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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

'helping' my DD at the expense of my DS

151 replies

Hotpants · 21/08/2018 09:59

My DD14 goes to Cadets. She can be socially awkward & this has been really good for her, she has made some nice friends. Her younger brother (DS12) has been DESPERATE to start and has been waiting impatiently (for over a year) until he is old enough. He can start in September and after such a long wait he is really excited about starting.
However DD has spoken to DH about how she does not want DS to join and would rather stop going... so DH wants us to find an alternative cadet thing for him to go to. I know that this particular cadets is the one that DS really wants to go to and feel that would be really unfair on him. DD's fear is that DS (who is more gregarious & makes friends more easily) would steal her friends/cramp her style. But I think that her cadet friends are good friends who would not drop her like that. Also new 'recruits' are trained together so her brother would have his own set of friends. Rather than separating them I think we should acknowledge her fear, talk to DS about being sensitive to DD's anxiety (I think he would, he knows that she finds it hard to make friends) and try to support DD through that anxiety - so that she will see that her friends will not drop her (she has made a real connection esp with one of them so I feel sure they will not). I think it would be a valuable life lesson and reinforce her self-worth to see that good friends will still like her even if she has a more socially confident brother. I also want them to have shared experiences as they are growing up.
But DH thinks I am not being sensitive to DD's social anxieties. He has likened this to my childhood where I had a beautiful perfect older sister and my parents did nothing to stop her crushing me - but the difference there was that my more confident sibling was unkind & made me feel inferior (& then my insecurities were dismissed by my parents who said what were they supposed to do, curtail her blossoming?). Is DH right, am I doing the same to my DD?
I think not because, although I think DS should be allowed to join her at cadets, I am not dismissing her anxiety and I think we should talk with DS about being sensitive to this etc.
Or am I recreating history here?

OP posts:
ipreferbooks · 21/08/2018 16:59

Can see from both sides, but your DS should definately not miss out on the activitý. I would also suggest maybe your DH should be reading this thread as well.

OrchidInTheSun · 21/08/2018 17:12

Really tough. I agree with MinaPaws. I don't think you can ban your DS from an activity because your DD is doing it first. That's very unfair on him and - if your family is anything like mine - family activities will already be constrained by your DD's anxiety.

I think you need to talk to them both separately and then together as well as the group leaders. If you can make this work, it will be really good for both if them

Juells · 21/08/2018 17:20

One of the problems with anxiety is that if you avoid the thing that you are anxious about and are OK, you 'prove' that avoiding it 'causes' your OK-ness.

She's socially awkward, and has managed to overcome that and make friends. She's not avoiding the social situation.

gandalf456 · 21/08/2018 17:27

She's avoiding her brother joining sea cadets because of her anxiety.

She needs to learn to trust her friends, think She is good enough.

If the friendships thrive with him there, which no doubt they will, she can prove herself wrong .

toothtruth · 21/08/2018 17:31

I think you are right and your husband is wrong. It really wont help DD to get her own way in this and it will build up resentment between the siblings. It wont be as much of an issue as DD thinks it will. As youve said he will have his own friends as his training will be with other kids not the ones DD has already made friends with.
She obviously just anxious about the change but I agree with you the best thing is to talk it all through and help her come to terms with it... not shield her from it completely.

Lindtnotlint · 21/08/2018 19:49

I am not actually sure this is about “anxiety”. I think it could also be that DD has a legitimate and accurate view on how this is likely to impact her. So “teaching her a lesson” will not work out that she realises that it is fine after all, but rather that it is actually a bit shit after all. Watching your sibling shine and be really popular can take the glow off an experience even if it doesn’t involve any concrete change in your own friendships.

FrayedHem · 21/08/2018 21:30

People have said that he will resent his sister if he's not allowed. I think she will equally resent him if he is. It's not an easy situation.

This is what was jumping out to me too.

My eldest has ASD and a lot of what CharDeeMacDennis posted resonates with how DS1 operates in different environments and crossovers are something that make him deeply uncomfortable. That's not to say we don't challenge him on these things, but if he had a hobby that had a social side like Cadets, I'd be very wary of that being one where I expected him to work through it. Though I do see how DS has his heart set on it and has been excitedly looking forward to it for a year. I have no idea what I'd do if it was my DS1 &2 tbh!

It is tricky balancing the needs/wants of siblings. I have 4, I've got things wrong with the best of intentions.

AmIRightOrAMeringue · 21/08/2018 21:40

Are her friends similar ages to her? Boys or girls? I know this isn't really the point as it's more of a moral dilemma, but will the types of kids that are friends with a quiet 14 year old girl, want to hang out with a 12 year old boy??

Had you previously told your son he could go? If he's expecting to join and knows hes on a waiting list or something, i really don't think you can tell him he's not going because his sister doesn't want him there.

I think I would have a quiet word with some of the cadet leaders and see if they can separate them?

If her friends stick by her then it might actually improve her self confidence even more.

It's annoying when your little brother is much more confident than you but there is always going to be more confident people that make friends better, everywhere. And we can't remove them all.

I'd ask her to stick it out for a few months to see how it goes with him there.

I say this as someone who is socially very awkward with a confident outgoing younger brother who everyone loved!

shakeyourcaboose · 21/08/2018 21:51

What has been the discussion previously with regards to him joining? Has it always been an issue for her?

ReanimatedSGB · 21/08/2018 21:57

I despise people who are so 'delicate' that the only way they can thrive is by spoiling things for others. The DS has been desperate to join this group for a year and now his older sister is trying to prevent him doing something he really wants, because she's the special one. Indulging her would be bad for her, as well as other people. Because there's always going to be a point where she runs up against someone else's little princess who won't give in to her because she's been encouraged to believe that everyone needs to prioritise her wishes over their own, as well.

AnnieAnoniMoose · 21/08/2018 22:23

SGB you despise a socially anxious child with, likely, autism, who has found a space she can thrive in, asking for this ONE thing.. REALLY. Wow.

campion · 21/08/2018 22:31

Maybe your DS already has to give in to her in subtle, and not so subtle,ways? This dynamic can develop in a family that has a child with ASD (which you suspect your DD possibly has) without you realising,at least not for quite a while.

It's not fair to expect him to change his plans solely on the basis that it doesn't suit her. Suppose she was in an orchestra and he also passed the audition a couple of years later. Would it be ok to stop him joining because she thought he'd spoil it for her?

If this is the only group he wants to join I think your DD needs reassuring that,in reality, they'll see v little of each other.

Nikephorus · 22/08/2018 08:01

Maybe your DS already has to give in to her in subtle, and not so subtle,ways? This dynamic can develop in a family that has a child with ASD (which you suspect your DD possibly has) without you realising,at least not for quite a while.
Or more likely she's just been constantly forced to cope with everything because her louder, more dominant siblings and parents shout her down.

Juells · 22/08/2018 08:04

@ReanimatedSGB

I despise people who are so 'delicate' that the only way they can thrive is by spoiling things for others.

Exactly! The little girl has found a place she likes, and along comes her brother and spoils it.

Oh...that wasn't what you meant?

Amaaboutthis · 22/08/2018 08:07

Why on earth would 14 year old girls even pass the time with 12 year old boys. They’ll each have their own friends and do their own thing and i think you need to help your dd to build her own resilience but allowing your son to go to the same cadets as I seriously doubt they’d even have anything to do with each other

Guienne · 22/08/2018 08:36

Has your husband pointed out to your daughter that it's wildly unlikely her friends will want to go off with 12 year old boys? And that stopping going will mean that she doesn't see her friends at all, which would be cutting off her nose to spite her face?

worridmum · 22/08/2018 08:44

I had this same scenro when i was a child with brownies the group my sister went to was the local and best in the area did camps fun activities my sister threw a strop so i had to go the next closest 45 min drive away it was crap did the same activity week in werk no camps at all. Same as a previous poster do not make that mistake please it will only give your older child a weapon to beat the younger one with. Along the lines haha i stopped you going to group you wanted because they love me more etc ( this is exactly what was said by my sister....)

campion · 22/08/2018 09:21

Louder, more dominant, shout her down?
Where has OP said any of that Nikephorous?
She just said her DS is more socially confident.

ArsenalsPlayingAtHome · 22/08/2018 09:25

YANBU

But I know how you feel.

It could potentially cause your DS to resent his sister & feel bitter towards you, damage his confidence & their relationship.

Your DS can't be punished because of his sister's anxieties, and I'm sure this is how he would see it.

Also, he sounds compassionate and sensitive towards his Dsis's feelings.

Howhot · 22/08/2018 09:36

Your DD doesn't get to call the shots here, she's being really selfish and I say that as someone who suffered terribly with social anxiety as a teen. Looking back at myself, my social anxiety did lead me to become selfish and entitled and I started to expect my family to do things my way and I got away with it for a while as an only child but in the real world you can't dictate things like this and she needs to be called out on it.

By all means have a gentle chat with your DS but do not lead the conversation at all and if he insists this is where he wants to be I really don't think you should stand in his way.

DarklyDreamingDexter · 22/08/2018 09:37

If your son wasnt bothered I'd say leave it, but since he is desperate to join you'd BVU to prevent him. Her 14 year old friends aren't going to drop her for a 12 year old newbie. No way! She needs to see this to be true for herself. You can't let her control the situation. If she wants to cut off her nose to spite her face by leaving, that's a silly thing to do and she needs this explained to her. How many other times has your son had to miss out to defer to his sister's sensibilities? Hopefully none, but even once is very unfair.

FrancisCrawford · 22/08/2018 10:34

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Jeeves93 · 22/08/2018 11:57

Realistically, if she has been there for a good amount of time, they will not be in the same training "group" so won't really be hanging out together. I have seen many siblings go to the same cadet unit and it has never really been an issue. I have never seen one leave because their younger brother/sister joined.

teaandtoast · 22/08/2018 13:59

@ReanimatedSGB - God, Solid, you've got a real downer on girls, haven't you?

ReanimatedSGB · 23/08/2018 20:17

@teaandtoast Actually, not in the least. I have met boys and men with similar I'm-so-special selfishness. If they have charm as well, they get indulged at the expense of other people and it does them no good.