To think our parents were all negligent?

[hooveringhamabeads]

(Lighthearted)

By today’s standards at least?

Inspired by some of the threads I’ve read this week, about 7 year olds playing out alone, or a baby being left for 5 mins while the Mum goes to the shop, I’ve been thinking about my own childhood and some of the (perfectly normal for then) stuff that happened. For context, I was born in the early 80s.

As babies, car seats weren’t a thing, so we’d be put in the carrycot on the back seat. My DM says that if we were asleep when we got to town, she’d leave us in the car, lock it and go and do her shopping.

We had a Subaru van with no seats in the back, and my brother and I would sit in the back, each on a wheel arch, and we’d love it because we’d get flung around the back as we were travelling along, which we found hilarious.

If we were on holiday at Butlins my parents would use the ‘baby listening service’ while they went out of an evening, which consisted of one person patrolling the massive site and putting their ear to the relevant doors to see if anyone was crying. What they did if there was I have no idea as no one had mobiles then.

My friend who’s DCs are now 24 and 28 used to leave her kids alone when holidaying abroad when they went out at night. But they’d leave a shoe in the door so that the kids weren’t shut in if there was a fire .

It’s a miracle we all survived

M6 grandmother had a soft-top Fiat 500, which was often used by whichever of my parents wasn't using the family car. As children we would crowd in the back (with at least a couple of friends, so 5 or6 of us) and stand up with heads and shoulders poking out the top, while driving, sometimes even on motorways (which were few and far between back then) but A roads definitely.

No seat belts at all. Didn't even exist.

We were allowed tojust go off and play, and be out all day. Parents would have no idea where we were or who with. Normal.

Pox Parties - any child got chicken pox, measles, etc all the local children (including babies) would come to play in order to catch it and get immunity.

Travelling to and from school alone from age 5.

Travelling on train from London to Cornwall supervised only by the Guard, aged about 6. Other long train journeys too, ie to Devon or Dorset or Manchester.

Proper chemistry sets with actual real chemicals in.

My dad would stop the car when turning into our street so we could jump out and ride on the running boards or sit on the bonnet while he drove the rest of the way home.

Oh there are so many ways we were so much freer than children today. Much more dangerous, yes, but.....

Well, I feel for you both then Strippervicar but I'd have hoped you could have built the bond later. I agree we'll rue the day re more freedom and dealing with difficulties for children but wrt our relationships with our children, we place more thought and importance on that now and that's a positive.

Cherry I think we are already seeing the consequences in terms of mental ill health.

I used to get a bottle of milky tea with 2 sugars from the age of 2 :) can't bear the stuff now!

Someone asked why we don't still do these things and suggested "outside judgement" stuff. I'd agree with that. In very rural areas kids are still free range - they go out through fields of stock - leap across burns and even play on the beach. We all joke it's a secret we could never share with our "city friends".

I too remember people drinking and driving. Wasn't even an issue, unbelievably!

Pox parties were ironically popular with alternative types. The type of parent today who would not vaccinate.

My parents went on holiday when I was 13 and left us at home. My grandparents lived in the next street but still.

Me too, Hoozz

Um, is that you, sis?

I used to ride in the boot of the car, and if we went to the farm shop or a plant nursery I'd be left in the car, as it was less boring.

I was a child of the 1960s and ‘adventure playgrounds’ or basically building sites were the thing then. Our Mums used to pay by the day for us to go to these and play amoungst the debris, help make fires and swing from old ropes. I trod on a rusty nail in a plank on on occasion (was wearing flip-flops) and developed a poisoned leg. I still have a luge scar on my leg from when it was lanced.

Mummies these days would die rather than let their DC attend such fun and frolics.

I don't think parents worried less about us.
I do think too many parents today are selfish and put their own peace of mind before their children's right to manage age appropriate risk.

I was born in 1975 and experienced a lot of the above. No seat belts in the cars and my sister and I were always begging my dad to go faster around the corners, which he did, so we both rattled around in the back.

We were outside most of the day, no adults around. We played on building sites, swam in a disused quarry pond, fished in a flooded mine shaft, built rafts to 'float' on water. We used to get the bus to the swimming pool and walk 5 miles home so we could buy sweets. The walk home was always via playing in a river. We rode our bikes for hours across the fields near us. Came home when the lights came on or we were hungry.

I did know one kid who died though - he and his friends were playing on a railway bridge and he fell over onto the electrical cables. A friend of my sister died too, but that was in the Warrington bombing.

I worked on an adventure playground. Young kids playing with fires, hammers and nails. The only serious accident I ever remember is a kid breaking his arm when he fell off an ordinary swing. He just landed awkwardly.

I remember seeing the doctor when I was 4, because I had a massive polyp in my nose. I never saw a doctor again until I went myself aged 15 because I had acne. My mother treated ny ailments we had. She never used a thermometer, she would feel our forehead with the back of her hand and could tell from the heat whether we had a fever or not.
I never had antibiotics until I got a chest infection after flu when I was 18.
I was more cautious with my children in the 70s and 80s, but nothing like many parents are today. It is all relevant to how society changes.

I know two kids who died in a house fire and a boy who had very bad burns after falling into an open fire as a toddler. Also one kid who died of cancer. Doubt with smoke alarms that the two kids would have died in the house fire today.

The big improvements in children safety have been around cars and fires.

Just like prettypossums I was trusted and largely unaccountable throughout my young life 😀 Lots of outdoor stuff too, walked everywhere unaccompanied, to school etc. When I went to university I would call my Mum approximately once a week, if that. And took lots of inappropriate transport - everyone squeezed into minis in those days, there would not have been room for a seatbelt clip 🤣

The working assumption through childhood and as a young adult was that everything was fine, not that something bad had happened. Mobiles, trackers and technology today should have brought reassurance but if anything it has created more worry, abetted by the lurid newspaper reporting and increased visibility. I really feel for parents.

Children of the 60/70/80s are now in awe that they survived all the danger, or are actually wondering if they were technically neglected. 🙄

The one thing that amuses me now is that I really notice when you see an unprotected cliff face, jetty or other precipice left as nature intended - no railings , mesh fences and 20 ft high warning signs. A rare sight!

Sounds more 50s and 60s, than 1980s.
I remember the baby listening service at holiday resorts, went there with my parents and other relatives as a child, there were a couple of babies/ toddlers in group and that facility was used.

Certainly children were often left alone at home for a short while, often an older one looking after little ones. Prams in front gardens so babies would get fresh air and sun.

Kids went out and about on their own much younger.

I was an adopted only child and my mother was extremely over protective, I didn't enjoy the same freedoms as other children - and resented it!

My husband went on a school holiday, was dropped off at a pick up point (somewhere fairly rural) early and he and another boy spent a couple of hours larking about in woods and fields before parents collected them! You really can't imagine anything like that now.

There were less cars around and though bad things did happen, they appeared to be far less frequent judging by the media. We didn't hear about child abuse or abductions every week.

I certainly don't think we can judge your parents as neglectful, they lived in different times.

We had no seatbelts in the back of our cars until we were pretty far into junior school and, like others, I fought with my siblings over who got to sit in the back of my aunt’s estate car with her two Rottweilers! My Mum was on her own, so she often left us in the car (to tear lumps out of each other!) while she did the Sainsbury’s run. When my Dad has us on contact one weekend we sat in the car outside his friend’s house for an entire football match, he popped out once at half-time! I walked home from school by myself and played with friends in the woods/stream when I was 7 or 8. My Mum would often go in to the neighbours’ for a glass of wine and a chat after we were in bed and left us in the house. At 11 I’d cook dinner for my siblings when we got in from school before she got in from work (we had separate children’s tea).
I think we are setting our kids up for helplessness in some areas. For example, I do think a child ought to know how to cook a simple meal independently by the time they’re about 8, and how to get on a bus etc.
I do remember getting scared sometimes if someone creepy-looking loitered by the car or something but other than that I don’t think we thought anything of it!

In the 80's. me and my friend Andrea used to babysit her nephews when we were only about 13 and not very mature 13 year olds at that time. We once refused to change the toddler's nappy as it was 'disgusting' (Yes, I am ashamed of this).
I remember once seeing a 'gang' of young kids from toddler to about 7 going past, then stopping and playing with sharp large kitchen knives that they had bought with them. They also had a baby with them.
Even for the 80's that was pretty bad.

Reading the posts about leaving the baby while she went downstairs to the shop made me think exactly the same :-) I was a 60s baby...

I was born in 1979 and had a wonderful free range childhood that my kids can only dream about. Even when you add in real danger, life threatening experience, perverts and accidents I wouldn't swap lives with a child of today! Which says a lot about how great that freedom feels!

Negligent is the wrong word, it's not appropriate to say that when times were different.

I was born just after the war. I walked to school on my own from the age of 5, it was over a mile away. We played out all the time and only came home when we were hungry, we had wonderful childhoods full of freedom that today's kids can only imagine. When I had mine in the early 70s, all babies were left in prams outside of shops and I left mine outside in the garden in all weathers.

I think as with most things that a balanced approach is best.

I think we can look back with rose tinted glasses at the past and nostalgically remember the freedom and carefree nature of our childhoods, but there were some children that didn't flourish in that environment and actually would have benefited from more of the parenting standards we have today.

I have often wondered though if this difference in parenting standards explains why parents were able to manage without many of the inventions we have today such as disposable nappies, baby wipes etc. If they spent less time actively parenting then I guess it freed up more time to do domestic chores and actually potentially have a bit of a break in the day. Chucking kids out in the morning for them to only return at teatime is infinitely less labour intensive than ferrying kids between extracurricular activities and playdates etc.

I agree with most of CherryPavlova's post, particularly that we do nothing for our children's mental health by doing everything for them including trying to solve all their problems. We keep hearing about snowflakes, which isn't a very nice term, but does succinctly describe younger people who think they should have endless choice and non-stop happiness.

I was born early 80s. No car seats, a neighbour took us to primary school 6 in a mini if it was raining. We walked in a group if it wasn't. We roamed everywhere - parks, lanes, shops, railway verges, neighbours houses. But there was always a group of us. Climbing trees, cycling without helmets, climbing high walls and lamp posts. My parents worried about us more than most but I remember being given cash to go to the shops for milk or left in the house to get my lunch or left in the car while she popped somewhere when relatively young. We had one TV with 4 channels and had to negotiate what we wanted to watch with the rest of the family. We had a pub meal out or a takeaway for birthdays only.

There was a lot less research on things like SIDS. My mum when we returned from hospital was advised to keep newborns as well wrapped and warm as possible and put them to sleep on their side. She was advised to have a lot of rare steak and pâte in pregnancy due to the iron

There was a lot less gender orientated toys and clothes. I think this was due to people not knowing what they were going to have and also utilising hand me downs a lot more - there wasn't a pink and blue version of every toy as people would buy one in bright primary colours and hand it on.

Some things are definitely better -
Safety equipment - cycle helmets, spongey surfaces in play parks, car seats. Also awareness that not all people in positions of responsibility eg priests, celebrities etc are above criminal behaviour. Safety advice for babies is based on sound research and the back to sleep campaign has saved a lot of lives

But I think other things have gone too far. People seem to forget the biggest risk to kids is from people they know. Danger is seen everywhere. I've heard of people worried about helping a lost kid incase they get accused of being dodgy. Social media seems to be taking over. I don't think kids get enough free play or space to roam, build dens etc. They can watch anything they want on TV or tablet at any time. As a result there are physical changes (obesity etc) and mental changes - bullying on social media, not having to wait for things in the same way as treats. It's very different.

There must surely be a middle ground but it would be hard to be the one parent doing things differently and giving more freedom as inevitably other people will frown upon it and report them. Also I guess you don't want to be the first to ban social media when they're older as if that's what all their friends are doing then they may be socially isolated.