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Original poster

To not appreciate Serena using sexism in her arguments against umpire

518 replies

user1471517900 · 09/09/2018 10:07

Sorry if there is a thread, I did scan four pages to check.

Serena gets coached (which her coach admits) but claims she didn't see it. Then smashes a racquet in separate fit of temper. Then tells the umpire she can't be a cheat because she's a mother(!), he will never referee a match again with her, and he's a thief.

The punishments all seem fine to me and I really felt for Osaka having to apologise in her winners speech. Serena should be saying sorry today IMO.

OP posts:
Nishky · 09/09/2018 11:24

I remember the final against Sam Stosur, I felt really sorry for her because a lot of the crowd didn’t bother to applaud her and she paraded the trophy to a virtually empty stadium, but Serena tried to diffuse that ( obviously I am guessing at her motive ) by sitting next to her and talking before the ceremony started.

I am a bit surprised that she didn’t do that last night, particularly as Naomi Osaka was clearly distressed at that stage

doedoe90303811 · 09/09/2018 11:26

"The baby is very relevant though because she desperately wants to resume her career but it may well be over

Because she had a baby

How can that not be out and out sexism?"

No, it's over because she's 36. And a 36 year old has never won a Grand Slam tennis tournament.

You might as well ask why David Beckham still isn't playing for England.

CuriousaboutSamphire · 09/09/2018 11:26

Had she taken 2 years off she wouldn't have been offered any of the wild cards or special seedings that she was given - like many injured players are offered if they return within 2 years.

She started unseeded in most matches, as did Kim Clijsters and Victoria Azarenka. She is part of a wider movement in tennis to change the 'maternity leave' in tennis, to have a more sensible 'protected seedings' arrangment.

SerenDippitty · 09/09/2018 11:26

How was she supporting Naomi Osaka by making what should have been the greatest day of her life all about her?

glintandglide · 09/09/2018 11:26

But she was ok when she was 35. It’s literally the baby that has triggered this, but her turning 36

glintandglide · 09/09/2018 11:27

Not her turning 36

TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross · 09/09/2018 11:27

Nadal certainly fell out with Ramos during the French Open last year when Ramos gave him a code violation for taking too long between shots, so he has form for being a stickler for the rules whether the player is a man or a woman.

I don’t think there was any question that Ramos here again did not follow the rules. Some umpires might have been more lenient but that’s a judgement call.

What I object to most is the way Serena has managed to make Osaka - and Japan’s - first Grand Slam win all about her. The headlines should have been about Osaka’s victory today, not Serena’s defeat. I have never seen a Grand Slam runner up be quite so unsporting as Serena has been, telling the crowd “We’ll get through this”, FFS.

BadLad · 09/09/2018 11:28

I don’t think there was any question that Ramos here again did not follow the rules. Some umpires might have been more lenient but that’s a judgement call.

Inconsistent umpiring is a problem throughout sport.

Snowfish · 09/09/2018 11:30

Serena's coach cheated and as a team they were penalised according to the rules. Serena was then extremely badly behaved and rude and was also penalised according to the rules. Poor Osaka had to keep herself together through all of this. I think most other young players would have been distracted and put off their game by her behaviour and the crowd booing but she held it together

doedoe90303811 · 09/09/2018 11:31

"She couldn’t even return to top level. She had to start again. In normal jobs women’s equivalent positions are held for them during maternity leave so they can return without being penalised. Serena was penalised."

This isn't true either. She got 12 months maternity leave with a protected ranking, and she was seeded for Wimbledon.

glintandglide · 09/09/2018 11:34

She was seeded for Wimbledon but not the French open. I didn’t realise her ranking was protected, that directly contradicts everything I’ve heard about the situation

doedoe90303811 · 09/09/2018 11:36

"But she was ok when she was 35. It’s literally the baby that has triggered this, not her turning 36"

She's out of shape because she had a baby? Well I'm not sure what you're proposing in response to this startling revelation.

Also 36 is older than 35 and in three weeks she'll be 37, which is an even less plausible age to be winning tennis tournaments.

Presumably she didn't have a baby when she was at her physical peak because she wanted to dominate the world of tennis, which she did. Now that she is well past her physical peak, she's decided it's a better time to have a baby. In not very long she will be unequivocally too old to play tennis any more.

The top 100 women's tennis players consist of a 38 year old (Venus), a 36 year old (Serena), then nobody else is even 35.

80sMum · 09/09/2018 11:39

I think Serena will probably cringe with embarrassment when she watches herself in replay. She was very emotional (understandable, as she was so close to beating an all time record and it must have seemed as though it was being snatched away) but her behaviour did her no favours.

Regarding the claim that men would not be penalised, I have seen many men penalised for violations.

I clearly recall Tim Henman being disqualified from Wimbledon one year, for (albeit accidentally) hitting a ball girl with a tennis ball that he had hit in anger when he missed a shot. He didn't protest. In fact, he was very embarrassed and apologised profusely.

nolongersurprised · 09/09/2018 11:40

bbc but in getting ranty she made the whole match about her - apparently you need to smash racquets and abuse umpires to fight sexism Hmm

Osaka is also talented, and a POC who has experienced racism in Japan for her Haitian heritage. She outplayed Serena then apologised for winning and cried on what should have been a well-deserved joyous occasion for her.

doedoe90303811 · 09/09/2018 11:40

" I didn’t realise her ranking was protected, that directly contradicts everything I’ve heard about the situation"

Yes. It's shown here 'PR':

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_French_Open_%E2%80%93_Women%27s_Singles

The protected ranking allows you to enter a certain number of tournaments purely on the basis of your performance before taking a break. Otherwise you would need a wildcard or to go through qualifying.

She wasn't seeded but it didn't seem to make any difference to her performance.

Aspenfrost · 09/09/2018 11:41

She appears to believe that she has a right to win. She made a complete fool of herself and no one else. I have always disliked her but this was something else because in addition to her appalling behaviour she ruined the great achievement of her opponent. Nice.

gamerwidow · 09/09/2018 11:43

I am a bit surprised that she didn’t do that last night, particularly as Naomi Osaka was clearly distressed at that stage
She did, she told the crowd to stop booing.

LakieLady · 09/09/2018 11:45

Also 36 is older than 35 and in three weeks she'll be 37, which is an even less plausible age to be winning tennis tournaments.

Federer won the Australian Open earlier this year, and he's the same age as Serena, iirc.

percheron67 · 09/09/2018 11:47

Didn't see the whole match but I think that Serena came over as nasty tempered, ungracious and obnoxious in the excerpts and photos. My sympathies lie entirely with her opponent.

Nishky · 09/09/2018 11:48

gamerwidow
Did you read my post - I wondered why she didn’t sit with Naomi as she did with Sam

doedoe90303811 · 09/09/2018 11:49

I'm bored of Serena.

Here's an interesting article about Naomi

www.nytimes.com/2018/08/23/magazine/naomi-osakas-breakthrough-game.html

BadLad · 09/09/2018 11:51

I clearly recall Tim Henman being disqualified from Wimbledon one year, for (albeit accidentally) hitting a ball girl with a tennis ball that he had hit in anger when he missed a shot. He didn't protest. In fact, he was very embarrassed and apologised profusely.

That was 1995. Tarango got right on his high horse about it, then had his own meltdown a day or two later.

I think the nearest I've seen to Williams' arguing with the umpire tantrum is Hingis in the French Open in 99.

placemats · 09/09/2018 11:55

Well it was clearly sexist. Many men in tennis get away with so much more, which was what the argument was. Billy Jean King is right about this.

Having said that.

Congratulations Osaka, what a great win.

gamerwidow · 09/09/2018 11:56

Did you read my post - I wondered why she didn’t sit with Naomi as she did with Sam
Maybe she though asking them not to boo was enough? Maybe Naomi didn’t want her to sit with her? Maybe she thought that by sitting with her she’d make Naomi’s win about her?
We’re not SW I don’t think we can know her motivations.

nolongersurprised · 09/09/2018 11:57

Would a man also be able to call an umpire a liar and a thief and get away with it?