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Original poster

To think you can’t really get a decent PT job unless you already work there

245 replies

Metoodear · 20/08/2018 08:22

So following on from my post about working PT I getting loads of people saying yep rally easy to woke pt I get 30, 40k pro rata blah blah however these are often women who have worked for a company for a number of years then reduced after maternity leave i am also not talking about PT were you drop one day but are still working 9-5 four days a week

This kind of PT working is not what I was talking about I am talking about after having done a qualification then after having 2-5 years out of work after being a SHAM trying to find a PT job that is under 25 hours a week that is not in a school admin or retail in a company you never worked for
i am a support worker but have had to take a job at the lower end of the pay scale in order to secure 20 hours a week working i have friends that have degrees in physiology ect who work in admin and a friend who has a degree in a second language but is really struggling to find anything other than admin or work in a school for less than 25 hours after being at home for8 years

I myself have been looking for another job since I got my curroone and you just don’t see PT ones

OP posts:
Lazypuppy · 20/08/2018 09:40

@BlairWaldorfsHeadband wanting PT hours is fine, everyone is different. my issue is i don't understand why people expext to able to walk into a qualified high paid job at part time hours, then get annoyed when they can't find anything.

I am not just working for my retirement, i want money now. I want to be able to go on a couple of holidays a year, have the big family home, be able to shop whenever I want, go out for takeaways/meals oit without having to worry.

Momo27 · 20/08/2018 09:40

Today 09:26 BlairWaldorfsHeadband

‘Plus it’s depressing people have to spend their youth working for a pension that they’ll be too old and ill to use anyway.’

You’ve given precisely the reason i kept working through having children (though dropping to 3 days when they were tiny) and then stepped back up to ft when they were in school. That way I’ve managed to accrue a good enough pension to drop down to pt when I’m in my 50s and will be able to stop work completely (if I want) in by 60.

It’s no good just saying ‘the UK has got it wrong.’ The reality is that pensions are a ticking time bomb for many people and women are far more affected than men, precisely because they tend to work and earn less.

Ultimately it’s up to every family to decide what’s best for them, but don’t kid yourself that the decisions we make don’t have a long term impact. I worked pt for only a few years out of my working life so far but even that has knocked a few thousand a year off my work pension.

BlairWaldorfsHeadband · 20/08/2018 09:43

Seems like a shit deal to give your youth to a company and get what, a decade back to yourself before Alzheimer’s or cancer gets you?

Perhaps I’m morbid but that seems to be a one way deal to me.

JaceLancs · 20/08/2018 09:46

Have you considered the voluntary sector?
Most of the jobs I see advertised are part time
In the charity I work for I’m the only full time worker

RiverTam · 20/08/2018 09:46

Lazy but why not? It works in Holland (see children's link above, sorry, I thought it was Denmark) so why not here? Because if the mindset of employers - you have pay your dues before it can be considered a valid method of employment. All that wasted experience, skills and qualifications. How is that good for society or the economy?

BlairWaldorfsHeadband · 20/08/2018 09:49

River spot on. The U.K. had an attitude of it being a moral duty to sacrifice your life for an employer and it’s odd.

Lazypuppy · 20/08/2018 09:56

@BlairWaldorfsHeadband you're working for the wrong employers, i get just as much out of my employer as i give in. Main reason i chose them.

@RiverTam i used to have employees working part time and full time. My issue was people interviewing for pt hours stating the only days / times they would be able to work, no flexibility. Yet the contract was ecplained to them as being no of hours not set days, althoighh 80% of the time they would be working the shifts each week. I worked in retail where all staff had to be flexible, for xmas/sale etc so it wasn't wasted skills and experience because they would have probably quit in the run up when they were required to do more hours.

As i have said previously, changing to PT from FT works as you already know the job. Startong at PT is hard as you miss so much that happens on your days off it takes so long to pick up the job.

Momo27 · 20/08/2018 09:58

BlairWaldorfsHeadband

‘Seems like a shit deal to give your youth to a company and get what, a decade back to yourself before Alzheimer’s or cancer gets you?

Perhaps I’m morbid but that seems to be a one way deal to me.’

Well ultimately that’s your view, and clearly that will affect your decision making

Some of us are just offering an alternative viewpoint. We’re all different. Some of my friends thought I was nuts for carrying on working when we had 3 kids in childcare and all my salary went on that. I did it to keep my foot on the career ladder because I didn’t want to end up finding it difficult to get back into work, or ending up in a lower status role, or possibly even never returning to full time work.

I think some of my colleagues are nuts when I see them working only part time still (when their kids are much older, even left home) especially when in reality in my field (education) part timers often end up doing loads on their days off for part time wages.

The important thing is to think through not just the immediate impact but the longer term impact of whatever decision you make.

To some extent it’s horses for courses isn’t it? I don’t want to end up working til 67 and then living out my final few years on the shitty state pension. Neither do I just want to rely on the half of my dh’s work pension I’ll get if he dies first.

I certainly don’t feel I ‘gave up my youth’ to achieve this. I just developed my career far enough to the point where I could have children and drop to part time for a few years and then stepped back up. And when I was part time I was never picky about which days I worked... it’s a two way thing, employers aren’t going to bend to every individual whim.

Lazypuppy · 20/08/2018 10:04

@Momo27 couldn't agree more! I think you have had the right attitude and will reap the rewards when you are able to retire early on a good pension income

Jellycatspyjamas · 20/08/2018 10:06

I’m returning to work part time having had a flexible working request agreed. I asked for a straight .5 FTE though, it was much less likely they would have agreed to, say, a 21 or 28 hour post because it would be very difficult to fill the balance of the role and my job wouldn’t lend itself to someone doing 7-14 hours a week.

I do wonder sometimes if part of the issue is folk wanting very specific hours, eg 4 days from 9.30-2.30. Yes I know it’s to accommodate school pick up etc but that means a company being ok with someone not being there first thing in the morning or last thing at night which is hard for a business to sustain.

MingeUterusMingeMingeYoni · 20/08/2018 10:07

Not too surprised that many people find it difficult or just unpalatable to have set hours but not days. I'm one of the few parents for whom that actually wouldn't be a problem, and I still wouldn't do it.

In terms of retiring and pensions, I don't expect to get any state or occupational pension until I'm about 98 and am never going to be a high enough earner to fund an early retirement purely through the defined contribution pensions that are all that's available to me. Working part time should hopefully mean I can keep going for longer.

RiverTam · 20/08/2018 10:14

Well, damn my body for failing me so I had to stop working well before DD was even concieved. And damn my mother for being very ill. Up with capitalism! Down with society!

Come on. Explain to me why this works in Holland but couldn't possibly here. Explain to me how societally speaking having your child in full time childcare for years and years is a good thing. Explain how societally speaking having to do that in order to secure a decent old age is a good thing.

It isn't. None of it is. And it'll stay like that as long as those at the top kerp it like that.

Anyway, I'm ranting incoherently so I shall bail at this point!

MulberryPeony · 20/08/2018 10:24

I’ve been incredibly lucky in my professional career and have been able to get a number of part time roles through contacts rather than advertised jobs. I have however been flexible on the days and hours which suits the projects I’m working on. Obviously with formal childcare this would be very difficult to do though.

In my industry it’s becoming increasingly common for both sexes to do compressed hours, flexi time, reduced days, additional holidays, and some working from home. There has however been a definite increase in the expected hours for full time work over the past 20 years from 36.5 to 40 hours which may have been more of a driver for companies to offer flexibility than being a women’s only issue?

Momo27 · 20/08/2018 10:28

Absolutely not going to get in the tired old debate about childcare. If you don’t want to use childcare that’s purely a personal choice. But don’t resent those who do use it and manage to retain their place on the career ladder or work more hours because of it. We all make choices within the parameters available to us; no point making a choice and then being miserable about it.

Obviously health conditions (one’s own or children) will be one of the parameters within which we all have to operate. Plus all the other variables ... whether there is family support, whether you prioritise your partners career over your own, whether you’ve opted for a career where there’s likely to be a skills shortage and you have more leverage...

Momo27 · 20/08/2018 10:29

That was in response to Rivers post btw.

BlairWaldorfsHeadband · 20/08/2018 10:29

River I completely agree with your posts.

And for people moaning about being picky about days - no nursery will let me do floating days. I have tried but I have to book my son in for set days, so what am I supposed to do?!

Original poster
Metoodear · 20/08/2018 10:30

RiverTam

Well, damn my body for failing me so I had to stop working well before DD was even concieved. And damn my mother for being very ill. Up with capitalism! Down with society!

Come on. Explain to me why this works in Holland but couldn't possibly here. Explain to me how societally speaking having your child in full time childcare for years and years is a good thing. Explain how societally speaking having to do that in order to secure a decent old age is a good thinits not one of my work mates has just moved here from Sweden and she says they have free child care virtually from birth she says their mat leave is not that good because of it and if you do want to stay at home because childcare is free their is a lot of pressure to go back ASAP she also has said you don’t get the variety of childcare you do here because the free childcare is set up around nurseys

OP posts:
TheSconeOfStone · 20/08/2018 10:39

As I said on your other thread my brother and sis in law have both applied for decent PT roles and got them. They are for 4 days a weeks with lots of flexi and working from home. They don’t expect all the schools holidays off though.

If you have all the school holidays off who covers that time? Other working parents probably.

cadburyegg · 20/08/2018 10:46

Sector dependent, but yes the majority of my colleagues who are part timers (including me) were full time to start with and then negotiated part time hours after maternity leave. If a part timer leaves then often the hours are offered up to other staff so they are less likely to be advertised.

Tbh it’s fair enough. Keeping your foot in the door is valuable even if you’re just paying for childcare in the first few years. I agree that parents need to look at the long term implications of their choices when they have children. Someone who has taken the best part of a decade out of the workplace will always struggle to walk into a part time role with the exact salary, hours, responsibilities etc of their choosing.

My employer predominantly advertises full time roles but we often end up recruiting 2 part timers even though it costs more, because we look for the best people for the job. So it’s always worth enquiring if part time work would be considered even if it’s advertised as a full time job.

Since2016 · 20/08/2018 10:50

I think you’re right in that it’s more difficult to get a PT job if you’re not already in it, but it’s also much harder to get a job full stop if you take time out to be at home. They’re all life style choices!

WRT not wanting to pay others to look after your kids etc.... these comments make me laugh. I work 4 days a week. I’m lucky I realise, as I also have GP help but my DD is in nursery two days a week and I have absolutely no issue with it. You can’t expect the same job as a FT person which fits into a very narrow set of parameters, without any sort of flexibility.

MaybeDoctor · 20/08/2018 10:50

I had a leadership role in teaching (SLT) and was refused part-time working after maternity leave. My husband has a highly demanding job and it just wasn't practical for me to continue. It was a huge shock to then find that getting a part-time job in teaching (this was in inner London) was highly competitive - even with all my years of experience. Supply agencies couldn't seem to get their head around the fact that I had had a year as a SAHM or that I wanted to work only certain days per week, which of course didn't add up with the extortionate cost of childcare. I eventually left teaching altogether, thereby contributing to the teacher shortage!

I have worked part-tine in another sector for a number of years now and it really is the best of both worlds. But it is difficult to find another job when you want to move on - not many jobs are advertised as pt.

Since2016 · 20/08/2018 10:53

Also very well said Mono - this debate is boring. You can’t make a decision on one hand and then complain bitterly when you’re no longer employable at the same level as you were before you basically took an extended career break! I mean fgs get a reality check!

Momo27 · 20/08/2018 10:56

WRT not wanting to pay others to look after your kids etc.... these comments make me laugh.

Me too! I mean, absolutely fine if that’s what you as parents decide. But you can’t then complain if parents who do use childcare end up getting further ahead in the workplace because they’ve enabled themselves to keep working through those early years

BlairWaldorfsHeadband · 20/08/2018 10:59

I mean, it’s not individual parents who use childcare I find the issues with, it’s the system as a whole. It’s not a personal gripe against working parents...

Saidthesharktotheflyingfish · 20/08/2018 11:16

The NHS is generally really good for part time/term time/compressed hours. I got a part time job on a very decent salary and even if the hours aren't exactly what you are after, it may be possible to revise them once you have been in post for a while.

Regarding degrees, such a large percentage of applicants for jobs will have a degree these days, that unless it relates directly to the role, being a graduate really wont count for that much in terms of appointing the right candidate. That will be the same for full and part time work.