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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

TO think Millennials need to get their act together and

380 replies

brownmouse · 21/08/2018 15:43

Form a political party:

  • stop Brexit
  • prioritise housing
  • impose at least 50% tax on all inheritance
  • impose second home taxes

And other stuff. But they should be IN CHARGE now. They need to rise up and sort things out.

I keep telling my DC but they are too busy on instagram. AIBU?

OP posts:
Rufustheyawningreindeer · 23/08/2018 00:00

lulu

Im sorry love if ive misinterpreted what youve said...honestly sorry

But the vast amount of the population of Great Britain wont see that sort of money

Hazardswan · 23/08/2018 00:14

Lulu is not rich but ahead of the curve and could become rich. It's great for her and I'm not at all jealous I am

It's all relative in London that cash wouldn't get you much everywhere else could get a decent 3 bedroom house (with parking) and possibly detached.

I'd go cheaper house and have savings. Then consider changing those savings to euro's if this brexcrement is to go ahead.

LuluJakey1 · 23/08/2018 07:09

Anyway, not about me. I was making a point about how ordinary people inherit quite small amounts of money- in the grand scheme of things- and if they had to pay 50% inheritance tax I think that would be unjust. My dad worked hard and saved that £18,000 and to think of the government taking 50% of it is something I find unpalatable.
Given what houses cost now, taking even 50% of £1million is wrong. I think if inheritance tax is increased it should be on estates upwards of 3-4 million and the first million should be protected.

Surely we should be encouraging people to save and build security for themselves and their families? The fewer who are a burden on the welfare state the better. It is our responsibility to look after ourselves if we can. The state should look after people who can't because of illness, old age, disability, poverty.

Most millenials will inherit money. All of our friends (30s and 40s) have decent jobs or professions, own a house, most went to uni- in comparison to our parents where very few went to uni or had well-paid jobs, and if they ever bought a house it was a tough haul financially for a few years as it is now. I think many generation x /millenials are hugely better off than our parents were at our age- a much bigger perecentage than in my parents generation.

NoSleepTil2030 · 23/08/2018 07:09

I agree that £325k is a lot, despite what Lulu says! That's about 12 years of average full time wage, before tax. So even if someone on that salary saved half their post tax wage (which is hard to do, because, you know, life) it would take them 30 years or so.

NoSleepTil2030 · 23/08/2018 07:16

I think many generation x /millenials are hugely better off than our parents were at our age- a much bigger perecentage than in my parents generation.

That's not what the stats say.

www.ft.com/content/81343d9e-187b-11e8-9e9c-25c814761640?segmentid=acee4131-99c2-09d3-a635-873e61754ec6

No offence Lulu, but most of us haven't inherited £325k and would have pretty different lives if we did. Even a quarter of that amount would be life changing for me. Even £18k would be nice, thanks! That's a lot of months of mortgage payments.

Aaaahfuck · 23/08/2018 07:51

Why millennials? You could work towards this yourself.

Aaaahfuck · 23/08/2018 07:57

Millennials sound depressingly more conservative and passive than I had hoped...

So from a handful of comments on mumsnet you've formed tour opinion of a whole generation?

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2018 08:30

Most millenials will inherit money.

Will they?

Their parents are about to get a nasty shock. Local councils are about to go bust. They can't afford to provide basic social care for the baby boomer generation and with people living longer thats a huge issue. The reality that no one wants to talk about and politicians are trying to avoid is that at some point its going to be the case that if you are a home owner you will pay for care out of your home.

DH's parents have seen this coming and have effectively disinherited him in order to protect their estate. Instead they have locked it up into trust to their grandchildren because it takes advantage of a tax loop hole.

The problem is they are making the assumption that state social care will be sufficient and will be adequate for their needs. The experience my family has already had with my grandmother is this isn't the case at all. She's had to top up her state social care package just to reach the minimum she needs.

This means that if DH's estate is tied up it can't be touched but there will also be a gap in care. Guess who will have to cough up for that.

The other elephant in the room here is a north south divide. House prices in the London area continued to rise for longer and to much higher prices than their babyboomer counterparts in the north. They didn't work harder, they just got richer by a quirk of geography.

It means that those boomers in the south will have more for care and will have something left to give in inheritance. Those in the north could easily be wiped out.

As for millenials inheriting 325k. So speaks a southerner. My parents house is probably only worth about that. Once you take out care for two adults and split between siblings there isn't going to be much if anything near that left. And my parents had an average average household income in a nice area in the north.

Honestly, when people come out with stuff like 325k I could scream because it really shows up the tiny bubble of experience and political awareness they have.

Not all millenials have middle class home owning parents. Not all of them will inherit. When it becomes apparent that it will be better to give it all to the grandkids they'll get the double whammy of that AND having to pick up the cost of social care (plus plan for their own social care and the cost of university for their kids that their parents didn't have).

Its a perfect storm which shafts many millenials. The chances are that many of their kids will be better off though. Provided they can get an education. Those who don't will face huge problems.

Hazardswan · 23/08/2018 08:33

I'm millennial and definitely not better off then my parents and grandparents at my age. I've worked since mid teens (now ft carer) and have no savings, no property but also no debt as I paid that off.

Are we more conservative? I'm not and friends in my age range aren't either. Older generation (one up from millennial...Is it gen X?) I think might be and their parents seem to have more cash to share but that might be due to retirement and a lifetime of saving.

Passive? Perhaps but for me at least that's circumstances which make me passive. I know others who went to uni who are more politically active and support Corby i think the dude is a let down

Hazardswan · 23/08/2018 08:38

redtooth ^^ yes! I know I won't be inhertiting anything due to care bills. I don't mind obviously and I hope my mum has the best care available.

We might be the first generation to inherit nothing or little, my granddad brought his business with his inhertance and he was sorted for life.

MeyMary · 23/08/2018 08:40

impose at least 50% tax on all inheritance

No.

Anyhow. I wish things changed in an imo positive direction.
Especially in regards to climate change, child rights, housing etc...

And whilst it will ultimately fall to millennials to fix this (well, try...)

The world we live in wasn't created by them (us). Most "important'(=influential) politicians, lobbyists, donors etc aren't millennials either.

When it becomes apparent that it will be better to give it all to the grandkids they'll get the double whammy of that AND having to pick up the cost of social care (plus plan for their own social care and the cost of university for their kids that their parents didn't have).

Yes. That's what MIL actually plans on doing... At least in regards to DH, who just gets screwed over by her / his stepfather.

Beansonapost · 23/08/2018 08:49

No thanks.

I'll stick to the toast and the gram.

And I don't want a 50% tax on inheritance.... that's inheritance will be handy for DH and his siblings struggling to get a house!

So nope!

Why is it always the next generations problem? ... why can't the people who continually fuck shit up who are alive and still fucking shit up get their act together? And fix it?

MeyMary · 23/08/2018 09:08

Why is it always the next generations problem? ... why can't the people who continually fuck shit up who are alive and still fucking shit up get their act together? And fix it?

Assigning blame and responsibility is unfortunately easier.

user1457017537 · 23/08/2018 09:30

I’m with the op re millenials seeing their parents’ death as some ghastly lottery win. I know people who are planning their future according to how much they think they will inherit. I truly despise these people. I have nothing but contempt for them. No one can predict the future or what it will hold. They have no vision or work ethic and are lazy and entitled.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2018 09:32

Why is it always the next generations problem? ... why can't the people who continually fuck shit up who are alive and still fucking shit up get their act together? And fix it?

Because people are inherently selfish and lack good understanding of politics and finance. Politicians who should take on that responsibility want to dumb everything down and ignore making difficult and potentially vote losing decisions because thats the nature of populism.

The short termism in politics started with right to buy, but has become increasingly more common. Pensions, privatisation and PFI have been the other short term gain, long term pain policies that have screwed us.

Combined with a collapse in accountability with the loss of local news reporting, a general decline in journalism standards and reductions in transparency through increases in corporate contracts thats why we are where we are now.

MeyMary · 23/08/2018 09:37

@user1457017537

That is ghastly. But I'd be surprised if that was a modern thing.

Inheritance related conflict can even be found in the OT!

It has also been a common theme for crime fiction and literature in general.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2018 09:37

They have no vision or work ethic and are lazy and entitled.

Millennials commute further and many do work longer hours and have multiple jobs as its the only way they can make ends meet.

Remember millenials also include professionals like teachers and junior doctors who are amongst those struggling to buy their own house.

Once again we are listening to the mindset of someone who thinks millennials are just out of school / university and aren't in their mid thirties with a couple of kids.

Do fuck off.

user1457017537 · 23/08/2018 09:55

I am speaking about millenials I know who think nothing of flying around the world but expect their parents to foot the bill for their lifestyle and to whom work is a 4 letter word. The ones I know don’t have one job let alone four. You may not like me calling it as it is but they also expect to inherit from two generations (parents, in-laws and grandparents). They are also happy to live in their parents property which they hope to one day inherit.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2018 10:26

A little thread for you:

IFS @TheIFS
Multiple property ownership is becoming more common among older people than in the past, and these properties tend to be held onto throughout retirement

SEE IMAGE.

Paul Johnson @PJTheEconomist
Every time I see this chart I am amazed. ONE in SIX 55-64 year olds owns a second property.

It's the flipside of low ownership rates among the young - they are renting from their parents' generation. The allocation of housing, not just the quantity, matters.

Faisal Islam @faisalislam
7.6 million in that age group - so this stat beliw would suggest 1 million plus of limited and slowly growing U.K. housing stock owned as a second home - a Venn diagram of people owning second homes and voting against new ones being built would be interesting...

amazing stat- higher than I would have guessed, from this interesting @TheIFS report where economists point out that the tax system is economically unsustainable and suggest a currently politically unsustainable change to tax wealth more and income less

www.ifs.org.uk/publications/12959
The use of wealth in retirement

There has been lots of recent research and debate on individuals’ accumulation of wealth for retirement, driven by the concern that younger generations are not saving enough. Much less attention, however, has been paid to how individuals use their wealth once in retirement. This is an important omission, since understanding more about the evolution of wealth in retirement can help shed light on:

- the extent to which such wealth is currently used to finance spending needs in retirement (and, therefore, the extent to which younger generations may need to accumulate similar sums in order to have similar standards of living in retirement);

- the extent to which current retired generations’ wealth is likely to be bequeathed (which has direct consequences for the resources of later generations);

- how people manage their resources through retirement (which is of increased importance given the introduction of ‘pension freedoms’).

Median non -pensio n wealth among these individuals [55 - 65 year olds] is £250,000 (mean non-pension wealth is £390,000). The majority of this wealth (60%) is held in owner -occupied housing, with 22% held in financial assets (current and savings account s, ISAs, stocks and shares etc.), 11% in other property and 7% in other assets ( such as business assets, land and antiques). What happens to housing wealth in retirement will therefore be the big driver of changes in individuals’ overall wealth.

Wealth is held very unequally the least wealthy 10% of individuals have essentially no wealth on average, while the richest 10% on average have in excess of £1 million.

Where do they expect money to come from for retirement?
The most commonly cited source is the state pension, which shows a distinct age trend: increasing proportions of individuals expect to receive state pension income as they approach retirement, reaching over 90% by age 60 . The next most commonly cited source is private pensions, again increasing with age, reaching two-thirds of those in their 50s. Perhaps less expected, over 40% of individuals report expecting to use savings to provide money for retirement suggesting many individuals expect to draw down accumulated wealth. Around 30% report expecting to use their primary housing (through downsizing, taking equity withdrawal o r renting out rooms)

Problem here. Millenials can't afford to move up the ladder. They are living in smaller houses to those generations above and they will never be able to acculumate enough to move up. The double whammy is that with baby boomers downsizing and they are also facing more competition (thus higher prices) for smaller properties.

The net effect is that boomers either can't downsize or won't get as much money from their property as they are expecting and that there is a band of smaller 2 / 3 properties which are going to end up over inflated in price (especially since the trend in recent years by builders has been to build bigger properties outside metropolitian areas because they make most profit on them). The whole current structure of the housing market is about to implode from this alone - with major implications. Expectations are not going to match reality.

These findings suggest that precautionary saving, bequest mot ives and financial acuity all play a role in individuals’ choices. The result is that the majority of financial wealth is set to be bequeathed rather than spent during retirement. This has direct implications for younger generations - they are likely to inherit the majority of their parents’ current financial wealth (in addition to other assets such as housing) . Given wealth inequality, some individuals will inherit little, while others will inherit substantial sums

This also suggests that plans are currently being made in families across generations which both generations are aware of. If a spanner is thrown in the works, and there is a total collaspe in social care to a level that has not been planned for, this could be problematic.

^The EoL data suggest that in England there are not such large expenses on average. Just 6% of individuals faced some out-
of-pocket costs for medical treatment out side the NHS in the
last year of life. We do not have dat a explicitly on social care expenses, but the EoL data do tell us that only around 7% of individuals received assistance with daily activities from a privately paid employee in the run-up to death. Some 21% did stay in a nursing or residential home in the last two years of their life (32% of these stayed for six months or more), but not all of these individuals would have paid for this care privately.^

This is frankly unsustainable. Its going to increase. Again expectations v reality are going to kick in at some point.

Decreases in tax revenue with an aging population who are not taxed through income tax are also something of an issue here.

Also if one of your parents live until their 80s or 90s, you are going to have a LONG wait until you get any inheritence. You are likely to also be also approaching retirement yourself with kids long since gone.

TO think Millennials need to get their act together and
RedToothBrush · 23/08/2018 10:28

I am speaking about millenials I know who think nothing of flying around the world but expect their parents to foot the bill for their lifestyle and to whom work is a 4 letter word. The ones I know don’t have one job let alone four.

So you are tarring a whole generation based on a bunch of people you know who have money and haven't said no to their kids

Here have a slow hand clap and a biscuit.
Biscuit

Meanwhile, I'll talk about economics and politics.

leighdinglady · 23/08/2018 10:33

What? Why would you want inheritance tax. My parents have worked hard and paid taxes all their lives. Why should half their home be taxed rather than passed down to me? Likewise I now own my own home and want it to pass to my children.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2018 10:44

Why would you want inheritance tax

If you are not in the richest part of the population or think that there should be a threshold where anyone above that point should be hit harder so that you don't have to have your income tax significantly raised to cover the cost of increasing cost of social and health care.

In other words, if you are in the lowest or middle bands for wealth and see the hugely uneven distribution of wealth enjoyed by the top 10% as a major social issue and injustice.

leighdinglady · 23/08/2018 10:53

Rubbish. It's not only 10% of the population that own their own home. Even those that do earn high salaries are taxed higher all their lives and then get hit with inheritance tax too.
My family are very working class. Half council houses half have managed to buy. Why should the government be able to take half their limited assets.

Redgreencoverplant · 23/08/2018 10:54

Well if we are basing this on who we know every millennial I know has a job, pays tax and NI, supports themselves and pays for their own holidays.

Mugglemom · 23/08/2018 10:59

Soz, too busy making avacado toast. Will retweet though, Love and prayers.

GrinlolGrin