Katie Hopkins

[Brahumbug]

Given the vile posting she made some yeara ago about people in debt, AIBU to enjoy the epicaricasy of watching her apply for an IVA to avoid bankruptcy?

AssignedNorthernAtBirth it was. I think JM worded it badly. “Dead child” was particularly uncaring and overly blunt, and I’m a very blunt kind of person.

Son would have covered it without being disrespectful to Ivan’s memory.

Yes, I agree, it was badly worded.

It's interesting that several of those of us who are pointing out that JM is objectively better behaved than KH are also being critical of her. It's almost like the claim that nobody can criticise anyone on the left is total shit, isn't it?

That’s exactly my point. To be honest, I think that politically, we are probably quite closely aligned, however, whether Cameron did or didn’t use his son’a death for political gain is a matter of opinion. An opinion that JM voiced in a way that was offensive and unnecessary. I’m not at all saying that he should’ve been immune from criticism because of tragic circumstances, but people like both JM and KH damage legitimate debate in much the same way with their deliberately inflammatory language.

It's almost like the claim that nobody can criticise anyone on the left is total shit, isn't it?

I know! Careful, people might catch on

It isn't a matter of opinion alles. DC used his son to try and deflect criticism of his policy decisions towards the NHS. That happened. It is a fact. The matters of opinion are whether he was justified to do this, whether anyone had the right to call him on it and whether Jack should've used the language she did.

And again, KH is different to and worse than JM because she knowingly lies. JM has simply not ever done anything like make up stories about refugees killing people when they didn't. One doesn't have to agree with her or like her to accept this fact.

Thus, there is no equivalence. You can if you wish have the view that calling out DC for using his dead son to divert criticism over his policy decisions in a ruder way than necessary is the same as calling other human beings cockroaches. That's your call. But there is no way that a person who deliberately lies on multiple occasions isn't more damaging than a person who doesn't. Until you understand that, we will not be anywhere close to aligned.

Sorry, that should have said towards the NHS and cuts above. It came up in discussion of cuts to disabled benefits too.

KH may not be mentally ill but she does suffer from life threatening epilepsy and seizures.

KH may not be mentally ill but she does suffer from life threatening epilepsy and seizures.

Racism isn't a symptom of epilepsy. Fact.

Racism isn’t a symptom of epilepsy, however she had a brain tumour, brain surgery and part of her brain is missing. We will never know whether brain damage has caused her to become a more vile person. Working as a nurse on a neuro ward I’ve experienced patients with brain injuries coming out with the most revolting things and behaviours.

Wasn't she already like this way before the brain tumour?

Hard to give a date o developing neurological malfunctions. However, KH attempted to join the army apparently in the belief that she could conceal her epilepsy. I believe this is evidence of disordered thinking.

If it could be conclusively shown that KH's actions are a result of her brain condition/s, I suppose that would be a relevant factor in assessing her behaviour and also moral equivalence. Though I guess we'd also need JM's medical history too...

Sorry, again AssignedNorthernAtBirth you’ve claimed that something is factual when in fact, it is an opinion that you agree with.

We cannot know for certain the reasons why Cameron brought his own personal circumstances into the discussion on NHS funding. I personally believe that it was in an attempt to soften public opinion, but cannot say that this is factually correct. I’m entitled to this view, as is JM, but as a public figure she has a responsibility to articulate this view properly, which she didn’t. This stifled and derailed the whole debate at the time as it became more about his/her stupid, ill-considered comments.

Oh dear, we seem to be going down the it could walk like a duck and quack like a duck but we can't be 100% sure it's a duck route. That level of reaching will probably give you a bad back. I suppose we need to give equal time to the possibility that it was just a remarkable coincidence when DC did this? Or maybe he was communicating in code with the lizard people or something.

JM's choice of words was certainly poor, but the thing is, she was the one trying to call out a PM using the memory of his child to deflect criticism of cuts that have actually killed people. A grotesque thing. She did it ineptly, unfortunately. Allowing people like you to try and muddy the waters, and pretend that this is somehow as dangerous as an individual who engages in repeated, deliberate, cut and dried defamation of people she doesn't like.

At least financially she's avoiding bankruptcy but morally...

AllesAusLiebe, JM's comments about DC would never have landed her in court. DC's conduct in that regard was only too painfully obvious, and JM would have had a cast-iron defence of justification and fair comment in the event that DC were ever mad enough to bring proceedings. Speaking the truth about someone cannot amount to insulting them. Likewise, the facts about what DC did are certainly not a matter of opinion.

Likewise, the facts about what DC did are certainly not a matter of opinion

Once again, we’re conflating fact with opinion. Something does not become factual simply because you as an individual believe it to be correct.

Assigned ‘people like me muddying the waters’ are always an inconvenience to people like you who don’t understand what constitutes fact. The facts are that the cuts to the NHS have been savage and have undoubtedly cost lives.

JM’s stupidity deflected the attention onto herself and compromised this debate, much like KH does with her outrageous statements on everything from refugees to Israel.

KH may not be mentally ill but she does suffer from life threatening epilepsy and seizures.

So does my husband but it doesn't cause him to do any of the things KH does. It's not an excuse. Nothing would be an excuse.

Epicaricacy

I was always told there was no English equivalent to schadenfreude.

They lied to me! 😱

ButchyRestingFace me too!

Schadenfreude wins tho? So satisfying to say, it adds to my mean pleasure.

It is, plus I can’t pronounce Epicaricacy (I think I can’t anyway) so I’ll stick with the original.

Schadenfreude wins tho? So satisfying to say, it adds to my mean pleasure.

Yes, but everyone knows "schadenfreude".

Just imagine the sheer thrill from top to toe of being able to drop epicaricacy nonchalantly into conversation - pronounced correctly and in the correct context - with a slight flick of the hair as your listener gobbles at you like a goldfish.

Then, when they ask you what it means, you look at them in genuine astonishment and say, "why, don't you know???"

Ha that would be fun if I could work out where the emphasis would be in epicaricacy

I think KH is a very sad personification of today's society. I truly believe she never meant a word of the stuff she uttered, it was just an attempt to keep herself relevant and in the public eye.
She became famous from the apprentice and known for her sharp tongue. Then became this thing, saying what we're all thinking, except at some point her views became skewed and nothing like anyone thinks.

I recall her on big brother, she was quite interesting and appeared to be almost pleasant, just speak your mind blunt. But not offensive with it.

I'm sad for her children though, they're probably already in the firing line because of their mum and I hope this doesn't make it worse...

As for Jack Monroe, why did she have to break this news? It feels almost like a dig, she won her case and should just let it go now. The line about checking Katie's children wouldn't be affected too much just made me cringe. Like she's a saviour or something. Not her business.