Is food poverty real?

[Leapfrog44]

Provocative title, sorry I know food poverty is real. I'm just not convinced about the extent of it.

I've cooked half a packet of dried chickpeas 50p which we eat fried with garlic, salt and olive oil. They're also delicious with pasta or with potatoes as a curry. Braised Puy lentils (60p) cooked with onions, celery and the bendy carrots left in the fridge.

And to really push the boat out an aubergine stew with onions and tomatoes. The 3 big aubergines cost £1.50. Tomatoes and parsley came from the garden.

I spent an hour cooking today including making a loaf of bread. With some rice or couscous, and some salad, what I've made will feed us for 4 nights.

We have apples too, foraged at the weekend. The windfall ones I cut the bad off and stewed them, the rest are good for eating. There are also elderberries, plums and a few late blackberries dotted around the margins of the city for anyone who can be bothered to go out and pick them.

I know not everyone has a garden but a very small space can be used to grow quite a lot. In pots I grew enough tomatoes, green beans and lettuce to feed us all summer. If I was less lazy or more skint, I'd also seed save, to ensure I can grow them for free next year. Many allotment holders would totally give up some produce in exchange for labour too.

So I guess I'm wondering if the increasing number of people who are in financial dire staits and find themselves needing to use food banks are in fact suffering from a lack of food education as much as lack of money? Our grandparents in the same situation would have cultivated every bit of earth with home grown vegetables and I'm sure would have been more resourceful and more capable of making do on very little.

Obviously there are very vulnerable people without the means to cook or to grow but surely not everyone experiencing 'food poverty' is in this category? I often wonder why at food banks they don't ask if recipients have access to a bit of ground (or a few pots) and give them seeds? Pulses and in season veggies are incredibly cheap and with a few quid you can feed your family really well if you know how to cook them. It's far better to cook a simple vegetable curry or dhal and eat it all week than have to exist on the pot noodles, tinned sludge, sugary cereals and biscuits that they're giving out.

Times are going to get MUCH tougher. Climate change and environmental destruction will soon jeopardise our food security and food banks will not be able to help everyone.

So AIBU? As a society are we actually getting poorer and hungrier or have we just raised a couple of generations lacking general resourcefulness, cooking skills and horticultural know how? Times are tough for increasing numbers but I can't help feeling that many of these people just don't have a clue how to help themselves.

“On the other hand, there are very few people (apart from the severely disabled) who have NO power at all to change their circumstances, at least a little. Most people DO have the power to do at least one of the following - work more hours, go for promotions, get more qualifications, move to a cheaper property/share/cheaper area, take in some ironing or do some cleaning on the side/cut down on luxuries. People can and do climb out of hardship, and some people do need to take a bit more responsibility.”

Yes you’re right, plenty of people can and DO climb out of poverty- but it takes time. All we’re talking about is the help they need WHILST THEY ARE EXPERIENCING POVERTY.

The fact that I can get a job in 3 months doesn’t stop me being in poverty for the next 3 months does it?

Or the world's just shat on them.

neshoma there are plenty of threads on MN with great advice re budgetting where your ideas would be welcomed. This thread is NOT about that, this is about the realities of food poverty.

fullfact.org/health/nhs-pay-whats-deal/

Sorry I know the thread isn’t about this but I have seen a fair few people trot out the tired ‘NHS staff are underpaid/their pay has been frozen’ etc. which is well out of date, so I think this link will help them understand how things are currently.

I 100% believe they deserve it btw, not saying they’re overpaid, just that it’s incredibly insensitive to suggest that people earning the salaries available in the NHS are underpaid or in poverty when you look at the bigger picture. There are hundreds of thousands of people who’d kill for the sort of pay/annual pay rises given to NHS workers.

trying to get through to people with this level of sanctimonious complacency is a waste of time. The walls of their bubble are so thick and so opaque that no amount of reasoned argument will ever penetrate. or in others words, a different opinion.

Good grief it just gets worse. Ironing, childminding, baking and painting? The naivety of some is unbelievable.

It might have already been mentioned but just in case it hasn't. All you stupid (and yes I'm saying stupid) that have absolutely no idea, PLEASE I IMPLORE YOU go and watch I Daniel Blake if you can, find out what it's like for many in our lovely rich country!

I do agree with your wider point Nesh. Everything on here is so relentlessly negative, I don’t mean realistic either (I’m no fan of irrational positive thinking), it seems like a lot of posters get joy from shitting on solutions and advice that have worked for some posters. It’s like well, why bother trying? It is possible to improve your situation in the vast majority of cases, it’s not easy, it can be difficult as hell. But an attitude of ‘but but but’ with nonstop reasons as to why something won’t work isn’t helpful. The overall attitude on this thread at times seems to be that people in poverty should just lie down and accept their fate as there’s no point trying anything at all due to a hundred reasons why it might not work for every single person in a similar situation. It’s weirdly competitive.

it’s incredibly insensitive to suggest that people earning the salaries available in the NHS are underpaid or in poverty but it fits their narrative.

Neshoma if we came off benefits altogether we'd be evicted. Our rent is ridiculous. We don't have a spare £1000 a month.

I Daniel Blake had me in tears, how can we let people live like that in this a supposedly rich Country

I’ve climbed out of poverty and - this will excite you neshoma but it was all down to HIDEOUS DEBT due to a failed business (like the ones you’re suggesting people start up maybe?!)

We honestly owed so much money- Probabky more than your house is worth. We did EVERYTHING

• moved out the house and rented it (we didn’t tell the mortgage company as they would’ve refused and we were close to repossession anywY- huge risk but no choice. The rent covered 2/3 of the mortgage.

• we weren’t entitled to benefits as we did work, out expenses were just so high we couldn’t pay them.

Finally, after 7, yes, 7 YEARS we got ourselves out.

We are both highly educated, professionals, I know full well how to cook and shop. As PPs have said, there was no FUCKING MONEY.

There was also no energy, because we were both in major anxiety and depression and in fact my partner had a total breakdown at one point.

So we were getting off our arse. It DIDNT WORK

It is possible to improve your situation in the vast majority of cases,
it’s not easy, it can be difficult as hell.

Hence why I was below skid row for 4 years.
That's how long it took me.

So yes virtually all bar some major exceptions will eventually get out of poverty.
Did you actually want me to starve to death and have my kids in care before I got the chance to become better off?

No, of course not floof. Where are you getting that idea from?

Wages are just not high enough in the UK.

I'm a sahm but the last time I was job hunting was in the year 2004. Looking at similar jobs today, the wages are the same . Whereas the cost of property, rent, travel, food and utilities has increased substantially. No wonder people can't get their money to stretch.

I agree wholeheartedly that it is nearly impossible to pull yourself out of poverty nowadays. I do, however, disagree that you cannot do cleaning. Cleaners earn £12 to £14 per hour where I live. What about babysitting in the evening, or for carers who need a break. Also waitressing

It’s not nearly impossible, I don’t know who has said that? I said it is possible for most, difficult but doable. I’ve been fortunate enough to do it myself. Not everyone can but lots of people can and it’s patronising and depressing to suggest that it’s almost impossible to drag yourself out of poverty.

I've been following this thread with interest. Initially as an education as I had no clue of the severity of food poverty still going on in this country. I've already located a local food bank and donated this morning.

However. The excuses by some on here. My fucking god. Its like they enjoy the misery so you damn well will NOT put forward a totally sensible suggestion thank you very much!

Ive heard a lot on this thread about not having 50p to put on the meter. Which is awful, and I feel horrible that this happens. But without going out on a limb, I think I'm OK to assume that if 50p is a make or break amount, then £20 would really help?

Cue the poster above who said what about childminding. Now. Instead of being sensible, and saying, ah, ok, babysitting. Cash in hand. I could do the school collection for people. What does the suggestion invite? A torrent of "ohhhhhh, clearly I'll just become a qualified childminder overnight". It seems a lot on this thread would rather come out with that silly notion than say, well, yeah, one night babysitting would get me between £20 to £40. Plus I could use their tea and coffee.

I could put an advert up on the notice board downstairs. Or advertise a baby sitting service on facebook for free.

That's so easy. Sorry, but it is.

Who looks after your own sleeping children while you go off out babysitting though

I don't know anyone who will use a babysitter they don't already know and trust.

They said childminding, that's a job and requires money to set up.
Surely if they meant babysitting they should have said babysitting.
For info, I did this for a friend sometimes. They were slightly better off than me and I got a fiver. Whoop let's be warm tonight eh?
Again most of the people around me were as broke as me.
^ it was years ago hence the fiver.
But do you think a fiver every 3 weeks got me out of poverty?
You want a friend to pick up your kid from school no one pays, it's quid pro quo.
You want a permanent pick up, it's a child minder you need. You can just pay someone cash, but if you want to claim it back, it's got to be registered cm.
When I finally got out of the pit of poverty, I paid a friend 100 a week childminding in the summer holidays. It was no where near what I paid my cm for before and after school.
And importantly, I could not claim any of it back.

Better not do it then

Or. Offer hours that work for you. Do school run collections and drop offs.

Why instantly look for why you can't do something when there's many ways you obviously can.

Some posters describe cold, dark, damp flats, huddled under a blanket. Why not take your kid with you!!! Do you really think they'll object to 4 odd hours cuddled up in a warm house nodding off on the sofa or watching TV while it earns enough to feed them for the next few days?

One of my babysitters brings her DD so she and my DS can play before bed, then her DD falls asleep on the sofa when DS goes off to sleep in his room. It's really not that hard. Especially when you take into account the huge difference the extra £20/40 will make, I'd want to find a way to make it work, not find the first excuse why it won't

It's not an opinion, Neshoma. You've been presented with facts and evidence from the lived experience of pp one after another and either you won't listen or you refuse to believe what people are saying. I completely get that your existence is so rarified that you have no concept of what life's like in extreme poverty but you might show those that do the respect of not rubbishing what they say.

Babysitters dont get a fiver

Twenty years ago, aged 16 I watched the three neighbours kids for £10.

A grown woman, you are paying for the confidence that they will watch your home, and deal with DC confidently and safely should they need it.

It's £20/40 a night. And that's for one DC. I'm aware I can't claim that back. Doesn't affect you.

Especially when you take into account the huge difference the extra £20/40 will make

If theyre on benefits and some one reports them, which we see spouted on here all the time then they will be sanctioned and convicted of benefit fraud, so no income and a criminal record instead of increasing taxation to some who can afford it, or better yet cut benefits to those in parliament, no 1 seems that bothered that a large percentage of MP's are LL's and have multiple streams of income yet are subsidised by the taxpayer to the degree of thousands a year

How do I find someone who will let me babysit for £20 - £40 a night? I don't know anyone who can afford that. So would parents really respond to an advert in a newsagent?