To be slightly fed up of white people doing this

[TacoLover]

Every time there is a thread discussing racism, there will be a mention of white privilege. Cue a flurry of hurt posters writing essays about how stupid the idea of white privilege is and how it doesn't exist, because their lives are so hard and they grew up on a few pieces of bread and a Red Bull

This really gets on my tits because after seeing this shit time and time again, THIS ISN'T WHAT WHITE PRIVILEGE MEANS. It doesn't mean your life isn't hard, it doesn't mean you don't face barriers in your life. What it does mean is the barriers in your life will never or hardly ever be a result of the colour of your skin. It doesn't mean you live in a mansion because you're white.

Just needed to get that out,sorry. I'm sure my only replies will be white people telling me how racist I am for only targeting them(Even though this is something that only white people do)

I remember early in our relationship explaining to DH about all the tricks and things a woman thinks about when she's walking home at night - cross over if a man is behind you, keep your keys in your hand etc - and he had literally no idea what I was talking about, because he had never had to think like this. The fact he didn't made me so angry I didn't speak to him for days (a bit unreasonable, I'll own). I imagine, though I don't know, that this is the same rage a black woman feels when white women have no idea about the things they have to do just to get through life safely/successfully and then suggest they are lying about having to do them.

No white privilege in the UK?

When 26% of the England and Wales prison population are from BAME groups.

When black men are 26% more likely to be remanded in custody than white.

When black people are 53% more likely to receive a custodial sentence than white.

Generalising about what “white people” do is wrong, we aren’t one big homogeneous group

As the OP pointed out, it's virtually only white people who claim that white privilege doesn't exist, so, as a white person, I feel that it's a fair thread.

Lweji thank you for your response but I strongly disagree.

The white men I work with have had nor more or less advantage than I have had, some have had considerably fewer advantages.

Advancing BAME individuals based on ethnicity and justifying it based on the characteristics of white people as a statistical group is only going to prolong division, not end it.

No one needs to apologise for what others have said and done and what they say and do. We could all depict ourselves as victims. For example, many posters on this thread have pointed out the disparities between the power and influnce exerted by men and by women. It is not helpful to wallow in victimhood. Accept that while we live and breathe we are all 'privileged' and be grateful for the pretty amazing world in which we live. Scapegoating and self commiseration are corrosive and harmful.

President Obama, a black man who became president of the richest, most powerful country in the world, said,

“if you had to choose any moment in history in which to be born, you would choose right now. The world has never been healthier, or wealthier, or better educated or in many ways more tolerant or less violent...”

Ohluckme

Havaina I asked a question, please don’t misquote me. Please explain to me how white people are not privaliged over others then.

Western society as a whole is a system rooted in white supremacy - designed to benefit, prioritise Andrew protect white people before anyone of any other race.

You're six times more likely to get stopped by the police if you're black.

Unemployment rates are twice as high for BAME people.

BAME people are more likely to suffer from mental health problems.

BAME people are more likely to experience homelessness.

Hate crimes against BAME people doubles in the UK this year.

Havaina Yes I agree! I don’t think you’ve really read what I’ve said.

This

@RowenaDedalus

I also think that some people aren’t good at listening. So for example a black person might say that they’ve experienced racism all the way through school/uni/work and some white people might think ‘no, the U.K. isn’t racist like that’. Rather than listening and learning and realising that we don’t see that racism because as white people, it hasn’t affected us.

***

My white male partner has always told me it's all in my head when I've commented on being treated differently. Took me a while to make him listen and understand what was saying to which he responded with, 'well it's never happened to me'.

It never happens when he is with me. Only when it's just me or just me and the kids.

I was stopped several times when the kids were younger (and paler) and asked whether my children were mine.

'Those children are gorgeous! Are they yours? They have different skin colour to you'

Often when I go out with my young white babysitter with the kids to places such as restaurants they automatically assume I'm the nanny or helper and always speak to the babysitter about seating, high chair, menus and just generally everything until I begin talking. It throws them off a bit and you can see they're trying to continue the conversation with my babysitter and mainly focus on her but when the penny drops it's obvious to see that they're slightly embarrassed to have assumed that I was the helper and not the mother.

I don't think they do it on purpose to be mean, it's just ignorance and the wrong assumption.

It did annoy me only once because the lady wasn't acknowledging my existence. No eye contact, nothing. I remember thinking, 'it's because of the colour of my skin you're assuming I'm the helper and all the stereotypes of what the helper must look like'. When I placed the order for the kids and asked the babysitter what she would like and generally took control of the situation whilst babysitter entertained the kids the waitress realised I was the mother and blushed a bright red.

What I then found uncomfortable was the way she began treating my babysitter!! I noticed she began ignoring her and pretending like she didn't exist.

Where do you find the balance?

Laughingtreeknight and Deathgrip

I haven't had the chance to look at these sources properly, but you may be able to draw out the relevant figures on drug treatment from a look here:
Drug treatment statistics and here: Ethnicity facts and figures.

On a seperate point, the Ethnicy Facts and Figures website is a fantastic resource for getting an understanding of the issues based on statistically viable evidence, rather than anecdotes.

Hopefully not a derail but someone up thread mentioned that a white person wouldn't experience discrimination on account of race and it made me think of what was my odd situation at school - I'm white and went to a UK school with pretty much all white kids. For some reason i was bullied for being Arab even though I'm not, maybe because my skin was slightly darker and I have features that do look like maybe I'm of mixed ethnicity. I was constantly called racist names and spat on. Even now I don't know what to make of it because of course its not racism, or is it?! Obviously since then I've definitely recognised my white privilege and I'd never deny that I have it.

The black son of a surgeon would still be eligible for an assisted place in a number of workplaces that I have worked in, based purely on their skin colour, while the 'white working class boy' wouldn't be eligible for any kind of similar help, despite needing it far more.

Source, please? Ime, BAME people have to work twice as hard to prove their worth.

Havaina I specifically stated that this was the case in places I had worked. I am mixed race and have been told on numerous occasions through the years that I am eligible for 'fast track schemes' and other things like that because of my ethnicity.

I'm ex military fwiw and now work in the public sector.

The white men I work with have had nor more or less advantage than I have had, some have had considerably fewer advantages.

This is interesting. How would you measure those advantages or disadvantages?
Is it not possible that there are invisible advantages, such as when comparing CVs from two otherwise identical candidates? I'm sure I've seen some studies about this.
And if some of those white men were able to get to your career level from a much more disadvantaged position, does the same happen to black men?
How many do you know that have had less advantages than you?
How many black men do you know who have started from the same disadvantaged place as those white men you cite and have reached the same?

Fair on you to think that you shouldn't be given a push over those men, but think of all the black men who were left behind on a race that started on the same level as those white men.

People presenting anecdotal experiences as fact is not helpful.

Thank you Jammie I was just looking at the same thing for relevant info:

Ethnicity Individuals recorded as white British made up the largest ethnic group in treatment, (85%, 231,949) with a further 5% from other white groups. No other ethnic group made up more than 1% of the total treatment population.

And yet a highly disproportionate number of PoC are in U.K. prisons for drug offences.

Must be a coincidence 😫

^Dear god, I'm not making that assertion. I'm telling you what a relevant comparison would be.
Although, on average, I'd bet it's true^

Lweji what you said was the dictionary definition of an assertion, that when challenged, you couldn't back up with anything other than I'd bet its true' You still stated it as fact though.

It IS getting a little tiring. Every week, someone comes on here with the same/similar post.

Oh the IRONY of your OP (and subsequent posts) @TacoLover

Un fucking believable

Do bore off, there's a wee poppet.

www.release.org.uk/publications/numbers-black-and-white-ethnic-disparities-policing-and-prosecution-drug-offences

In the U.K.:
Black people 6.5 times as likely as white people to be stopped and searched for drugs

More than 1.5x as likely to be charged as white people when in possession of class A drugs

And yet 90% of people in drug treatment in the U.K. are white. Hmmmm.

What about the poor white girls in Rotherham? I’m sure they don’t feel they are white privileged?

Oh the IRONY of your OP (and subsequent posts) @TacoLover**

Un fucking believable

Do bore off, there's a wee poppet. hmm

As if on cue. the attempts to denounce OP as a troll start, because people don't like what they're hearing...

I think the thing that I didn’t ‘get’ initially was that WO isn’t something I (as a white person) do or don’t do. It is something that happens to me by virtue of being white. I can’t stop it or control it (or deny it). I can only acknowledge it and try to act on that knowledge. Like someone else said upthread, I can’t not be white. It’s not the same as saying someone is racist (which is how many people react to this).

Lweji what you said was the dictionary definition of an assertion, that when challenged, you couldn't back up with anything other than I'd bet its true' You still stated it as fact though.

Head hits desk.

My post:

It's a game of averages, and comparing like with like except skin colour.
(...)
What white privilege means is:
A middle class child of a Nigerian surgeon in Hertfordshire (on average) doesn't have the same bright future than the middle class child of a white British surgeon in Hertfordshire.

I was showing what a like with like comparison was.

But you keep clutching at straws.

The other comparison could also be:

A white working class boy or girl growing up on a council estate in Sunderland would have significantly brighter future than a black working class boy or girl growing up on a council estate in Sunderland.

And BTW, where is your back up for your initial assertion?

This is interesting. How would you measure those advantages or disadvantages?

I'm interested in how you measure advantage/disadvantage, as you are the person arguing that workplace schemes to give me and others like me a boost based on our skin colour are necessary because we are 'disadvantaged' as an ethnic group.

Even if that is true, its very easy to provide examples of how it produces unfair results.

Using the example of a previous poster, how do you justify a system where a black son of a surgeon is eligible for a workplace 'fast track' track scheme whilst a white, working class man who grew up on a deprived council estate gets no such help? A hypothetical situation but one that could easily happen.

You think it's tiring hearing about it. Try living it.