhere. An electric car csuses 80% emissions of your regular car in its lifetime. The mining of nickle, lithium and other chemicals cause a lot of environmental damage and smog but just elsewhere.

I guess it’s just a case of not in my back yard. The gov needs our taxes and businesses need our skills so I doubt very much if the old suggestion we’ll ever see the light of day.

Op’s

I guess we’ll just turn a blind eye to kids sent down the mines to mine battery chemicals and wars in the Congo over mining.

Yes definitely a case of not in my back yard.

Backforgood, so none of those workers could cycle to work

I guess we’ll just turn a blind eye to kids sent down the mines to mine battery chemicals and wars in the Congo over mining.

You’re turning a blind eye now to children breathing toxic air all over the world, not to mention any atrocities committed by the oil industry. You can care about 2 things at once you know.

Until the first cyclist tries to undertake a lorry turning left.

Yes everything is the cyclists fault.

The worst places and causes for city smog are schools and the school run. Maybe more children should travel by bus to school.

Or walk or cycle. And as for people complaining about child care commitments etc. Nurseries open at 8 etc. I have always worked my life so it didn't involve long car commutes or driving kids to nursery or school. There are nearly always choices

Or walk or cycle

Not everyone can. My meeting yesterday was around 50 minutes drive. I couldn't have walked/cycled that. As I said earlier I tried to do it by public transport. The expereince was so poor that I won't try again.

Or walk or cycle. And as for people complaining about child care commitments etc. Nurseries open at 8 etc. I have always worked my life so it didn't involve long car commutes or driving kids to nursery or school. There are nearly always choices

Yes because that’s an option for everyone isn’t. Love how that is always put out there.

I have always worked my life so it didn't involve long car commutes or driving kids to nursery or school. There are nearly always choices

Congratulations, but you do realise that, actually, there aren't "nearly always choices", don't you?

It's fine if you live somewhere with access to decent transport and amenities but a huge percentage of the population don't actually have that on their doorstep. There are some wild assumptions here that everyone actually does have access to public transport and decent cycle routes etc and just chooses not to use them.

My journey to work would be impossible on public transport (as detailed upthread) and lethal on a bike - the infrastructure where I live just isn't designed for a cyclists commute. It's hilly, dangerous and on NSL roads that are poorly lit, windy and full of potholes. There often isn't room for a car and cyclist at the same time so you're constantly having to pull over to allow other traffic to pass.

But of course, everyone should move to the city or to nice market towns with good transport links, because we can all afford to do so, and of course, there are plenty of houses, schools, GP's, dentists and other necessities with plenty of space for everyone too

Some people also have disabilities, so unfortunately ‘don’t have choices’