AIBU to have my children (8&5) do 30-40 mins of writing and maths every day of the holidays?

[Dilemmacentral]

Every morning, after breakfast, I ask that the children do 20 mins writing in a holiday journal and then younger does 15 mins of basic maths (reception - year 1 maths), and older one does 20 mins of mental maths, mainly tables? Every day, even when we went on holiday.

It doesn’t feel like a big deal. They don’t complain. They are so used to it (I do it every holiday) and in fact both seem to really enjoy the journal writing in particular.

But! A dear friend, in a genuinely unjudgemental manner, asked whether I felt guilty and said she thought that holiday were good for a complete break other than set school work. We do have set school work but very little (book reviews for eldest).

I don’t feel guilty at all and I told her as such, and we just moved on to another topic. I plan to continue doing. However I’m wondering about others thoughts out of nosiness and whether others do this too.

I feel the heat hols are so long. And it’s only max of 40 mins so that they hit ground running in September. Am I alone though?!

My DH does this with DS. 10 minutes at most of maths or logic problems using things like dice or he makes up questions using things from DS's life i.e. minecraft, Fortnite. He will use the Carol Vorderman maths books Carol Vorderman 10 minutes a day.
He loves doing it, it's time spent with his Dad. DH makes sure that it is never negative or pressurised and gives lots of positive reinforcement. If DS is having a bad day or maybe overly tired he'll skip it or just keep it short. DS asked me to do "mummy homework" the other day because DH was out so I had to pull out my maths skills!
He does brilliantly at school and his teachers have said that whatever we are doing we should keep doing it. So we will.

As an ex teacher, I can think of nothing worse than worksheet based learning. If you want to keep up maths do interactive games with them (Countdown style or the most ways to make a number). I like the idea of a journal though, assuming they have control/choice over it. Could be completely private or maybe you could all work together to produce a family holiday journal incorporating photos, drawings etc?
The best bit about the summer for me is having time to actually listen away from the pressure of school work & activities. I had a Mum who took a huge interest in my school work & it had a massively negative effect on my self esteem- I felt I was never good enough & became terrified of making mistakes. As a result, I suffered from anxiety & depression for years. I have a much less pressured approach to parenting which seems to work for us.

Pretty lazy parenting op , far better to practise maths in everyday life. Baking , at the shops , working out discounts for days out. Writing stories , making labels , a pen friend.
So many far better ways to learn.

Sounds pretty joyless but if it works for you, fair enough.

I wouldn't do it, but we're not keen on structured learning here; free-format stuff suits mine better.

(and I wish the holidays were twice as long. I hate sending them to school so I only get the tired and stressed ends of the day)

I think different things work for different DC. I always liked worksheets, I liked filling them in and making them all neat. As an adult I still like bullet journals and a paper based planner etc, and enjoyed working in admin.

Otoh I rememer being in primary school and learning about volume using the big water tray outside and just being bored and wanting to go inside thinking 'whats the point of putting water from one jug from the other?'

I think it's unreasonable but then if they really enjoy it then no it's not!

We did it in the Summers of years 3,4 and 5 so aged 7-11. Mostly with an eye on the 11+ which happens in September of year 6. DS (14) has run a "maths revision session" for the local kids twice this summer and is looking through his text books ready to start his GCSE courses in September, DD (11) has a reading list, which she has been working through. At their ages now they manage their own time, but on slightly boring days I do suggest they might want to look at a book....

Pretty lazy parenting op , far better to practise maths in everyday life. Baking , at the shops , working out discounts for days out. Writing stories, making labels , a pen friend. So many far better ways to learn.

Yeah love to know how you're going to apply that to algebraic fractions and trigonometry. But hey knock yourself out trying with your 'non lazy' parenting

Cloud tree just adapt this or many , many other real life examples. Algebra is part of day to day life.

Joseph's parents were going to a restaurant for dinner and they had a budget of $80. They had to fill the gas tank. They needed at least 15 gallons of gas to get to the restaurant. The price of gas depended on where and when they buy it (variable). How much could they afford to order off the menu (variable) and still have enough money for tip and tax?

First they had to define the problem. That took strong mathematical reasoning skills. They asked Joseph for help. Joseph suggested labeling everything as follows.

Gas price is Y
Amount they could order off the menu is X
Tip 20 % of X
Tax is 7% of X
Total budget must not exceed $80

Then they had to create the equation. Like word problems, real life scenarios require complex problem solving skills. Joseph helped again.

80 ≥ X (.2) + X (.07) + 15Y + X

Solve for X

They bought gas first for $1.95 per gallon.
They put that in for Y.
80 ≥ X (.2) + X (.07) + 15 (1.95) + X
80 ≥ X (.2) + X (.07) + 29.25 + X

Then they simplified by subtracting 29.25 from both sides of the equation getting,
50.75 ≥ X (.2) + X (.07) + X

When they looked at the menu they plugged in different menu items for X to make their equation true. First they tried $30
50.75 ≥ X (.2) + X (.07) + X
50.75 ≥30 (.2) + 30 (.07) + 30
50.75 ≥6 + 2.1 +30
50.75 ≥ 38.10
They realized, yes, they could order $30 of food from the menu but Joseph wanted a $12 appetizer. Could they order $42 of food from the menu?
$38.10 + 12.00= $50.10 which is less than their budget so it might seem like they could. But using algebra they realized that it might not work because they would pay tax and tip based on the new total
They plugged in $42 for X. 50.75 ≥X (.2) + X (.07) + X
50.75 ≥ 42 (.2) + 42 (.07) + 42
50.75 ≥ 8.4 + 2.94 + 42
50.75 ≥ 53.34 is false
50.75 ≤ 53. 34 They could NOT buy the $12 appetizer!

Yeah thanks for that. I can also google and cut and paste an example of the practical application of algebra but I am running a business whilst supervising the DCs I don't have time to be setting those problems. Plus if many DCs can do that in their head without a pen and paper whilst "making memories" I'd be impressed.

I am clearly a lazy parent. But I'm struggling to see what the difference is between copying that sort of maths problem from the internet to verbally give to your child and letting them do half an hour on an online maths programme

I have played I-spy with children with dyslexia (not my own) and even if they don’t get it right or tell you the right letter they are still learning when you say ‘good try but kitchen begins with ‘k’ like kitten and kite. Let’s see if we can find anything else beginning with that sound’ or something similar. Learning happens all the time - you don’t need to be sat down with worksheets.
One of my children has struggled with handwriting as they are dyspraxic but they are happy to write lists of what they would like for their birthday/Christmas, foods they would like from the shop, their favourite footballers and improving handwriting doesn’t have to just mean teams of writing anyway. Drawing games will help with pen control and play dough, baking, playing with Lego etc all helps build muscles in the hands.
I’m pretty sure that setting my child a handwriting task each day would make writing even more of a chore.

MyDcAreMarvel because that's going to work for an 8 year old who can't do 2+3 in his head...

Anyway, in this household if they don't do the work, they don't get any screen time. No fights, no obligation, just the simple consequence. Maybe they won't do it one day, but they've never not done it two days in a row!

Haven't RTFT.

If your DC enjoy doing this, it's fine but if not, let them be children for 6 weeks. Yes, there is a lull and some catch-up after the summer hols but they soon get back in to the swing of things.

Am teacher and have been for over 20 years.

Porkflute imo games are only fun for kids if they work for them. In your example the back and forth nature of the game was not working! Ok if there is one occasional error that's no big deal but games need some chance of success!

Likewise when we play 20 questions I have to restrict football players and popstars as I have no hope. The fun is in pitching it as doable but difficult.

Well if you’re measuring success as the child immediately being able to differentiate sounds after playing a game once then it’s not successful. But exposing them to the correct sounds as many times as possible will help them progress.
I doubt a child struggling with phonic sounds would suddenly get it after being forced to complete one worksheet either.

Cloud tree obviously I wouldn’t copy that particular problem. It’s just an example .

I think we are talking at cross purposes.
We play the game as an an end in itself so it has to work as a game.

Cloudtree obviously I wouldn’t copy that particular problem. It’s just an example

Yes but that in itself illustrates the point that the usual "get them to read the ingredients on the back of a packet" only takes you so far and only works for teenies. As children get older it would be incredibly difficult to adequately consolidate their learning this way without spending a lot of time. I really don't think you should be calling people lazy parents for getting their children to do half an hour of homework in the holidays.

Lon term you will do more harm than good.Kids are good at sayin t they think their parents want to heAR

Lon term you will do more harm than good

Poppycock. Are you honestly saying that the OP is doing more harm than good by having her children write a journal through the holidays and do 15-20 minutes of maths. Precisely what harm is she doing?

Unless playing yahtzee and suduko counts not really.
They read regularly, write to pen friends and practice their instruments but no structured learning in the holidays.

Well obviously you give whatever assistance is required so they can have some success. Whether that’s giving them the first and second sound or selecting from a limited choice of objects or whatever so the game will work as a game.
Does anyone actually think that enforced extra homework is going to do anything other than make a struggling child hate learning more?

Does anyone actually think that enforced extra homework is going to do anything other than make a struggling child hate learning more?

And bore the non-struggling child stupid... When I was a teacher it was my feeling there were a lot of parents out there who wished they were teachers too. They were projecting something onto their kids, living vicariously through them not actually meeting the kids' needs (to have some down time, fun and, you know, do what research has shown and professionals have known for decades... that kids learn best through play).

If you have an urge to teach go and qualify and teach.

I have not the slightest urge to teach. I have the urge to ensure that my child who struggles to keep up at school anyway does not down tools for 8 weeks and then struggle to get going again in September.

Fundamentally it is my job as a parent to support my child and teaching them is part of that.

Does anyone actually think that enforced extra homework is going to do anything other than make a struggling child hate learning more?

Actually yes, I do. It has shown my son, that he can do the work whereas before he believed he couldn't.

Because he is in a situation where:
he is relaxed not near the child who bullies him and incites the rest of the class to tell him he is stupid
he can ask me to explain stuff to him again and again without the fear of ridicule
he is not afraid to try because he knows that there will be no-one commenting and laughing at his efforts
he is willing to work at something he dislikes because he wants the reward at the end of it

It's all very well saying incorporate maths into every day life, but they need to have the basics fixed in their heads before you can do that. They need to understand how to fill out worksheets, find the tricks to figure out what the worksheets are asking. And anyway, we don't put the cereal boxes on the table!