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Fatshaming

647 replies

travelinterest · 12/10/2018 08:59

After a conversation with friends, and with obesity (especially in young people) becoming a bigger crisis than smoking in our society, am I unreasonable to think that as we villanise smoking and drinking, should we fat shame more to encourage people to change their lifestyles. It's certainly worked with reducing smoking rates. Don't attack me (I've lost 2 stone). Just wondering why we target smoking more than fast food?

OP posts:
mooncuplanding · 13/10/2018 14:42

mooncup you have been watching and reading too much pseudoscience/nutrition on the internet

Which part of what I am saying are you classing as pseudoscience?

necromumda · 13/10/2018 14:46

Well your description of insulin resistance, hyperinsulinaemia and the use of leptin isn't quite right for one.

mooncuplanding · 13/10/2018 14:49

necromumda

What I find fascinating is that you describe yourself as clinically obese so something you are doing around how you take in and manage your fuel is not working - how are you going stop your BMI going up further?
The advice you are following at the moment is not working as you are clinically obese, yet you dismiss any other hypothesis as pseudoscience. Like I said upthread, that is what I call a lack of personal responsibility - a total lack of ability and intention to challenge your knowledge around nutrition.

necromumda · 13/10/2018 14:50

Its an absence of leptin that makes subjects eat. Its ghrelin that increases appetite

mooncuplanding · 13/10/2018 14:51

Well your description of insulin resistance, hyperinsulinaemia and the use of leptin isn't quite right for one.

I mentioned leptin only because it is involved in triggering appetite

Insulin resistance I haven't actually named. But in what way has what I said about insulin been incorrect?

And I haven't even mentioned hyperinsulinaemia

Stillwishihadabs · 13/10/2018 14:53

You see I have some sympathy with the whole "metabolic symdrome" discourse and the avoiding very quick release carbs etc. Then some idiot always comes along and says people are overweight because of bannanas. This quite simply bollocks. Bananas are a great mixture of fast and slow release carbohydrates and a fantastic source of potassium. They are nature's sports bar and I just don't believe people are obese because they eat too much whole fruit.

necromumda · 13/10/2018 14:54

Actually, my weight isn't going up because I am currently eating and exercising at a negative balance,

The advice you are following at the moment is not working I have not claimed to be trying to actually do anything...what a strange comment

necromumda · 13/10/2018 14:55

Leptin actually reduces appetite. Its the lack of leptin which is the problem

lljkk · 13/10/2018 15:01

I eat a high carb diet & I am not obese or constantly hungry. I sleep badly, too so my leptin levels should be crap. Yet I'm still not obese or constantly hungry. I'm very good at just skipping meals, tbh. My parents & brothers were plump at my age.

Am I freak of nature?

Stillwishihadabs · 13/10/2018 15:02

ASUBSCRIBE

SEARCH

I'll just leave this here :
Food & Recipes News
7
That's the diagnosis delivered by food author Michael Pollan in
As part of an effort to bring new ideas to the national debate on food issues, the CDC invited Pollan a harsh critic of U.S. food policies to address CDC researchers and to meet with leaders of the federal agency.

"The French paradox is that they have better heart health than we do despite being a cheese-eating, wine-swilling, fois-gras-gobbling people," Pollan said. "The American paradox is we are a people who worry unreasonably about dietary health yet have the worst diet in the world."

In various parts of the world, Pollan noted, necessity has forced human beings to adapt to all kinds of diets.

"The Masai subsist on cattle blood and meat and milk and little else. Native Americans subsist on beans and maize. And the Inuit in Greenland subsist on whale blubber and a little bit of lichen," he said. "The irony is, the one diet we have invented for ourselves the Western diet is the one that makes us sick."

Snowballing rates of obesity, diabetes, and heart disease in the U.S. can be traced to our unhealthy diet. So how do we change?

CONTINUE READING BELOW

7 Words & 7 Rules for Eating
Pollan says everything he's learned about food and health can be summed up in seven words: "Eat food, not too much, mostly plants."

Probably the first two words are most important. "Eat food" means to eat real food vegetables, fruits, whole grains, and, yes, fish and meat and to avoid what Pollan calls "edible food-like substances."

Here's how:

Don't eat anything your great grandmother wouldn't recognize as food. "When you pick up that box of portable yogurt tubes, or eat something with 15 ingredients you can't pronounce, ask yourself, "What are those things doing there?" Pollan says.
Don’t eat anything with more than five ingredients, or ingredients you can't pronounce.
Stay out of the middle of the supermarket; shop on the perimeter of the store. Real food tends to be on the outer edge of the store near the loading docks, where it can be replaced with fresh foods when it goes bad.
Don't eat anything that won't eventually rot. "There are exceptions honey but as a rule, things like Twinkies that never go bad aren't food," Pollan says.
It is not just what you eat but how you eat. "Always leave the table a little hungry," Pollan says. "Many cultures have rules that you stop eating before you are full. In Japan, they say eat until you are four-fifths full. Islamic culture has a similar rule, and in German culture they say, 'Tie off the sack before it's full.'"
Families traditionally ate together, around a table and not a TV, at regular meal times. It's a good tradition. Enjoy meals with the people you love. "Remember when eating between meals felt wrong?" Pollan asks.
Don't buy food where you buy your gasoline. In the U.S., 20% of food is eaten in the car.

mooncuplanding · 13/10/2018 15:02

You see I have some sympathy with the whole "metabolic symdrome" discourse and the avoiding very quick release carbs etc. Then some idiot always comes along and says people are overweight because of bannanas. This quite simply bollocks. Bananas are a great mixture of fast and slow release carbohydrates and a fantastic source of potassium. They are nature's sports bar and I just don't believe people are obese because they eat too much whole fruit.

OK, if you read what I wrote properly I did not say bananas make you fat. I said that bananas spike your insulin. That is true. They have 20g of sugar in them. And why they are good for sport.

However, if you look at the example on that post which was about looking at whether calories in calories out is a simple thing (i.e. it doesn't matter what the calories you eat consist of) then comparing a biscuit to a banana in the scheme of this is quite similar in their macros. They will both spike insulin and therefore would not be useful in the hypothesis that eating carbs, protein or fat have different effects on your body

mooncuplanding · 13/10/2018 15:04
  • eat a high carb diet & I am not obese or constantly hungry. I sleep badly, too so my leptin levels should be crap. Yet I'm still not obese or constantly hungry. I'm very good at just skipping meals, tbh. My parents & brothers were plump at my age.

Am I freak of nature?*

The skipping meals is probably what is going on - you are fasting and that is a really good way to get in metabolic shape

Stillwishihadabs · 13/10/2018 15:04

Or in even simpler terms: " don't eat too much crap".

Stillwishihadabs · 13/10/2018 15:08

I disagree , most biscuits have very little fibre so the energy is much faster release, also no micronutrients to prevent cramp.

A biscuit and a banana are not the same at all.

Stillwishihadabs · 13/10/2018 15:10

Link the studies showing an insulin spike following a banana please.

mooncuplanding · 13/10/2018 15:11

Of course biscuits and bananas are not the same, but they will both spike insulin - that is the point that is relevant here

It would be impossible to test whether a carb calorie is the same as a fat calorie in terms of weight gain if you used a biscuit (carb) and a banana (carb)

That doesn't mean bananas make you fat, bananas don't have more nutritional value than biscuits etc.

mooncuplanding · 13/10/2018 15:14

www.healthline.com/nutrition/bananas-diabetes#section1

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1395467

Ripeness of the banana matters

necromumda · 13/10/2018 15:15

Bananas won't "spike" insulin. In fact, the GI of a 120g banana ranges between 30 for a very green one to 51 for a ripe one. Carbs are around 25 g. The amount does elicit an insulin response as its over 15 g, sure, but I wouldn't say its a "spike".

Stillwishihadabs · 13/10/2018 15:15

Not to the same degree. Because of the fibre in a banana the sugar is absorbed more slowly, therefore the insulin response will be flatter. If you don't believe me ask an endocrinologist.

necromumda · 13/10/2018 15:17

In fact, your f first link actually suggests there is no spike as well Mooncup.

Stillwishihadabs · 13/10/2018 15:17

Exactly necro

necromumda · 13/10/2018 15:18

To be fair, the fat in a creamy biscuit may, indeed, lower the GI as well but yep, nutritionally a desert).

mooncuplanding · 13/10/2018 15:18

Banana is a carb. Are you seriously trying to argue this is not the case?

necromumda · 13/10/2018 15:20

Banana is not a carb. It CONTAINS 25 g carbs per serving approximately. It has a lowish GI so does not "spike" anything unless you eat a hella lot.

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