To not appreciate Serena using sexism in her arguments against umpire

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Sorry if there is a thread, I did scan four pages to check.

Serena gets coached (which her coach admits) but claims she didn't see it. Then smashes a racquet in separate fit of temper. Then tells the umpire she can't be a cheat because she's a mother(!), he will never referee a match again with her, and he's a thief.

The punishments all seem fine to me and I really felt for Osaka having to apologise in her winners speech. Serena should be saying sorry today IMO.

Men’s tennis is vastly preferable, in my opinion too. The screeching of many of those women is actually unbearable - and unacceptable.

If only they could be penalised, perhaps they would curb it. It seems to me that some of them may be using it as a game ploy.

It seems to me that some of them may be using it as a game ploy.
How would that work, then? Does the woman on the other side of the net find it intimidating? A bit like the haka?
Possibly the reason it hasn't been penalised is because there are also male offenders.

I always assumed it was a game ploy because if you were playing at that level the person returning would get information about where the ball would land based on the sound of the ball hitting the racket.

Nadal seems to grunt when things get tough which doesn’t seem as blatantly gamesmanshiplike.

Ah, that's interesting, nolongersurprised. I looked it up after I'd read your post. Seems unlikely that only women have cottoned on to its advantages, though. There's a long list of male grunters.

Re the football pay - as with the entertainment industry in general, the audience dictates revenue, so rightly or wrongly the big draws command the big bucks. If the female footballers played in the same cup and instantly earned the same money without the necessary return on investment, FIFA would have no choice but to dilute the earnings of the men who were already generating the revenue without any need for a women's game. Some will think this is fair if it achieves equal pay for the same physical work, but to me that's not a level playing field (pardon the pun!) and is not true equality.

As for the noise I wish umpires were more willing to massively clamp down on any and all grunting!!

I would rather (and have) watch a challenger tour men's match than a women's match at any level

Yes the shrieking and grunting but also the tennis on display. That's my preference and that's what I would pay to watch

I'm with serena. The sexism is rife in tennis and I think she has just had enough of it. She did give credit to her opponent and her better playing but of course that isn't reported as much is it.

I'd always choose to watch a Men's match over Women's tbh, even if both played 5 sets, and regardless of who was playing. Normally that would be the case for me. The exception is a match with Serena playing. I love her competitiveness but this time she went over the top.
She wants to have the most GSs of all time and she's struggled with her fitness. I wish her well though.

It's not fair that male tennis players get away with being coached from the box but Sereena was penalised for it.

Double standards are definitely in play here, no wonder she lost it.

Call it sexism or racism, she was definitely treated definitely.

*differently.

Don't know if anyone has mentioned this, but Osaka does actually have a blonde ponytail. She has a two-tone hairstyle. The front, covered by a visor or cap, is her natural dark brown colour, but the back, which she has in a ponytail, is bleached blonde.

I'm a big fan of Serena and I was hoping she would win. Osaka has many years ahead of her and Serena has done so well to recover her form since she had her baby. BUT her behaviour was appalling. It was an embarrassment. There's no excuse. And all this furore about sexism and racism is just a distraction technique to divert attention from shockingly bad behaviour, helped by people with an agenda eager to use it as ammunition for their cause.

Is there any evidence - and I don't just mean a few anecdotes here and there - which suggests that men are systematically treated more leniently than women regarding this particular offence?

*Double standards are definitely in play here, no wonder she lost it.

Call it sexism or racism, she was definitely treated definitely.*

I don't really get this. The match wasn't between Williams and Federer or Murray. It was between two women - two non-white women at that. Any supposedly harsh treatment that Williams may have recieved was to the benefit of another non-white woman, not a white male. Similarly - IF men are treated more leniently for obnoxious behaviour, then that is to the detriment of their opponent, who will also be male.

So I'm not really seeing the 'sexism' here, but this is Serena Williams, who always has to have someone or something to blame when things don't go her way.

why are so many people up in arms because of equal pay in tennis, when no-one seems to care that professional female footballers play the same length of game as the men for less pay?

Top male footballers get paid vast amounts because there is a vast amount of money to be made from their sport. TV rights, tickets, merchandising... it's a multi billion pound industry. That wasn't always the case - while top players were always well-paid, the astronomical sums they earn these days are relatively recent.

As regards women's football, there just isn't anything like the same level of interest, and hence the same level of profits. The likes of Kylian Mbappe or Cristiano Ronaldo don't get to earn a few million a month as a reward for time spent on the pitch, but because their presence in a team brings in huge profits, even allowing for thier sky-high salaries.

So Havaina, do you think Carlos Ramos should just have shrugged and let it go? And if so, why?

Havaina And for the record some men get away with it. Just as some women get away with it. Naomi Osaka got away with it in the same match.

I'm sorry but that's not an argument or a reason.

The Times is reporting that umpires are considering refusing to officiate matches involving Serena Williams over her behaviour at the US Open final

I’m glad that the umpires are discussing taking a stand against her boorish, offensive behaviour.

Good for them. That umpire has been insulted and his name dragged through the mud because of Serena's arrogance. No wonder others wouldn't want to risk it.

Umpires get paid very little and aren't allowed to comment on what happens in their matches. They are also talking about forming a union for the first time. They felt very aggreived that it took 48 hours for the authorities to state publicly that Ramos was absolutely correct in what he did.

Umpires should not have to put up with being shouted at, insulted and threatened in their workplace. Nobody else would be expected to.

"It's not fair that male tennis players get away with being coached from the box but Sereena was penalised for it."

On the tennis podcast it mentioned that both Novak and cecchinato received coaching violations in the French open quarter final about 2 months prior

Top male footballers get paid vast amounts because there is a vast amount of money to be made from their sport. TV rights, tickets, merchandising... it's a multi billion pound industry. That wasn't always the case - while top players were always well-paid, the astronomical sums they earn these days are relatively recent.

As regards women's football, there just isn't anything like the same level of interest, and hence the same level of profits. The likes of Kylian Mbappe or Cristiano Ronaldo don't get to earn a few million a month as a reward for time spent on the pitch, but because their presence in a team brings in huge profits, even allowing for thier sky-high salaries.

Well, there's the thing.

In football, everyone shrugs their shoulders and says, well the money isn't there, the gates for women's games just aren't comparable. In fact, I used to say that.

But suddenly we have a men's rights furore over Wimbledon, where customers buy tickets that cover both men's and women's rounds, and the prizes for winning are equal for men and women. Suddenly it's not about ticket sales any more? and it's about equal pay for equal work?

So why aren't the men and women who are outraged that men are having to play more tennis outraged about the pay disparity in football?

Vardy. It's not really comparing the same thing. Footballers get wages not prize money. Every player in the team is likely getting paid different amounts. Its like saying vardy should get paid the same as Messi.
I think the point that some of the male players make is if they were separate tournaments would they generate the same revenues. They think they are the ones generating the interest and revenue but someone else is benefiting (and playing less in doing so). I may be wrong, but if Wimbledon was mens only they would lose some TV money and some ticket sales, but I would guess it would lose a lot more if it was womens only.

I've also not noticed Serena campaigning for the wheelchair singles to get the same money as the men and women... But then that would mean less money in her pocket so why would she.