To think the men who put the Grenfell tower model on the bonfire should not be arrested

[Leobynature]

I don’t wish to upset or offend anyone with this post.

I am a non-white woman. I am upset and disgusted by the men who were filmed putting a model of Grenfel tower on the bonfire. What’s more upsetting is the fact that model depicted images of black children being burried alive.

However this act had taken place in the privacy of their own homes so I am wondering whether it is in the public’s interest to arrest and charge these men. I’m personally more concerned that our privacy is no longer respected and we could be held account for moral acts we do in our own homes. How many of us make prejudice, racist or other comments in ‘the safety’ of our homes. Is this more of a social concern than a legal one.

Or is it the uploading of the image which makes it subjectable to a public order offence.

I would rather see the man power, resources and money being used here used somewhere else.

What does everyone else think?

Are you serious? FFS!

How many of us make prejudice, racist or other comments in ‘the safety’ of our homes

The ones who are prejudiced racist idiots obviously. Do you!?

That was aimed at the OP! ^

Meh. They’re stupid. I don’t think it’s something that people should be arrested over for the fundamental reason that it doesn’t serve any purpose but costs a lot of money. This didn’t really do anyone any real harm (obviously I don’t include hurt feelings within the s hope of real harm). And they don’t pose a threat to the public. So why spend money arresting, convicting and imprisoning them? As for punishment surely the publicity around what they have done will punish them for the rest of their lives. I don’t see any poain’t in using tax payer money perusing then.

I think there was no need to start a third thread on the same subject

Sir! Yes Sir!

Section 4 of The public order act requires intent. If they lacked intent then I am not certain they can be charged.
It also requires threats of immediate violence.
I did not see that.
I am not sure that the display on social media counts for public order offences.

I agree. We don't have a right not to be offended. Freedom of speech is too important.

Over the years the Public Order Act has been used to variously arrest gay rights campaigners, Christian street preachers, critics of Scientology and even students making jokes. Once you start policing (non violent) speech you're going down a dangerous road.

The video is horrific but the consequences for those who made it should be social, not legal.

The video should have been removed by whichever site it was on. If Facebook, Twitter and other social media sites were quick to act, then the likelihood of posting such vile material would be less. I was glad the BBC chose not to broadcast it.

They?

Did they know it would be distributed on Social Media.....who distributed? Was that the purpose? Was someone in the group horrified and broadcast without the others knowledge? If they were sharing it with their 'friends' is an offence?, or is it because it went viral and everyone called for their heads? Not sure of the finer details or what offence has been committed. As PP above said, it can depend on Intent.

Was it wrong, inappropriate, sickening? Yes.

It is freedom of speech. The didn't physically hurt anyone. Of course it is in poor taste vut personally I think taking legal action against them is a slippery slope to infringing of freedom of speech.

The OP references them being arrested.

That allows them to be questioned under caution.

I hope the fuckers get everything they deserve

News coverage states that they went voluntarily to the police station and handed themselves in. Which is... odd. Also, as PP said, did they upload that video footage to share with friends in a 'look how edgy and satirical we are' way, or did some friend-of-a-friend film the incident without telling them and then circulate it in a 'look at these awful people' way?

It very much puts me in mind of the bloke with the dog - some sort of dubious free-speech stunt that would have been better just ignored.

There were women there too- one helped to lift it onto the fire. I don’t understand why they aren’t being mentioned.

I honestly couldn’t believe the callousness and premeditation of what I was seeing. It shocked me to the core.

Make you might find this article helpful.

I agree OP. They are clearly morons but I don't think they should be arrested and it could end up making them martyrs for free speech. Everyone is entitled to think what they like, however offensive that may be to others. This happened at a private event (until someone decided to spread it on twitter) and unless it can be proved that the protagonists intended it to be broadcast I don't see that they have committed any offence. Total waste of police resources.

THey were idiots
but spending taxpayers money to prosecute and imprison them would just divert money from better causes

No sympathy whatsoever. They've gone to the police because, thickos that they are, they have realised they've exposed their own sad and pathetic lives to risk. They deserve everything that follows.

There are legal limits on free speech and stronger ones on what can be uploaded on social media, to be seen potentially by millions

The CPS will decide if these callous swine crossed those limits.

Gloating over comparatively recent deaths might be considered a Public Order offence,
particularly if there are aggravating factors

Imagine if Muslims made a model of the Manchester arena bombing, with models of the victims and filmed themselves gloating over it.
Still think "free speech" means they shouldn't be arrested ?

Ta1k well, no, not really. It would just get swallowed up by the numerous demands on a vast police force. A tiny bit of it might go towards prosecuting someone for a cannabis offence, or for doing 40 in a 30 zone. Or dealing with all the 101 calls from MNers who've had a row about a p&c parking space. There isn't a 'worthy cause' jar that gets raided every time something socially divisive happens.

they deserve to be shamed which I suspect is them being arrested/looked for has done as they have turn themselves in however what crime has been commited?
some say hate crime bit it was not a crime solely based on hate, its a few dickheads that thought it would be funny to make that and post it.

so yes I agree they should not be arrested/charged/convicted but shamed/sacked/humiliated yes

It's disgusting and dickish behaviour but if we had police covering dickish behaviour then we'd need a lot more than we currently have. My opinion is that the one who uploaded it caused an actual criminal offence, the others are just twats.

I'm not impressed by the news coverage and the journalists who were so offended they continued to show footage on their websites. It was also the headline news this morning which I found odd. In the scheme of things happening all around the world the news broadcasters deemed 5 idiots as the headline story? I can only assume there's no starving people or wars in the world right now.

Absolutely not condoning their behaviour but I imagine it's more bad judgement and low intelligence, attention seeking than anything else.

I'm on the fence. Personally I would settle from them being identified publicly for a good old trial by Facebook followed by them loosing their jobs from public outcry/embarrassed employers and maybe a little street justice/beating!!!

They will end up with little more than a slap on the wrist if found guilty and the public shaming would go a lot further!!

forget what I just wrote, I hadn't seen the video and heard the comments.

yes they absolutely should be arrested, charged and convicted as well as shamed.

I agree

They are vile cunts

But we can’t arrest everyone for having horrible ideas .

Anyway now the daily mail have exposed them ( including aerial views of their garden!) they are proper ducked anyway

I would prefer police focus on actual crimes , rather than a
Massively offensive act