To ask how to get DP/DH to share mental load?

[negunslean]

DH works long hours and I work part time (in our own business) we have 2 teenage DS. I am sick of being the only thinker/planner in our marriage. If it comes to a row about this he will often comment that he doesn’t sit on his arse all day, inferring that I have more time to sort this stuff out. And I agree to some respect. But not 24/7.
I feel totally responsible for all other stuff - family birthdays, children’s plans, cooking, booking holidays, making decisions about just about everything
How do I get him to share the mental load without detriment to our family life? If I don’t do things then other people suffer (relatives whose birthdays are forgotten, family eating constant takeaway or junk, bills not paid etc etc). AIBU to be sick of him thinking that as he works more hours and does do occasional ‘housework’ ( dishwasher etc)then this excuses him from everything else.

He's probably sick of having the mental load of being the only decent wage earner too! There is no earthly reason why you can't work full time and then request to share the awful, terrible mental load of having to go and buy birthday cards.
Yes, do go ahead and take the suggestions of some posters of "going on strike" and only do 50% of the house stuff. Hopefully your DH will then decide to "go on strike" too and only pay 50% of the bills.
It sounds like you have different expectations - that he expected that facilitating you to stay part-time meant that you would be doing family work in your time off, whereas you wanted him at work so you could have more leisure time.

I think yabu, just a little bit. You work fewer hours so you should shoulder most of the 'mental load'. Tbh I never really see the big deal about this, it just means paying bills, remembering which days DC have activities (and I have 5dc), that sort of thing? I agree with pp and think that perhaps you feel unappreciated, rather than over worked. Fwiw I stopped buying stuff for my DH's family years ago but there is only two of them while I have a massive family so it doesn't save me a lot of time, but it's the principle involved, his family is his responsibility.

Side note, but I always wonder why people often include 'paying bills' as part of their housework. Is there anything that can't be set up as a direct debit or standing order nowadays?

Oh! And while I'm at it, 'sorting out insurance' is another one that comes up a lot. Twenty minutes once a year isn't much mental load!

I’m always fascinated by the “bills not paid” line when people complain about mental load.

I cannot remember the last time paying a bill caused me any kind of mental load whatsoever.

Every single one of my household bills goes out via direct debit. End of.

I get an email once a month with childcare invoice. I receive that email on my phone, pay it immediately from my childcare voucher account.

Clubs are ad hoc - all done on line in seconds except ballet, where it doesn’t break me mentally to write a cheque once a term. I do wish I could do it on line, but as I say - it doesn’t break me.

I was curious about the age of your children so I’ll admit to a search. With one at uni and one at boarding school, I’m not sure how much your meal planning is really contributing to mental load?

I think you’re being really unfair assuming that your husband isn’t also carrying a mental load. Give me pissing about choosing holidays over the stress of running a business, any day!

YY to insurance!
It’s not like the days when you had to set aside time to go into town to see an insurance broker!
You can just pay more and accept the renewal. Or you can have websites like gocompare do it all for you.

It still has to be done, and in a relationship where two people have equal leisure time of course it should be shared. But not when one works significantly less hours.

Partial cross post with Hont1986

But you still have to keep an eye on your bank account to make sure everything is as it should be and if you're only spending 20 minutes a year sorting out your insurance, chances are that you're not shopping around properly and paying more than you need to.

The low effort 'takeaways and beige crap' version of household finances. Fine if you can afford it, but many people either need to save money, or want to so they have more money left for something more interesting than insurance.

With one at uni and one at boarding school, I’m not sure how much your meal planning is really contributing to mental load?
Even more of a why can't you do it then! What 'children's plans' do you actually have to organise then?!!!

Permit me to scream. 'Arrrrgggghhh'.
Every time these threads come up, a bunch of numpties always join in the chorus of 'what mental load? Just put it on dd.'
Can you not understand that yes, if you do fuck all as a family, then yes, there'll be no mental load.
If you do lots, then there'll be more mental load.
It surely isn't that difficult to imagine it'll be different for different families.
My dc do lots of activities; because they love them, they're good for them, and we can afford them. Believe me, it takes a shit tonne of time organising the logistics of how to get everyone on my family to everything they want to do. I'm happy with this, and have to time to organise it. But please, please, please stop with the 'my car insurance only takes 15 mins annually, so how can anyone else possibly have anything else to organise.'
Argh. Rant over.

But how hard is it to “keep an eye” on a bank account?
Gone are the days of getting a paper every month and having to sit down and try to figure out whether £23.14 four weeks ago was fraudulent when you can’t remember where you were.
It takes seconds to look at an online bank account every day.

Recognising that mental load exists when splitting tasks between couples (not always equally!) is a good thing.

But jumping on the mental load bandwagon when a proportion of it is just about finding a good way to organise yourself just isn’t helpful.

I go back to my meal planning example before. You can spend ages complaining about your mental load. Or you can decide on a 7 day meal plan and just keep repeating that. Job done. We don’t even have to leave the house to shop any more! No need to trawl through recipe books. I’ve no doubt there are a million example meal plans out there online if you want to speed up the picking and choosing.

@zzzz the op has hardly written anything other than 'children's plans' which may be hardly anything, or may be loads. We dont know.
I am more responding to the other posters, not the op who hasn't clarified enough for anyone to say one way or another.

My child and stepchildren do a load of activities too. Which I have plenty of time to organise because my bills are on DD so take zero time.

Nobody is saying that there aren’t tasks to be done, and planning around them.

I just think some people complain about mental load when they’re making a mountain out of a molehill for some it - like the OP’s comment that “bills won’t get paid”. Bill paying doesn’t have to be hard.

I think that mental load is more linked to “doing shit I don’t want to”.
I can spend HOURS managing all my child’s activities (there is a lot of running her around and waiting around) and not feel it is any load at all. But give me 5 MINUTES of ironing and I’ll be right on the mental load bandwagon

Sometimes the answer isn’t LTB. Sometimes, it might not even be to get your partner to take on more. Sometimes, it’s about sucking up that you have to do shit you don’t like - but he is too. Or even, he’s getting to do all the good stuff whilst you get the shit - but, it’s not his fault that the good stuff fills his time up to a fair level.

I was talking about 'mental load' posters generally, not specifically OP, but...

"family birthdays, children’s plans, cooking, booking holidays, making decisions about just about everything"

Family birthdays - ten minutes at the start of the year to put everyone's birthdays on the calendar, pick up a birthday card on the weekly shop, post it when you're out and about. Probably takes ten minutes of work for each card, total?

Childrens plans and cooking are part of your role as a p/t SAHP. That's the in-home work you take on because your partner does the out-of-home work.

Booking holidays - fair enough, this can be 10-20 hours work, but how often does this happen? Two or three times a year?

Anyone who says 'mental load' isn't a thing is being disingenuous.

I've recently started DD1 on brownies and swim lessons. I've found a suitable brownie group, put her on the waiting list, bought uniform when required. I've found suitable swim lessons, called regularly for three months to get her into a class, e-mailed the managers about their stupid 'no waiting lists' system when there was no space after three months, then had to go through it all again when she turned out to be in the wrong level (and there was no space in the right level).

DH has driven DD1 to brownies/swim lessons when I tell him to, and I've picked up. So he's doing half of the physical work. But to ignore the huge mental load it's taken to get to that point is insulting.

I do concede that the amount of work is likely to decrease with older children. But we really need the OP to come back and give more info before deciding she's moaning about nothing.

Honestly? I think mental load is a load of absolute bollocks. On reflection I take the entire mental load - which appears to be a 21st century invention - in this house. Do you know what? I don't even notice it.

A birthday next week? Take a card from my huge stockpile (that it gave me pleasure to choose and buy). Insurance us? Go online, find the best deal and buy it, 10 minutes. Book a previously discussed and agreed holiday? Go online and do it, five minutes.

Mental load is just another rod for women to beat men with, as if there weren't already enough.

It's not the time taken by individual tasks that's the problem. It's being the only one who thinks to do any of them, ending up being responsible for all of them and knowing that if you don't do it, it either won't get done, or will get done late/badly. That's the frustration expressed by the OP.

Now if she is working far fewer hours than her DH, then maybe she should be doing most things while he's at work, but I don't see why she should do everything. How many adults have the luxury of never having to think about what food they will eat when and shopping and preparing it, sorting finances, their DCs activities, holidays, medical appointments, etc etc etc?

'Mental load' used to be called 'life admin', which I think is a far better name for it.

The thing about 'admin' is that it can be quantified, and that is the last thing that SAHPs want because if you sit down and work out the amount of time that sending birthday cards and remembering to buy milk and so on actually takes, it's barely more than 4-5 hours a week.

But 'mental load' is a very unquantifiable thing. It's a constant, 24/7 psychological burden that someone who works a mere 37 hours a week couldn't begin to understand.

Just to be clear, I'm not talking about the single parent with 3+ SN children to be ferried around and parents to care for and sick pets and all that - there are absolutely people out there who can claim to have a heavy 'mental load'. But a SAHP to two school age children with a helpful partner? Not so much.

Now if she is working far fewer hours than her DH, then maybe she should be doing most things while he's at work, but I don't see why she should do everything.
Yes but if it's just her & DH there most of the time, because one child is at univ & the other at boarding school, then the house isn't exactly going to get messed up & won't take more than an hour a day to be kept spotless. Cooking for two - hardly a big deal. What else? The odd birthday card (she's hardly got to buy multiple presents for her children's friends parties any more!), a holiday? Gee. Sounds tough.

My husband works far longer weekly hours than me - we also run our own business like you. In the hours I'm not at work, I do housework, sort children's school stuff, shopping, plan stuff and generally run the house. He comes home knowing there'll usually always be dinner cooked (unless I'm out later with kids swimming etc). That is my role and it seems fair to me?

I do the vast majority of the housework, but why wouldn't I? He tends to sort out stuff like car maintenance and energy suppliers etc. We discuss things like holidays and plan them together. Then I'll usually book stuff when I'm at home during the week or sometimes when I'm at work.

At weekends he'll often cook meals because he enjoys farting around in the kitchen. Our children are 10 and 8 and they usually clear the kitchen up. I taught my 8 year old how to sort and fold the clean laundry the other day and now she wants to do it as her regular job for pocket money. Fine by me! My nearly 11 year old was allowed to bike to Tesco yesterday to buy bread and milk. She was extremely excited by the responsibility. Another job me or my husband didn't have to do. Do your sons help around the house?

If you work less hours, then I feel the hours you aren't at work should be spent running the house. It's a partnership. Not sure when the term 'mental load' became a thing?! It's just life isn't it?

Those of you berating OP I think are being a bit mean spirited - she didn't say she didn't work at all - she just works less hours - that could be 2 or 30. Even with a SAHP it is not on that the worker gets to come in flop in the chair and say "make us a cuppa, where are my slippers, did you get my washing done and whats for tea?"

Life always has jobs to be done - the SAHP is working as well whatever you think the value of that is - its facilitating enabling the other party to work for a start - without which some of the higher powered jobs couldn't be done.

It is not right that all birthdays and occasions are handed over, all gift buying, seasonal house decorating, DIY and family organisation also gets handed to SAHP. When does the SAHP get a chance for feet up and 5 to themselves.

Teens can be as demanding as other small kids - there is a level of independence and also being able to help (after some meithering) but there is also a level of running them to appts, sports fixtures, events and so on that still requires parental involvement. E,g, my latest is getting some passport photos and buying some clothes before Friday - I pay for clothes and yes she is due some and we are too far out for public transport etc so I get involved.

SO yes often the partner working more hours feels a sense of entitlement regarding those unworked hours the other gets and sometimes takes advantage of that but lets face it houses don't clean themselves in 5 hrs, shopping doesn't get done, admin doesn't get done, children don't get sorted, rooms don't get tidied, decorating and DIY doesn't happen nor does the lawn or washing sort itself out - even those working the long hrs need to do some stuff and be responsible for making it happen without being reminded that it needs to happen.

I've recently started DD1 on brownies and swim lessons.

Starting brownies = filling in an online form (possibly talking to a few other parents first to find out which packs are good/have spaces)

Swimming = ringing up every week, setting up a reminder to do so again next week

Yes, that involved some organising.
To call it a huge mental load is insulting to people how actually do have lots of things to juggle.

To say mental load is nothing is utter drivel.
It can be massive depending on your own particular family circumstances.

Last night I went to bed thinking I must add toilet roll to my shopping list, and how was I going to get dd1 to football at same time as dd1 ballet in opposite direction, and I must remember to book the window cleaner, and organise a present for my best friends birthday etc etc
Dh was thinking about his golf swing.

The difference with mental load and woh is the 24-7 nature of it, and how it constantly changes. Dh works hard, but at 5pm he no longer thinks about it.

Was that your example of a massive mental load?

Well, I think it depends a little on how much time you spend on this stuff. If you're sitting up late at night sorting bills or spending your weekends doing household chores, then yes, DH needs to step up. Ie, he doesn't get to pull the "I work long hours so I need to rest when I'm home in the evenings/weekends" card. But if you are doing all these things while he's at work and you're both getting the same amount of time to chill out and relax, then you are pointlessly fighting about this.

DH is SAHD. He does a LOT of the chores and management of stuff during the day. On the weekends, we share the load of childcare/ chores/ cleaning/ dog care etc. I tend to do the bulk of the cooking/shopping/planning on weekends but he does more childcare/DIY/Pet care on weekends so it works out.