To think that an 8 hour work day is actually quite short?

[AllDayBreakfast]

I've been listening to various discussions on the radio about how we could be just as productive with a shorter work day.

As a hgv driver I work a minimum of around 10 hours a day and it's not at all unusual for this to sometimes become a 12 hour day if I get stuck somewhere waiting on POA (period of availability - basically being paid for waiiting).

When I was in sales a few years ago I'd also have to regularly spend evenings and sometimes weekends working on drafts of proposals, getting the pricing, formatting, wording sorted, etc (100+ page documents).

Whilst I'd love a 6 hour day, i can't help but feel that we're becoming a bit soft as a society. I don't really like the idea of the 60 hour week that many blue collar guys work, but trying to lessen a 37.5 hour week seems a bit lazy to me!

A lot of people equate staying longer at work with working harder.

In many jobs this is often not true.

If you have to work a 60 hour week and are not saving lives, then unless you enjoy it perhaps consider retraining...

However lots of people claim they "work their arse off" because they are in the office ling hours, when in fact the only thing true about that is that they spend a lot of time sitting down...

I funny think many people who do an eight hour day actually do an eight hour day, they probably get in earlier than nine, leave later than five, often log onto laptops to check things out finish things at home. In my experience the ones who come in at nine, leave at five take every second of break time they are owed, are also the ones taking a ten minute cigarette break every hour, then making tea and chatting in the kitchen for another ten minutes before they have a nice chat with a colleague about what they just heard in the kitchen, so in their eight hour day they've actually probably worked 4-5 hours max. So I do believe for some people if they worked more efficiently they could do the same amount in less time, my argument there would be imagine what they could achieve by working efficiently for the eight hours they are paid to do!

DH works a 40h week, over 5 days. However he would much rather work 4 10hr days.

However if he has to do field work he could easily be working 16hr days (nuclear power)

There are lazy people in this world, and if you want a good life you should be willing to work for it.

(but was a bit conflicted as I'm kinda having my own whinge!)

but I think that there are many in our society who don't really understand the concept of a hard graft

Will go back and RTFT shortly but this stuck out to me, I take it the lorry you drive was made in the 1940's OP or do you have 1 with lots of drivers aids like power assisted steering and brakes, whats wrong with you? Are you afraid of hard graft?

I work 9-5. I’m senior so do occasionally work over this time but I’ve chosen my profession and industry with this in mind to reduce the amount I have to work.

Work have me on site from 9-5, and an hour either side is spent travelling to and from. I don’t like my actual life to be confined from 6pm- bedtime and weekends, especially as I have children to see and spend time with.

I totally understand other people work longer hours. I feel sorry for them to be honest, giving your life to THE MAN is painful enough without giving so much more of it.

I also think most people aren’t very efficient and in office based jobs the people who work the longest hours are often just incompetent, or have little power over an incompetent manager. Again, that’s not ideal.

In terms of nurses doctors HGV drivers I think it’s a real shame we have a shortage. Of these skills so people have to work so much. I would be in huge favour of them working less

My hubby does four twelve days over eight days. It sucks

Four twelve hour day shifts over eight days

I do think OP that you are coming across as someone who has perhaps had what you perceive as the 'easier' lifestyle you are describing your friends as whinging about, how have a harder or longer houred job and have come to preach to the rest of us how much tougher your job is.
The problem is people have been doing tough jobs for less pay than the middle class 'easier' jobs for centuries.

Sorry, I can’t remember who it was now, but somebody earlier said that working in an office, unless a senior exec, wasn’t gruelling or tiring. Whoever it was clearly hasn’t worked in a lot of offices!

My last job involved entire concentration from 9-5.30, working as quickly as humanly possible to keep up with the workload. There was no time for slacking off, no time for a chat or to stare out of the window for a couple of minutes. It was literally go go go from the minute I arrived until the minute I left (which incidentally was usually later than 5.30). I frequently got home absolutely drained and unable to do anything with my evening.

Physical labour is not the only way of tiring oneself out - mental exertion can be just as knackering.

I'm just observing how many of my mates complain about staying till 6pm when I start at 7:30am and rarely finish before that tune.

We all agree you're the busiest and work longest hours and are far tougher than your mates, OP. You win. Your medal is in the post. Let us know when it arrives and we'll have a little ceremony for you.

and it's not at all unusual for this to sometimes become a 12 hour day if I get stuck somewhere waiting on POA (period of availability - basically being paid for waiiting). A two hour break doing nothing but waiting would be an absolute luxury in the vast majority of jobs.

Bully for fucking you with your hardcore 10 hours. Come back to me when you're a junior dr. and not sitting on your arse all day eating mars bars all day.

Pfft 10 hours!

The competition of who works hardest or longest is certainly not one I'd want to win!

Life's to short!

I do 8-4 3 days a week. It's a long commute so I'm up at 5.30 and home just before 6.
That is more then enough for me and i am grateful that I'm able to work so few hours for the generous pay I receive... plus the jobs piss easy to boot!

I work to live, not live to work...

My favorite working pattern was trading hours. I was in by 6am, worked my arse off taking a short lunch and finished at 4pm. Yes you go to bed early but you have a sense of time left because you finish at 4pm. You also just miss rush hour so your commute home is much better.

Now I work 8-6 and I attend events plus run my business from home. DH works a lot but I can't tell you his hours because I don't consider 4 hours on a plane when he is sleeping to be working, although on other flights he does work. What I can say is that he is hardly home between now and New Year. Yes we make the money but an 8 hour day is reasonable.

As others have said the issue is presenteeism. Why sit there for 2 hours and do nothing when you could be doing something else? Personally when that happens I do household admin like my food order or I go online to look at training articles.

Distantstars - I want to know what you do that is piss easy but pays well! Any chance you're willing to share?

That’s the other thing, companies expecting you to travel for them. How old fashioned and outdated. And they are taking ALL your time. 24 hours a day! Cheeky bastards

"Are we a nation of whingers?"

I never like the use of Whinger. It's used to shut people up, who have got legitimate complaints about how their life is being constructed. Because someone, somewhere is deciding this. We were branded as Whinging Scousers because we wouldn't shut up about Hillsborough and now because we are rightfully complaining about what the cuts are ding to our City.

But it doesn't make sense to be moving towards having half our population stressed out because of their working hours and a good proportion being supported by benefits and whilst having time, not having the money to do anything.

If their working pattern is changing, then they have the right to complain, because from what I'm hearing employers are pushing for longer hours and crap contracts.

I agree with some people not knowing what life is like for others, though, you see that across Teacher threads and declaring that SW's aren't on a good wage etc.

I’ve just worked 5 days of 7.30 to 6 o’clock in a nursery
That’s an extra 1 and 1/2 hours a day
I’m about ready to kill someone

Lots of people are engaged in a race to the bottom with work hours. I have recently left a job that was taking over my life and the more time I had to spend in it the worse I became at doing the contact bit.

@INeedNewShoes

I work in the city... went part time after maternity. Have done the same job for over a decade and it's just becoming quieter and more automated.... I'm enjoying the piss easy until the axe falls! It's fine, but god I am bored!! So it's a double edged sword really .

breie a lot of offices are not like that though.

My office experience is out of date, but I worked in an 9ffice for about 6 years (5 years in one place, but temped before that so saw a lot of offices for a few weeks at a time) and only one accounts department was like that, and then only one week before the month end deadline, the other couple of weeks I was there weren't intense. The office I worked in the longest was a prime example of a presentee culture, with people coming in early to send a few emails to show they were there, then making themselves breakfast and coffee and chatting, surfing the internet, having a long loo visit, and generally faffing for a good hour, before ding a bit of work while chatting, then wandering to the water cooler for a chat, going to the loo again, going to perch on another colleague's desk to chat, sending out some spam jokes over email...

At 5pm there'd still be no sense of urgency, but when I was doing a masters in the evening and left at 5pm for lectures 6pm to 9pm people would have a good natured joke about me working half days (My boss knew I was a "hard worker though because I always came in at 7am to send out a few emails, including one to him, then have a coffee, do a bit of work on an essay for my masters , have another coffee ... )

@AllDayBreakfast - Daily Mail, is that you? Preparing an article about how the society as a whole became so soft that people are looking to work shorter hours rather than work non-stop with a short break for sleep for the glory of the past and the future Empire?
I like having a balance in my life. I work to have a good life outside my work, not the other way round. I want to spend my time at home too. I don't want to be too exhausted to just bark at my DD when she wants to spend time with me. I want to be still capable of dealing with her problems, issues and worries and have fun with her too.
Not sure about your family and how they see it but me and my DH have jobs which sometimes need shorter hours, sometimes we go way over 8 hours but we are trying to spend those hours effectively so we can wrap up as soon as possible because we want to have some private time.

I love the idea of everyone working a shorter week or shorter day. Office type jobs would still probably be just as productive and for manual type jobs there would be more work to go around, important in the age of automation. The hourly rate would have to go up though which would be difficult to force in.
Imagine a three day weekend every week or even better everyone having a different day off in the week so that childcare could be covered more easily, people could do more volunteering, caring for the elderly etc, leasure facillities would be less crowded at the weekends.
Sounds great to me.

France implemented a 35 hour week and I don't believe that made all the French people "soft".

I expect it was really good for their health and quality of life and also family friendly.

We are a long hours culture and I would like this to change.