Will my son go to prison?

[MrsPortious]

DS is 17. He has been arrested before for assault but it was dealt with by youth justice serve so officially not charged.

Early this week, he was arrested for affect. An unprovoked attack on an unknown male, caught in CCTV, where he was seen kicking him over 20 times in the head and face. Unknown male has not come forward. Behind the scenes, DS was already being investigated for threats of arson and threats to kill.
Solicitor says it has prison written all over it. I can’t get my head around that. He’s currently released without bail pending further enquiries.

Will he go to prison?

I’ve tried so hard to get him help. Have referred him to social devices, drug counselling, Cahms ... cahms are the only ones still involved.

I’m just stuck in limbo now waiting for a court date. I have no support and it’s killing me. His father was supposed to be having him this weekend but “something came up”. I don’t get the opportunity of “something coming up”. I have it 24/7.

The CCTV is so sickening, it’s the kind of thing that will go viral on Facebook if the press gets hold of it. DS cares not one bit. When solicitor told him it could be a prison sentence, he didn’t react at all. Solicitor rang me the next day to say he’d never seen such a violence assault and he’d never known such an emotionless response from the offender.

Will my Christmas Day involve me signing into the visitors book at HMP? I have nobody to talk to about this.

Gosh, OP, your son may lack regard for the victim but your posts are full of empathy. I'm sorry this is happening to you.

Your son may go to prison, it is also possible that he may have a very 'lucky' escape (albeit lucky for him, but not for society) as the victim hasn't come forward to give evidence, severity of injuries is unknown etc.

Judging by your posts, his behaviour isn't a reflection on you. Please look after yourself.

I would hope someone capable of those crimes would be put behind bars for a longtime . I’m sorry OP but at least the help he needs will be given before it is a murder charge he faces . Take care of yourself .

OP if you're still around, I would pay for a private MH and learning disability assessment ASAP.

I am surprised with the background you have described that the sol hasn't suggested this. It might be a mitigating factor. It might also open doors for effective treatment, which is what everyone should want in a case like this, not just the prison/punishment/exposure to drugs and violence/reoffending route that is much more likely than prison/rehabilitation.

Actually, those suggesting this young man might get his life together in prison are living in lalaland. The exact opposite is likely to happen.

Almost certainly prison. A ‘shod foot’ is classed as a weapon, which is an aggravating feature in any violent offence. I feel for you, OP. I was a criminal lawyer for many years and I met a lot of parents who found themselves wondering how things had gone so wrong.

And I agree with the previous poster. He’s unlikelyvyomiraculously turn his life around with the limited help available in prison. But it might shock him enough that he’s willing to engage with anything else that can be put in place.

Those of you blaming the OP ask yourselves how you would feel if one of your children did this. Experience has shown me that parents aren't always to blame (both work experience and families I have known personally). OP needs support to clarify what is her responsibility and what isn't. Hopefully she can detach to a degree whilst being available to help her son going forward. Trying to shame the OP won't help anyone..The son needs face up to the consequences of his actions for everyone. I hope he gets professional help, I don't think he will accept it from his mother.

If he's just been triage or cautioned before (which it sounds like, from what you've said), then the court's options are pretty limited for a 1st youth conviction. It is pretty likely that he will get a DTO (detention and training order) - they can be 4mths to 2 years, and the offender spends half of it inside, and half on 'probation' with intensive support.
The courts (unsurprisingly) don't like assaults when someone is kicked whilst on the floor.

When is he 18? If he turns 18 before plea, then he'll be in adult court, and it may go up to the Crown Court. Ironically, there are more sentencing options then, including suspended sentences, tagging/curfews etc.

His solicitor will talk him through all this. Don't spend money getting a private psych report - his solicitor will apply for legal aid funding to instruct one if necessary.

I would be pushing for further psych assessment as he doesn't sound fit for trial if the seriousness of his actions are escaping him along with his earlier diagnoses. Perhaps a period of time in a secure institution would be of more benefit to him than a prison sentence. It sounds to me that this is more than offender rehabilitation that is required here.

sorry to hear about your DS. I think it is a call for help. Prison is not always the best solution nor a wake up call. It will only drag him down further. He probably lack fatherly figure or role model. thats how the boy react to his sorry state of family life. He felt unloved. If only he got a male figure who are willing to take him under his wing and show some compassion and understanding. sadly in uk this is rarely available. find a defence for his action. get psychological help to diminish or mitigate his offence. His lawyer should be looking for defence instead of outright not defending him. Your son state of mind is important. A child cant just not show any remorse. that by itself is a psychological issue. Prison will kill any hope of career or job in the future. You are the mother. find help. your brother sister uncle auntie grandparents. they should be there to give him some love considering his father failed miserably on his parenting. He needs your help. its a real cry for help that must have been going on and on for years. Please find somewhere in your heart to get help for your son. often if he find a girlfriend, that would help too. money helps him to go out with friends and meet new people. its costly but it helps him go out and be more normal. he needs friends. ask court for leniency due to his family circumstances and absentee father that he loves and missed dearly since young etc etc but father not interested and he lash out???

Did your son know the victim? It is very worrying that the victim hasn't come forward. You need to be making inquiries into this.

Treatment options in prison are minimal.prison is containment not treatment
Does he have an established diagnosis?Did CAMHS or GP offer an opinion
On release he could be referred to CMHT for assessment& follow up if it is felt there is an underlying MH issue

I m sorry for you OP and I hope he gets a suspended sentence with help for you both.
It's not easy being the mum when the kids go off the rails.
I would advise him to plead guilty as an early guilty plea is looked on more favourably by the court and will reduce his sentence.
I would also advise him to drop the attitude (which could just be teenage bravado) and express remorse/engage with support services.
I m not going to say oh he s awful he deserves to be in prison when I don't know what is making him like this. Very few people are born evil.
My son ended up in court at age 18 through drink driving. As it was his second offence we were terrified of a prison sentence but they gave him probation and help to access jobs he was interested in.
He told me later that his knees were actually knocking in the court and yes it really did scare the shit out of him. Good in a way as he always felt indestructible.
He s 30 now and working and responsible.
I hear you OP boys this age can be a nightmare.
Good luck xx

Unprovoked attack.
Kicked in the head and face over 20 times.
He should be being charged with attempted manslaughter.
He is obviously a danger to society - I feel sorry for the poor innocent man who might be lying in his bed dying of an aneurism after being beaten -for no reason -to within an inch of his life. One more kick could have been the one that killed him.

Personally, I would be hoping he DOES get sent down and for a long time so he stands a chance of being rehabilitated before he gets let out and kills someone next time.
And I wouldn’t be visiting him either, just writing to him until there’s some evidence of a turnaround in attitude towards his fellow humans.

Sorry but it sounds like prison may be the place for him. Hopefully he will learn to take it seriously then.

Hi.
Is this his first offence? Has he had a previous referral order.
I work P/T for a youth offending team. PM me if you need advice xx

Hopefully

Op you will get through this. It's going to be horrible and hard, but you've clearly done everything you could.

I teach 16-19 and it saddens me to say he is not unique. Not by a long shot.

Him being small and of a childlike appearance could actually be a contributing factor - I've known a lot of smaller teenage boys who are incredibly violent, because they feel like they have to prove themselves, and being known for violence is a form of protection. He will also set everything by his reputation.

What he has done is obviously appalling, and anyone with a modicum of intelligence can see you know that and agree.

As for not caring, in my experience of 17 year olds that's probably 99% bullshit and bravado. He can't crack though - he's a 'big, hard man' and 'hard men' don't show fear. Inside he will be petrified.

He's going to learn the hard way that there are consequences.

Please come across to the what to take to prison thread op. We are all going through similar things and can hopefully offer you some support. People don’t understand that we, as parents, are victims too. Take care.

he doesn't sound fit for trial if the seriousness of his actions are escaping him
That’s quite a leap to make. The solicitor can request a psychiatric assessment. Free of charge. No need to instruct a private psychiatrist,save your money.
If mental health was proposed as the reason it’d have been raised by now, it doesn’t appear to be flagged as significant
Him being uncommunicative and not engaged is not indicative of being unfit for trial
He could be minimising it, in denial, Bravado. Or simply doesn’t get the enormity of it

Did you say the victim was a drug addict op? Might explain why he hasn't come forward, sometimes no matter what happens these people won't speak up because of what goes on in there own lives and not wanting to deal with police.

Is it possible the victim is in the hospital, possibly not conscious?

Good god, I hope so

Sorry, but I am glad it is one less thug off the streets.

My kids are scared to go about their daily lives because of mindless violence like this by people who don't seem to acknowledge the implications of their actions.
I only hope he learns from it all in a positive way and comes out a better human being.

I second @Aridane and @DeRigueurMortis - yes to getting this moved, you need support, not the judgement you get in AIBU.

This is not your crime so you don't have to answer for it, you are doing your best and didn't bring him up like this.

You are caught in the ripple effect. Both of you need support going forward. You need support to support him.

Treatment options in prison are minimal.

I have a friend who's a senior psych nurse in the hospital wing of a cat B prison. He used to work on the locked ward of an NHS psych unit, and he says (only half joking) that the prison hospital is a far more caring environment. They have better staffing ratios than in the NHS unit, and patients stay with them longer, because there isn't the same pressure on beds as in the NHS, so they're able to do more intensive work with patients.

I've also worked with clients post-release and for some it has been a really positive experience, so it's not all bad.