To think that an 8 hour work day is actually quite short?

[AllDayBreakfast]

I've been listening to various discussions on the radio about how we could be just as productive with a shorter work day.

As a hgv driver I work a minimum of around 10 hours a day and it's not at all unusual for this to sometimes become a 12 hour day if I get stuck somewhere waiting on POA (period of availability - basically being paid for waiiting).

When I was in sales a few years ago I'd also have to regularly spend evenings and sometimes weekends working on drafts of proposals, getting the pricing, formatting, wording sorted, etc (100+ page documents).

Whilst I'd love a 6 hour day, i can't help but feel that we're becoming a bit soft as a society. I don't really like the idea of the 60 hour week that many blue collar guys work, but trying to lessen a 37.5 hour week seems a bit lazy to me!

The only people who want that are the elite who make lots of money out of all of us worker bees and the rat race. Exactly.

OP it seems like you have a chip on your shoulder because you're stuck doing a job which requires you to drive HGVs on long journeys over 10hours of driving and you resent the fact that there are other people in the world who do less hours but still say their working day is long. No one cares about your one person tirade against the office 9-5 workers or shift workers who do less hours than you. A working day over 6 hours is too long. You need a decent work/life balance.

How about you change career?

Why do people worship work so much? Let's automate as much of it as possible and spend more time playing! (and i say that as someone who likes my job, and isn't at all lazy, but I definitely prefer mountain biking!)

Frumpety- my 72 year old dad still does a 60 hr week out of choice. Even my 94 year old grandad helps out occasionally. I fully expect to working until I'm physically not able.

But I appreciate I'm lucky to want to do so!

Flowery farming is more than a job though isn't it, it is your life

In the past, firms contracted workers for 60 hour weeks, gave them no paid holiday and had little on no health and safety or sick pay etc etc. Does that mean those workers were 'tough' or they were better off because of it? No, they died much younger because if it, and they didn't choose it, but had to accept the hours and conditions because that was what was needed to earn a barely living wage.

Do people have an easier life today than that? Most people do - most people can work and earn a living wage in less hours and have paid holiday and other protections. In one sense life today might be easier, but there might be other aspects which are harder. Are we 'softer' or less hard working or less worthy than people in the past? We might live an easier life due to mid cons and rules and regulations, but it doesn't make those workers less worthy.

Today, some people work very long hours. Some have shorter contracted hours but work much longer due to expectation or other reasons, others work very long hours because their job pays poorly and they need to work harder to earn a living wage - rather like the workers of previous times who simply had to do the long hours to earn a barely living wage. Others earn what they need in jobs which require fewer hours and where there isn't an expectation to work lots of extra hours. They are working less - are they luckier - only in relation to throw who have no choice but to work excessive hours in order to live. They aren't luckier or softer than those who opt for jobs with longer hours or who choose to work lots of hours beyond their contracts.

Long hours only really make sense if you have no alternative, need to work them to live or if you thoroughly enjoy your work, or if it is a means to another end, or if you working longer has no impact on anyone such as family. Otherwise, you could say that working longer hours is a daft idea - not tough, or brave or hardworking, but either a sign of being a martyr, pushover, obsessed with money, a sign of having no outside life or not caring about the impact it has on family.

Work is one part of life. As others said, we should work to live, not the other way round. If we can enjoy our work and find it rewarding,mall to the good, but work-life balance is very important for well-being, health and family, and those things seem more important than an idea that long hours is a sign cof strength and short hours of being flaky and weak.

Don't forget that a lot of people take an hour or more to commute to do their 8 hours. My 8 hour work day is actually 11 hours long...

Meh, run yourself into an early grave with being super butch if you like! It's healthier to work shorter hours, leaves more time for family life, exercise, hobbies etc. Long working hours = stress = early death.

YABU. Working constantly - and with some uncertainty - is a way to keep the masses occupied. 40-hour week is MORE than enough. Why aren't wages going up in tally with prices and rents? Life should be about more than work! Not getting home till 7, 8,9 or whatever to just keep a roof over our heads no way to live. It is just a way to keep us all tired!!

And what ChocolateWombat said. (much more articulately).

For some people it's a race to the bottom. They like to martyr on about how many hours they do per week so we all feel lazy and they can feel like they work soooo much harder when actually if you look at what they actually do in those hours they don't actually work any harder.

My ex was a race to bottom type.. his health is failing but he's such a martyr he won't dare look like he does less hours. Even though those hours are totally unnecessary..

All the HGV drivers I've ever heard of or met have had huge problems keeping relationships, all divorced or stayed single without exception, but just my experience.

We're not getting softer, society is changing and realising that work isn't the be all and end all. We are more aware the toll long hours take on mental health (because of family etc)

The second most common deathbed regret is working too hard. Especially for men.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2012/feb/01/top-five-regrets-of-the-dying

I’m another one in healthcare so according to some pp it’s fine and expected that I should work 60+h weeks.

Bollocks to that 😉 I work 3.5 10h days in the public system (8-6 with a 10 minute cycle commute along an off road cycle path) and 10h a week doing two private lists. One of my public 10h days is non clinical time which I can do from home.

Yes occasionally it’s shit. Like this weekend I’m on call for 48h and I’ll be the only anaesthetist in the hospital responsible for ICU, ED, obstetrics and theatres. But that’s only once every 6 or so weeks.

I live near beaches, ski fields, tramping and cycle tracks - why on earth would I want to spend more time at work than I have to?

I'm sorry OP but

EU rules
Driving hours
The main EU rules on driving hours are that you must not drive more than:
• 9 hours in a day - this can be extended to 10 hours twice a week
• 56 hours in a week
• 90 hours in any 2 consecutive weeks
All driving you do under EU rules must be recorded on a tachograph.
Breaks and rest
The main points of EU rules on breaks and rest are that you must take:
• at least 11 hours rest every day - you can reduce this to 9 hours rest 3 times between any 2 weekly rest periods
• an unbroken rest period of 45 hours every week - you can reduce this to 24 hours every other week
• a break or breaks totalling at least 45 minutes after no more than 4 hours 30 minutes driving
• your weekly rest after 6 consecutive 24-hour periods of working, starting from the end of the last weekly rest period taken
Coach drivers on an international trip can take their weekly rest after 12 consecutive 24-hour periods, starting from the end of the last weekly rest period taken.

www.gov.uk/drivers-hours/eu-rules

You get a break of AT LEAST 45 minutes after only 4.5 hours work. I think your attitude would soon change if you were trulely working 12 hours a day in a physically demanding job with no time to eat

The British work far more hours than our competitors - the reason is we are far less productive

I agree with ciderbrains - every discussion re: work soon turns into a 4 yorkshire men/race to the bottom on here, whether it's working hours or commutes '1 hr each way is nothing...' etc.

OP "Identity politics and safe spaces would've been laughed out of town in our grandparents' era."
As would black/irish people trying to rent a room, children complaining about sexual assault and women applying for a mortgage (depending on the age of your grandparents). Quite like living in 2018 thanks, even if it does make me a 'wimp.'

Yes "office work" can often be less physically demanding than 'blue collar' jobs. However it's often a lot more mentally demanding and stressful - "office work" covers a huge spectrum, and those "short" shifts-sitting on their backside-mars bar eating folks you are denigrating could be the ones allocating emergency services and having people cry down the phone as their loved ones die in their arms due to lack of ambulance availability, or breaking the news that an operation or court hearing has been cancelled for the third time, or even just in a call centre being screamed at and threatened with the rape of their children because their internet speed isn't fast enough.

I'm sure nurses would love eight hour days.

Gottagetmoving your absolutely right!

Such a weak argument OP I can't even be bothered to argue with it...

Are you sure you are only doing 14000 cider if you are not stopping for 6hr. I am usually way more than that and some of my job is standing. I think you will find you are doing way more than that.

I just go with what it says on my phone which is in my pocket. I don't fancy doing more that that!

Depends what you do.