To make a serious complaint against this nurse and ask for advice on how to do it

[Oldsu]

First of all may I say I have every respect for the nursing profession, they are undervalued, underpaid and in the main are dedicated professionals - But NOT this one

Back story my friend is a carer for her DH who has early onset dementia (63) last year she had regular visits from a district nurse, because he had pressure sores, she didn't like this nurse, said she was rude, of course some people are by nature a bit brusque but my friend said she had complained about her and since then she had been really rude so I arranged to be at her house during the visit

And yes she was bloody rude, patronising and nasty she shouted at my friend and her DH, I wasn't present obviously when her DH was being examined or when medical issues were discussed but I heard some of what she said and recognised the tone and nature of a bully, I asked my friend if she wanted to make another complaint and I would be a witness but she said leave it because it would just make her worse.

This week however the actions of this nurse has made me so angry that I want something done about her, I want her to be made aware by a higher authority of the consequences of her actions I don't want her sacked but maybe to undergo further training before she is allowed to go near vulnerable patients and their carers.

This week started ok, my friend told me the nurses were coming on Friday( they still come every month even though the pressure sores have healed) , however in the early hours of Thursday I got a call from her saying tragically her DH had died, it was sudden because he had no other illness or conditions aside from the dementia.

Yesterday she told me they were going to do a PM today so I have been at her house all day because she is in a state of shock

About 3pm the doorbell rang it was the nurses and one was the one she had a problem with I was behind her when she apologised to them saying her DH had died, instead of being sympathetic, this nurse then proceeded to SHOUT at my friend saying why hadn't she been told, she had come all this way, for nothing when she could have been seeing other patients , what happened next was a blur, I told my friend to go inside I would deal with this I pushed past the nurses and stood by the gate making sure they couldn't get out and then let her have it with both barrels, I didn't shout or swear but I have a loud voice so the neighbours came out, I said how dared she speak to my friend like that, I believe I called her a nasty woman and that she was a disgrace amongst other things the other nurse looked terrified but I was so angry (still am I am shaking as I write this).

So what I want to know is can I make a complaint on my friends behalf as she not in a good state to do it herself, If I can't is there a time limit for her to make a complaint, what's the procedure and most importantly will anything actually be done.

Sorry for the long post but wanted to give all the details

OP I have not advice sorry. I just wanted to say well done!!
What a cruel heartless woman that nurse is. Who would shout at someone who has just lost their husband.
Thank goodness your freind has you. My thoughts are with your friend. Best wishes to you

Oldsu

You consider that your anger was justified, but admit someone who had their route of escape blocked looked "terrified". Think about it for a while. Maybe you think psychological terror is quite okay, but if the person involved has not done anything wrong, it is terrifying.

I think you did an amazing job and you are an amazing friend. No advice other than raise hell and make sure someone knows about this and deals with it.

SummerIsEasy it was clear that my anger was directed at the other nurse Maybe you think psychological terror is quite okay NO I don't actually, but if the other nurse was terrified then its her colleague who needs to take the blame for that, its her callous indifference to my friends grief that caused my anger and I am making no apologies, I didn't shout, I didn't swear and to be fair both nurses were twice my size and could have got past me quite easily

BUT if you really want to know about psychological terror lets talk about what the other nurse put my friend through, she hurt her back lifting her DH (she is disabled herself) next day this nurse comes in and says her floor is dirty no interest at all in my friends back, just the floor is dirty, the week after suddenly 2 social workers made a surprise visit saying they had reports that my friends DH is being neglected, so who do you think called them in - one guess.

Or what about the dogs? she has 4 little yorkies that she loves and in actual fact the dogs were the only thing that's her DH responded to, they were always locked in the kitchen during the nurses visit until she decided to go into the kitchen and then it was 'oh I didn't realise you had so many dogs' the week after the RSPCA turns up with 'concerns about the dogs so who do you think called them in? - of course both the SS and RSPCA had no concerns about her DH or the dogs.

Do we have any proof it was her of course not but I don't believe in coincidences.

I think being scared out of your mind that your DH will be taken from you or your little dogs being taken from you is a far better example of psychological terror then being confronted by a 5 ft 63 year old woman with dodgy knees.

I'd be making a complaint to two different authorities: her manager and the nursing licensing body.

Her employer may undertake disciplinary action against her and she may also be sanctioned by her licensing body. Her behaviour was in unprofessional in the extreme and not just because your friend had recently experienced a bereavement.

As a nursing instructor, if one of my students behaved that way, I would send them home and discuss with my boss about failing them on the spot. I've little doubt but that the college would back me up.

Op take care of yourself, you are obviously a caring lady who is doing the best for her friend

This nurse sounds terrifying and should not be in the profession at all

Please make a complaint but do bare in mind you will probably not have a satisfactory resolution. The nurse will bring her side of the story which will be all about the dirty house, dogs and your " assault" of her which will muddy the waters. I'm not saying you shouldn't have let rip at her but it would have been better from a complaint making point of view if you had not done so.
The important thing here is your and your good friends health and moving forward through her grief.

This is so awful. I used to be a home carer and once I was working in an area I hadn't worked before with different clients. I turned up at one house and the wife answered and told me the husband had died a few days before! The office had failed to tell me. I was SO mortified and apologised profusely to this poor woman but luckily she was lovely and we had a cup of tea and talked about him. I can't imagine behaving like this nurse did and I am now a registered nurse.

@Oldsu what a fantastic friend you are, also you're right about dealing with bullies! This woman is a disgrace to her profession.

I'm afraid I think Nofunkingworriesmate has a point I'm afraid.
While I can see your reasons for it, I suspect your response would probably be considered abuse in a complaint situation, especially given that you blocked their exit. And even a 'loud voice' sounds a bit dubious if it was enough to bring the neighbours outside.
Unfortunately this will probably sabotage the likeliness of your complaint being upheld to a degree. The comments from the nurse were completely unreasonable and you / your friend should definitely raise them despite this.
On a practical level, I would suspect that for confidentiality reasons your friend would need to make the complaint, not you, but I'm not totally sure about that. The time frames aren't tight though so she can do so at a later date and the fact you've made notes at the time of the event will help.

I don’t agree with the nurse’s behaviour but the nmc are a joke they will only take action if the police were called and a crime that cannot be silenced and might be exposed in a newspaper took place.

You can still complain but everyone who does whistleblow in the Nhs, well nothing ever comes of it or ever changes unless you have a video or some concrete proof and you are not allowed to record anything so it’s like it never happened. They might ask her about it but if she has another nurse as a witness they won’t take it very far. Obv not right but that is just how is it so she won’t lose her job or anything I suspect.

4 dogs is a lot though is it not? A dirty floor when someone has open wounds/bed sores is not exactly on either, there’s a breeding ground for germs and infection.

Sorry for your friends loss.

So sorry to hear about your friend's bereavement and behaviour exhibited here. You must raise a formal complaint to the Nursing and Midwifery Council. Unprofessional behaviour is an extremely serious contravention of the Professional Standards and the NMC will view this very seriously. As an earlier poster advised, write a detailed statement immediately to submit. You should also complain to the Community Health Trust or General Practice employing the District Nurse.

I'm an AHP, this sort of behaviour makes me furious.

Good luck. I've given the link for the NMC below.

www.nmc.org.uk

Mumto2babyboys - I doubt the floor was dirty, and even if it was, do you really think the man was rolling around on it? Don’t be silly.

And summeriseasy - you sound like an utter idiot.

Pals are crap. You should get your friends permission to make the complaint. She may need your support more in other ways, or she may be pleased.
Copy in the nurses manager and patients gp. Too many of these bossy people in healthcare.

It’s cross contamination and poor infection control. The 4 dogs would have been walking on the dirty floor then can spread germs onto her poor husbands bed when he had open wounds. Not silly just cross contamination

I really doubt the nmc will do anything becuase there was shouting/raised voices and blocked exits and they won’t investigate non crimes. They are supposed to govern but do very little without actual evidence. It’s a he said/ she said situation that won’t get looked at unfortunately

let us know if they do uphold your complaint, they will say they are looking into it then fob you off with the no evidence email i suspect not even a written letter.

As pps have said, report to their line manager, and copy the letter to the NMC. She will be fully investigated. Your behaviour was a reaction to hers and you are not a registered professional, she is, and has to maintain certain standards which I assure you, she has not. If you don't make the complaint straight away, I urge you to write__ down, as soon as possible, the facts of what happened so you can easily recall them later and don't miss out any of her disgusting behaviour.
I'm very sorry for your friend.

Think about it for a while. Maybe you think psychological terror is quite okay, but if the person involved has not done anything wrong, it is terrifying.

Nonsense. Listening to someone expressing their anger to a colleague, even loudly, is hardly the worst thing that will ever happen to a nurse during their working hours. It could well be that the nurse was scared about the possible repercussions on herself by reason of her failure to tell her colleague to shut the hell up.

This is awful and I'm sorry that you're friend and you are dealing with it.
It certainly sounds like your friend has someone wonderful backing her up though

In your complaint I would include the 'coincidences' with SS and RSPCA that you believe her to be responsible. And any all clear reports they may have left. Might just give a wide picture of this nurses general character. And no, they don't seem like coincidences at all to me either!!

I had a mean and dismissive midwife once, not on this level at all but still think about her and that I wish I'd have said something. You're doing the right thing by your friend

Wow some of you guys have lots of faith that the nhs and nmc are going to investigate this and do something. Obviously never worked in healthcare then.

Its not a criminal matter but let us know if they do uphold a complaint and don’t fob you off

I honestly don’t see how reporting a dirty floor when a patient has open wounds was not the correct thing to do. If he had been in a care home in a room with a dirty floor breeding germs and obviously unhygienic would you not report that to someone? I would

As an ex district nurse of many years we often visited in pairs for visits that were known to be potentially "difficult". The pairing meaning that each nurse felt supported and were witnesses to any negative interaction on either side, so they were quite within their rights to do that and I would say quite right to do so too. It was also done for moving and handling issues, as you say, your friend herself hurt her back.
The nurses behaviour however sounds terrible. District nursing is stressful and the service is on its knees in many areas but that's no excuse. You must report.

You or your friend should complain. This nurse really should not be allowed to carry on like this.
Your compliant will either need to come for your friend, include her explicit permission for you to complain on her behalf, or focus on how this affected you. You can’t complain ‘for’ someone else.
It will definitely be investigated. The action taken will depend to a degree in how her employers tend to deal with this sort of thing - ranging from an apology or wish-washy explanation to dismissal.
As another poster has said, it does help to give managers something concrete to act on, and if a number of people who encounter someone like this complain, then they have good evidence for disciplinary procedures etc.
Not surprised you’re still shaken up OP, whole thing is shocking.

So so many nice Nhs staff whistleblow with full details of the other staff’s pins and who was involved. Nothing ever changes unless someone has actual proof so I doubt this nurse will get even suspended. Care homes etc only get closed when someone has videoed what’s gone on and exposes it reguardless of how many complaints were made.

Not saying the nurse shouldn’t be suspended but just that the system doenst work, you need evidence which they have none of

My jaw dropped at the visits from social services and the RSPCA. There is no way that that was a coincidence. Your poor friend.