AIBU to consider having another child in these circumstances?

[PoorMe123]

I hope no one minds; I posted in chat but I've had a fairly small response and this is obviously a big decision so looking for lots of feedback.

I'm a SAHM. DH & I make ends meet and have 2 DC. We've had a particularly expensive couple of years which has left us with some small debts which we are managing and will have cleared soon. We don't have any savings and are 30. Once our DC are in school I will work again and we'll have more spare cash to get savings together. We don't own our house.

If we're going to have another DC, now is the time. If we wait & I get back into work, then it's just more time off down the line & paying for childcare etc. If we have one now, we will have them all in school by the time I'm 35 so still plenty of time for me to have a good career.

Just to make sure I'm giving you all the information, DH will get 50k around the time he turns 40 (don't want to elaborate and out myself) so we will have some money coming our way in the next 10 years. Also we'd be buying in either Scotland or the North of England where home ownership isn't so expensive.

Would we be foolish to have another child in these circumstances? DH & I would both love another child and a sibling for our existing DC.

No job is secure nowadays

And dare I say it, marriage.

It sounds very much like you've already made up your mind to have another but since you asked, no I wouldn't have a third in your position.

You seem to be basing your decision on the assumption that a lot of things will fall neatly into place in the future. Maybe they will and everything in life will work out as you hope, but nothing is guaranteed. For example, it seems very naive to assume that after so many years of being out of the job market you're going to find it easy to walk into a "good career", especially one that you can juggle alongside three school age children. Plenty of women I know who've worked their whole adult lives, have plenty of qualifications and experience and have no gaps in their CV are stuck in low paying jobs due to the prohibitive cost of childcare.

I have to agree with some pp. it seems as though you've already made up your mind and are looking for people to agree with you to justify it to yourself. If you're happy with your plan then by all means go ahead.

Personally I wouldn't. We rent and have one child. We too have some debt and no savings. I don't particularly want any more however if (ad it's a big if) we decided to have another it wouldn't be at least until we'd bought a house and dd was in school as I would prefer a bigger age gap. I have a plan of what I want to achieve over the next 5 years and a house purchase is at the top of that list.

You're only 30 why don't you wait, clear your debts, get back into employment, purchase a house and then reconsider. Would you be, for example, able to do this within 5 years? or at least be better off financially. I'm just thinking of you start back at work before having a child you'll be able to save more and have the added bonus of maternity leave.

I think you and your husband have put a lot of thought into it OP and you both want it, so I'd go for the third child.

lau888
As you are basing your decision on costs, have you considered the cost implications if your potential third child turns out to be multiple children or has a life-changing degree of SEND?

That sounds like another what if, like what if he loses his job, that while it is a possibility, it shouldn't be a deciding factor. If you're in that kind of mindset then you get frozen by indecision.

My husband and I want 2 more children, I have a high chance due to genetics and age of having fraternal twins. If the next is a single birth we won't decide against having a 3rd because it might turn out to be twins. Hell it could turn out out to be triplets or more, you never know, but it's not a reason to not try for a third.

Contrary to what many posters think, DH & I have not already decided. I know it might seem like that because I've argued with a few of the posters who have picked flaws in my plan, but I've only done that because I'm so desperately keen to have another child and I want to make it work. That doesn't mean to say that I'm not taking on board your points. I really am and there seem to now be loads of people who think this would be a bad idea. I would be a fool not to listen to these opinions. If only we could have a little lottery win, that would solve all of our problems! there's a lot for us to think about here. If love was all a child needed, I'd have another tomorrow.

Do Add into your plans that many mortgage lenders will take into account the number of dependants you have on your application. An extra child could be the difference between borrowing what you need or not being able to borrow enough.

I agree op, if love was all that was needed I would have six or more dc. A house full. To give your existing children the best chance, and for you as a family to reach a point where you have some security I would think very carefully about having another child.

I believe we have hormones that encourage us to want babies, even when every ounce of rational thinking would say otherwise.

We have spoken about money alot on here, but do you also have a good, solid support network? Money is not the only thing you will need, you will also need plenty of support and energy and help.

Babies don't stay babies for very long, and the average child cost a fortune not to mention the toll it takes on our bodies and every other resource.

Go with your heart if it's what you both really want. Money can be made any time, children are the most enjoyable thing and will make you happier than any amount of savings. As long as you can afford to have another child in your current situation then I don't see why not.
There are millions of families in thousands of pounds of debt but to look at would appear well off with their nice houses, cars and holidays (all adding to their existing debt). Not to mention the people that don't work, live in social housing paid for by the local authority and have numerous children that are also paid for by the state. I think you are in a good position in comparison, go for it!

Your financial situation is not the most important factor in your life if you can afford a roof over your head, and food to eat. We have way too much stuff in the West and most of it is non-essential. We pay huge amounts for tons of extra curricular stuff for our kids that we feel guilty about if we don’t provide it. Our kids start their little clubs earlier and earlier in their lives, and why? So that we can be made to spend more money across their lifetimes! And I say this as someone firmly entrenched in all that, but a change in circumstance (planned, all positive) has made us rethink the way we live to a certain extent.

We personally decided to stick at 2 for several reasons, but not financial ones. If you’ve sat down and are confident then you can afford the basics then by all means have a third.

I'd recommend you do out some seriously detailed budgets via spreadsheet outlining various scenarios, then try to live according to one for six months, then make a decision.

If your DH has a fairly guaranteed public sector job, I don't think you're insane to factor that in. Worst case scenario he presumably would be made redundant and get a pay-out. But I guess the q is, in that worst-case scenario, could he find another job? How long would it take? How long would redundancy money last? If food bills, utilities etc go up, how much wriggle room do you have?

And for when you go back to work- What are actual wrap around childcare costs where you are? I'd ring up providers and actually get an answer to that- we calculated costs for crèche based on what friends were paying but getting a place in their crèche was impossible and others are v high demand and more expensive so will cost more, I imagine the same could be true of wrap around care.

If you think that a 3rd child will cost x a month now, also factor in just how much you'll be left with after tax, childcare, travel, uniforms, etc etc when they're all in school. If you had to move from your rented accommodation, what would the cost of that be? And the new higher rent? It's v unlikely you'll go five years without some minor upset, probably two, so think through the most likely Ones and their real cost. Then pick a slightly pessimistic number for those costs monthly and start putting it automatically in a savings account. If after six months you're happy living on the smaller amount, then use those savings to put towards debts, start ttc and keep putting the amount in a bank account so you build up a nine month buffer.

We tried to do something similar and it was a really useful exercise. What we thought in our heads we could live on was far too ambitious when you factor in perfectly reasonable one-off expenses. You can't predict everything but you can work out a lot of the costs and if you're reluctant to try living on a reduced amount in advance that should tell you a lot about the reality of it.

Bloody hell there are a lot of negative Nancys on this thread. You can't live your life always expecting the worst. My DH died at 38 and left me alone with my son. There are no guarantees in life, have another baby if that's what you want

I don’t think it is negative to consider all the financial implications
And I would be more likely to say just go for it if she didn’t already have 2 children and was still only 30.
Being 30 gives her plenty of time to go for a third child at a later date when the debts are gone, she is back in work so entitled to ML and MPay and maybe a small cushion of savings.

@NoArmaniNoPunani @PoorMe123
im shocked at the number of people who see having children as a numbers game as no Armani says, you dont know what the future holds - no one does- as I posted earlier you won't look back on your life and think: " oh I wish id never had dc3" but there's a chance you will look back and think " I wish I HAD had dc3!" if you decide not to have another. Things have a way of working out - good luck with your decision xx

Think of the planet, will you? We don't need any more humans.

Stick with two. Buy a house.

"If people had a choice no one would choose to rent"

I really don't agree with that. People own property in this country partly because state pensions aren't adequate and they're always being told they need to own.
If I was rich, I'd definitely choose to rent. I'm renting now because I can't buy, but it has lots of advantages.

I would do it. You sound as if you've thought about the worst case scenario's. I would get my career on track as soon as possible though and put all of the life/critical illness insurances into place too.

If I were the OP, I wouldn't. You may only have small debts but I think you should work on paying them off and then see how things go. We currently own a couple of properties and a joint income of £60k a year but even as someone who works in the court, my job is not stable. I've yet to see any civil service job that is stable.

I only had a few thousand in saving earlier this year, then I was in a car accident and it wiped me out. I had to rely on my partner and I'm still recovering from the injuries from the end of March. How would you manage if you or your partner were injured? Plus 50k is really not that much and it will soon disappear especially if you plan on buying. You can't guarantee how much house prices will be in your area in a few years time. We had our flat valued in 2015 at 95k, valued again this year at £160k and we don't live in the South. We're in South Manchester. I'm 36 so as soon as I'm recovered we will be TTC. If I were your age I would wait and build some financial security.

Why have another child? You just about manage as you are. Be grateful - lots of people long for one child, never mind two!

I would have another. Nothing in your post screams "don't do it"!

I am really struggling with the idea that having children can be reduced to calculations on a spreadsheet.

Some years ago, my mum said you only ever regret the children you didn't have.

If you think you can manage then go for it. I probably wouldn’t and in fact have recently made that choice. I have two girls, our second has health needs, major ones actually. I kid you not when she was eight months old and finally home from hospital, I wanted another. Thank fuck I didn’t. (Obviously this doesn’t really apply to you) things are difficult, my mental health is truly fucked and each day is so hard to get through. Whenever I’m ill or my partner is ill (neither work as we are carers) it’s fucking hard with two and genuinely this was a point that helped me decide not to have a third. It’s just an extra of everything. I’m already struggling and as the girls get older things are more expensive and when they start school you have homework and trips etc to pay for and organise around. We have an increased chance of any child born now sharing or having a similar condition to our younger child. I couldn’t do it, I really couldn’t. If it was to be guaranteed a healthy baby I’d be more inclined to go for it but just the possibility of any health defect is what’s telling me no. I want to point out, I do not regret having my second she is awesome and is a great character but very difficult to look after so sometimes I regret trying for a second when we did or I get upset at the very early miscarriage I had and wondering if that baby would have been healthy. Then there is the possibility of a multiple birth and I was like nope, can’t do it. Maybe in a few years but certainly not now. No one can plan for these things obviously, but could you handle them if they did happen?

my mum said you only ever regret the children you didn't have.

I see this kind of thing a lot. I don’t regret my child, as in who she is and I adore her but I do sometimes regret because of her condition. Sometimes I think how life would be if she wasn’t here and then I feel bad. But the reality is her life is very difficult for her and us. Then there is always the worry about how long will she have etc and needing to live in a really clean house when you have no energy to do anything isn’t easy. Hospital appointments to work around, our elder daughter having to miss school on those days as sometimes you just can’t do some of them alone. Obviously this is based on my experience and mine alone. But to say that a child is never regretted is wrong I believe. Sometimes I do wonder if we never had her but then I remember things she’s done and I’d know I’d miss her etc. But if I didn’t know her I wouldn’t have those feelings would I?

I am really struggling with the idea that having children can be reduced to calculations on a spreadsheet.

It’s all very well to imply that people who carefully weigh up their finances before deciding whether to have more children are heartless accountants, but if we all thought the same as you, the planet would be even more fucked than it already is. Anyone who is responsible will think about it, at least, even if they do go on to have another baby. And of course accidents happen. But there’s nothing edifying about choosing to produce a massive family without even considering how you’re going to support them - often it just leads to children living in poverty while their feckless parents convince themselves that “love is all you need”.

Two is environmentally responsible. If you need a third child, why not adopt? We have an existing overpopulation problem. There are not enough school places, NHS resources, houses. Yet people continue to flippantly have three children- meaning each generation gets bigger- while children needing love languish in care.

Drives me mad.

Hi OP - a previous poster asked if you were trying for a different sex to the two DC you have and you didn’t answer?