AIBU to have my children (8&5) do 30-40 mins of writing and maths every day of the holidays?

[Dilemmacentral]

Every morning, after breakfast, I ask that the children do 20 mins writing in a holiday journal and then younger does 15 mins of basic maths (reception - year 1 maths), and older one does 20 mins of mental maths, mainly tables? Every day, even when we went on holiday.

It doesn’t feel like a big deal. They don’t complain. They are so used to it (I do it every holiday) and in fact both seem to really enjoy the journal writing in particular.

But! A dear friend, in a genuinely unjudgemental manner, asked whether I felt guilty and said she thought that holiday were good for a complete break other than set school work. We do have set school work but very little (book reviews for eldest).

I don’t feel guilty at all and I told her as such, and we just moved on to another topic. I plan to continue doing. However I’m wondering about others thoughts out of nosiness and whether others do this too.

I feel the heat hols are so long. And it’s only max of 40 mins so that they hit ground running in September. Am I alone though?!

Does anyone actually think that enforced extra homework is going to do anything other than make a struggling child hate learning more?
Yes. Wider educational activities are one of the reasons there is a massive difference between student achievement by background (to make a crude generalisation).
It's all about context. Forcing a child who hates maths to work through a maths textbook probably isn't going to switch them on or engage them, but if a child lacks confidence in reading then reading together, making up stories etc is probably quite useful and fun. Forcing a child to do science worksheets is probably less likely to engage than sending the children into the garden to hunt for minibeasts etc.

Does anyone actually think that enforced extra homework is going to do anything other than make a struggling child hate learning more?

Of course it is. It will help them to understand the things they obviously were not understanding in the classroom (for whatever reason). Or do we just write them off as someone who struggles so lets sit back and watch them flounder?

Or do we just write them off as someone who struggles so lets sit back and watch them flounder?

My sons dyslexic, I feel school have down exactly the above and just leave him to fail.

I know he can do it and I'm doing everything I can at home to help him achieve.

Bloody shame watching kids hate school because they teach to the top and sod everyone else because they have targets to reach.

And yes I know all kids are targeted, but they want to knock him off the curriculum so he doesn't appear in their statistics and therefore can be classed differently. It's not going to happen!

I think you can spot things sometimes with your own child and give them some help where it's needed. Doing it through graded workbooks can give the non teacher a way-in, a starting point.

Another way of looking at it could be "Does anyone think an average teacher with a class of 30 and limited class time can really spot an individual's weak spots and provide successful one to one help?"

Having said all that I think one great strength of home learning is emotional connectedness. So the sharing of great books, doing a scrapbook together and cooking / sharing of our food. But it doesn't have to be either or.

GreenTulips Ds was in the exact position. He has dyslexia, couldn't read or write and was told he had to complete the homework tasks as they were teaching the Curriculum.

No way could ds complete the work. Kept in every break and lunchtime to stare at a blank sheet of paper.

I pulled him out to home ed him.
I always felt that the school got rid of anyone who was going to bring their SATS mark down.

I always felt that the school got rid of anyone who was going to bring their SATS mark down.

I'm pretty sure this is what our school is working towards :(

Does anyone actually think that enforced extra homework is going to do anything other than make a struggling child hate learning more?

Worked for my DC who were/are struggling in certain areas.

Maths factor - was a god send - slowly working through explanations then practise my DC stopped struggling and are now top sets. They often seem to relish the summer and winter schools on there.

Same with reading I had a child who thought reading wasn’t for them - worked through Dancing Bears - back to very basics - took a while he got it and since then has been a book worm - soon as he could read books by himself his confidence just soared.

Spelling harder to help - they've all done work throughout the year and summer on that - it improves so they are not quite so self conscious about being poor spellers. Mostly that's stuff with us.

Dulingo - with languages - not a Strong suit of DC or us but little and often has massively helped all of them.

Gamification things like Dragon box and teach your monster how to read are also tools to use.

Sometimes it's a different explanation, sometime the slower pace, other times breaking it down just for them in one to one others just repetition until it sinks in. We don't do work books for the sake of it though.

I have found though some people believe very much in natural brilliance – you have it or you don’t hard work, schools, teachers don’t matter at all.

Other times it’s more because other parents can’t do extra – their working – I’d be much more reluctant if my children had to be in some form of childcare most of summer to try and do anything with them. 20 minutes at breakfast, 40 at tea is nothing if rest of the day for most of the six weeks they can do what they want or do fun stuff.

Their teachers seem to think it a postive thing - they don't suffer the summer slump that many of their peers do - (though I don't think it's six weeks it's the six week plus the 2 + weeks at end of the busy term when stuff starts to stop and week of settling down other end that does it.)

If they enjoy it, I don't think it's a bad thing to do, and some children enjoy that kind of routine, so if it works for your family, then it's probably the right thing for them.

I tried doing it with my kids one holiday, and it was definitely the wrong thing in their case. I find that if I let them cool and do absolutely nothing for the first couple of weeks of the holidays they start to get bored and come up with their own creative ideas for fun which end up being far more educational that anything I could have done in a more planned way.

I strongly disagree with your approach. Much better to incorporate things into everyday tasks. I would encourage reading (together and alone), provide nice stationery and craft stuff and ask questions in context. Play games, science, map reading etc. My DD has 11+ in September and has done only a very small bit of practice to keep her hand in. I wouldn’t have done that if no exam.

They often didn't enjoy it initially - though we didn't start in holidays but in term - easier IME. We do the same or more of the same in holidays.

Because they struggled had convinced themselves they were bad at the thing - it took coaxing, insisting and outlasting and tantrums, going way back to point they were happy, bribery and routine. When they reach the point or several points of ha I can do this and start to enjoy it – it’s just priceless - though sometimes like with spelling they just struggle less and there is no oh moment but more tolerance of doing the extra.

You can provide all the nice stationery and craft stuff in the world, but if your child won't touch it of their own free will, then how does that help.

Forcing a child to play games is no fun for anyone.

Much better to incorporate things into everyday tasks

That apporach doesn't work well for my DC. They work better through clear programs and maths they do better abstract them later apply to real world. I don't know why but it's what we have found.

cloudtree - no, I’m not a fan of PGL. DD spent one week in Brittany with four girlfriends, hosted by a parent who is a maths teacher (!) where they got a lot of freedom to self direct and debrief after the school year. Then two weeks making films and doing group activities in Austria. Two weeks painting/drawing/doing photography at an artist’s colony in the Ardèche. Now she’s going to do a short thinking skills course in London. We also had a family holiday in Greece where we did nothing but swim/eat/play with other families!

cloudtree - no, I’m not a fan of PGL. DD spent one week in Brittany with four girlfriends, hosted by a parent who is a maths teacher (!) where they got a lot of freedom to self direct and debrief after the school year. Then two weeks making films and doing group activities in Austria. Two weeks painting/drawing/doing photography at an artist’s colony in the Ardèche. Now she’s going to do a short thinking skills course in London. We also had a family holiday in Greece where we did nothing but swim/eat/play with other families!

Ah see that's where I'm failing - sorry! I shall send my DC off to Brittany, Austria, the Ardeche, London and Greece next year! So glad you've provided a viable educational learning plan for us all there! Thank you!!!

FFS we have a high six figure household income and we would struggle t0 do that so what chance have most got? And to be honest even if we could do it I wouldn't. I quite like seeing mine..

I'm genuinely not sure whether you're taking the piss user If so then sorry, doesn't always translate in writing!

The point is that you don’t force anything. You know your children so can provide access to learning opportunities that they choose to take part in that will help them develop. There may be some children who love worksheets but I doubt it. And if that was the case you wouldn’t have to enforce 20 mins or however long.

YANBU. I wish I had done this - every year including this one. This year has been shocking and they have barely touched a book and I have been working all summer.

I have to enforce music practice. They get fun from band but they need to be chivvied into practice. I have to force cleaning and tidying jobs or they'd do nothing and with one I have to enforce regular showering and tooth brushing. They are all differently motivated.

My kids are very laid back. Waiting for them to do as they please (which I do a fair amount) results in a whole lot of idleness which is only fine up to a point.

cloudtree - why would I be taking the piss? I see my DC all year long and it’s good for everyone to take a break from family roles and routines. There are fabulous summer schools all over Europe and the US that do great business, so there are clearly plenty of families like mine, who think those sorts of activities are a great way for DC to spend their summer holidays.

User, I think people are just a bit stunned that anyone has that much money to fling at a kid's summer holiday. No, there aren't plenty of families who can do multiple activities like this, not in the great scheme of things!

I mean, do it if you are happy and have the money to do it without getting into debt, but I'm just explaining why you got such disbelieving reactions.

User, I think people are just a bit stunned that anyone has that much money to fling at a kid's summer holiday. No, there aren't plenty of families who can do multiple activities like this, not in the great scheme of things!

That. And that an 8 and 5 year old would be happy to spend that amount of time away from home doing that type of activity!

I knew really user I was just giving you a get out clause in case you were regretting suggesting such an extreme (and extremely expensive) way of avoiding 20 minutes of homework throughout the holidays.

Clearly people do this (although I have to say that at my DC's school I'm not aware of anyone who would do quite so much - and it's an independent selective so not through lack of cash or lack of pushy parenting, plenty of both in abundance), but to come on to a thread like this and suggest that your way of "teaching" is superior is an interesting approach given that it would be restricted to such a small group of people with both the means and the inclination.

Look even if we could afford fabulous summer schools in Europe (we can’t afford them for six weeks) I would still want to spend quantity time with my kids. Not just quality time. Also as a previous user said the time teaching my DCs something new (even if it is academic) is also time I spend with them, and we have conversations that lead in different directions and so on. The other day a Maths conversation about fractions led to a long discussion about the men’s 100m World sprint record. I would rather have those conversations myself with my child.
And for the record I do work FT and have a nanny for both boys (all the more reason I am not sending them all over Europe for the summer but rather spending actual quantity time with them).

Yes, another independent school parent. No one I know does this. Actually no, there is one girl (or a set of three siblings) but their very successful parents are literally never around. They have 3 live in nannies (2 for various European languages), a cook, a full time daily Cleaner. Lovely girls but they never ever really go to the beach with their parents. It’s all curated ‘quality time’.

Quantity time is a good concept! As a primary aged kid I spent a fair bit of time in my mum's workplace and looking back it was very valuable for "learning by observing."