'Boys don't cry in this class.'

[HelloGabriel]

DD has just started P5 (we're in NI, not sure what this equates to elsewhere, children are 8/9 years old).

She told me and DH earlier that her new teacher doesn't tolerate crying from boys in her class and proceeded to tell us about the following two events earlier that day:

Boy one, having produced an unacceptable number of wrong answers in his maths test, was asked to come to the front of the class to explain himself to everyone. He started to cry and when he went to wipe the tears away, teacher grabbed (DD's word) his arm and tells him 'boys don't cry in this class'.

Boy two, whose handwriting has allegedly taken a turn for the worse today, again is brought to the front for an explanation, and the exact same scenario unfolds. DD tells me she's never seen this boy cry before in all their years at school, but that's maybe irrelevant.

Is this normal? Not even the 'boys don't cry' shit but grabbing a child's arm to prevent them wiping tears away seems harsh to me. Then again I'm not a teacher, maybe crying gets tiresome.

I can't figure out why it's annoying me so much, maybe I'm overreacting or maybe it's been so long since my primary school days, I need to toughen up.

DD funnily enough doesn't seem too phased by it. I'm not sure what teacher's stance on crying girls is and I'm not too keen to find out.

You need to get onto the school IMMEDIATELY. This is horrendous. I would be mortified if this happened to any of my children boy or girl. Could cause mental health issues for life shaming a child like that!!

On one hand kids have well-being as a subject at a school, on the other one we have teachers talking some really dangerous bollocks, forcing boys to suppress their feelings. Not surprising the suicide rate among men is so high.

I'd be fuming, the poor lad is learning! These phrases are causing such a problem in day to day life with people. What a way to promote people to be true about their feelings/emotions!
I would of thought the teacher would of known better to be honest! There's massive knowledge about the effects of these commonly misused phrases "Man up" "cry like a baby" "Stop being a girl" "men/boys don't cry"...
I would also be so so so angry if anyone held back my childs arm to stop them from wiping their tears away! I would be contacting the school whether it was my child or someone else's - bad day or not, this is not a way for a teacher (or anyone) to behave in front of children, let alone what her response has taught these children.

Thefatcat that's exactly what I'm shitting myself about. I have no issue with voicing my concern for the greater good here, but there's the very real possibility that she could make my daughter's life a misery, coupled with the fact I have to face this woman in parent/teacher meetings on at least three occasions this year.

Would an anonymous complaint be a waste of time?

When the truth has to be told, sacrifices need to be made! That teacher is harming their poor souls and she is a terrible role model for your daughter!

I'm heart broken for those boys! HOW DARE SHE?!

I'm afraid you need to go to the headteacher yourself and ask him that you remain anonymous! And if things are not taken seriously i would inform ofsted!

1. humiliation (come and explain your wrong answers)
2. grab their hand to stop them crying - wrong and inhumane
3. boys don't cry - wrong and inappropriate. Child is distressed, teacher should deal with distress.

please complain. Ask that you/your child is not identified to the teacher.

Haven't read the full thread (and I hate people who write this usually!) but this so reminds me of when I started school in the infants (1959!). For the first two years I had a form teacher who decided, on meeting me for the first time, that she really didn't like me at all (for no apparent reason - I was shy, quiet and well mannered). She proceeded to make my life a misery for the next, nearly, two years - not quite two years as she was stopped by the head eventually). It finally finished when she had forbidden us to use the scissors we were cutting out with for anything else, such as cutting our hair. Someone with same hair colour as me did cut their hair and another child picked up the lock from the floor and handed it to the teacher. All children with that hair colour were lined up outside the door and called in one by one to be asked if they were the perpetrator - rest of class (6 year olds) were sat on the floor facing the interrogation. All suspects denied cutting their hair and were sent to sit down. I also denied cutting my hair (as it wasn't me) and was pulled aside. I was then sat on teacher's knee and exhorted to tell the truth and she wouldn't be cross (I was telling the truth). Eventually, she instructed the rest of the 6-year-olds that they were to "send (me) to Coventry" - until I told "the truth". She had to explain to them what this meant. When I got to go home, I told my mother, who swept straight up to the Headmistress's office and demanded justice. Teacher nearly got the sack and left me alone thereafter. Looking back, I realise she knew exactly who had cut their hair and knew it wasn't me. I am shocked to hear there are still people like this these days and they have no business being teachers.

Bloomin heck, I feel like I’ve been transported back to the 70s reading your account. I’d not be happy if my child was in that environment

Please tell the head teacher - this isn't just upsetting the boys in question - all their classmates will be feeling insecure, scared and distressed. The boys won't be able to learn anything if they are distressed and scared of the person teaching them.

Yes please please post. The teacher in question needs investigating. They shouldn't be in that job. It's very upsetting readouts about the poor boys. I really feel for them. I'd email the head. Tell her you'd wish to remain anonymous for fear of repercussions but you're really concerned. Why would a child make that up? It it goes without anything said it could get worse.

Meant please please tell!! Not post. Sorry

At the very beginning of my teaching career, I was advised "Praise in public, blame in private", in other words be discreet if an uncomfortable conversation is needed, not public humiliation.
If you raise your concerns with the head teacher, making it clear that your own daughter was a bystander who witnessed it, you may well get the feeling that you are not the first person to mention it; although the head will probably remain discreet.

And of course boys cry; how many boxes of tissues I could have saved over the years if they didn't!

Not meaning to be horrible OP, but toughen up! Be firm. If the teacher starts making life tough for your DD then deal with her and the school. Chance are she will be sweetness and light to your DD for fear of what you may do.
Don't let her bully the kids!
At parent teacher meetings be professional and normal, don't let her intimidate you.

It's NOT okay for a teacher to single kids out and humiliate them particularly when it's about academic achievement and not behaviour.

This is massively damaging not to even get to the "boys don't cry" stuff which is also awful. Really.

Absolutely agree with EleanorLavish. You have to follow this up without worrying about the knock-on effect. And if there is a knock-on effect deal with that at the time.

The other thing is that if the head doesn't take it seriously as you've suggested, that is then the time to take it to the chair of governors.

Not only not normal but very wrong indeed as is bringing the child to the front of the class to tell them off. How humiliating. Teachers should show respect to their pupils.

Report her.

An annonymous complaint would be a complete waste of time.

Please make an appointment to go and see the headteacher. The fact that you are concerned that the teacher might take this out on your child tells you all you need to know. You know that what the teacher did was wrong.

However, please also bear in mind that you only have your child's word to go on, which means that it will be her interpretation. I'm not saying that something didn't happen, but it just may not have happened in exactly the way she's saying it did.

OP this woman should not be in the privileged position of teaching children. She has no respect for the safeguarding, inclusion and anti-bullying policies which the school, as a legal requirement, will have in place and has no intention of following them. You should be able to voice your concerns to the Governors whilst maintaining your anonymity to this woman - they would be in breach of data protection law if they let her know. I say Governors instead of Head Teacher as from experience they can become defensive when the integrity of their staff is questioned - not all, and yes I’m being subjective! You could contact Ofsted or your local MASH (multi-agency safeguarding hub) to maintain complete anonymity from the school. I have loads of respect for you that you care about other children, other than your own. Not to sound preachy but Ofsted state ‘it is the responsibility of all adults to provide duty of care to all children’. Good luck x

Update: DD has returned to inform me that boy 2's parents were waiting to see demon teacher after class. Hopefully they tear her a new one.

I've drafted a letter to the head and still plan to send it; as mentioned by PPs I think it's important that he understands this behaviour is unacceptable from an outside perspective and not someone directly affected by a hurt and humiliated son

I've asked DD to tell me again just to make sure, some more details;

Having been summoned to 'explain' in front of the class why he only achieved 15/18 on maths test, boy one (obviously scared and humiliated) said nothing; this resulted in teacher accusing him of rudeness, the tears followed and then the arm grabbing and a warning not to cry.

Boy two was summoned due to 'monster writing' and hid his face behind his hands. Teacher removed them, told him not to cry, 'you're a boy'; he then apparently reached for a tissue only to have arm grabbed and message reiterated re crying boys. Then told to go to bathroom to clean his face.

If anything I feel worse.

Telling the child 'boys don't cry', terrible though that is, isn't even the worst thing this teacher did. The fact the children were crying in the first place is a massive red flag. It's 2018, humiliating the children by having them explain themselves for mistakes in front of the whole class is fucking 1960's shit. Physical contact to prevent a child drying tears? Just fucking no.

So glad you are going to complain OP, it may not be you child but your child is seeing this and what other kind of outdated bullying methods and sexist messages is this woman going to be modelling to ALL the kids? That kind of behaviour cannot be left unaddressed or unchecked.

Oh that update makes my heart ache for that poor boy. All I can see is my own son standing there. It makes me so sad. I'm so pleased though that he'll understand that his parents are firmly behind him and they're reinforcing the message that the teacher acted appallingly.

Please complain OP. I’m a teacher and this makes me furious. None of this is ok. Bringing kids to the front of the class in itself (let alone the crying stuff) is a teacher trying to shame children and is deeply wrong and damaging.

Children need adults who care to look out for them so please, please see the head teacher.

15/18 is unacceptable? Is she stark staring crazy?

I’m glad you’re going to complain, it’s the right thing to do. You don’t have to be the subject of bullying, sexism, racism, etc. to be offended by it and to take steps to stop it happening again.

Something similar happened at dds school. She was upset when another girl with additional needs was told that she shouldn’t have gone into year 6 as her work wasn’t year 6 standard. Her work was then held up and the class were asked to vote on whether they thought it was good enough for year 6.
Dd approached another member of staff herself and told them what had happened and the mum was called by the head with an apology.
I think if you know who the parent of the child is I would be inclined to let them know what your dd has told you and see what they want to do as it’s not really your complaint to make imo.