Email from school that I probably wasn't supposed to see - f**king livid!

[FidgetyFingers]

I requested a copy of DS2's (secondary) school record when he left there a few months ago. He has quite severe SN, NHS paediatrician diagnosed with his assessments taking place at this school.

Enclosed in the paperwork was an email from his form tutor, his form tutor for 4 years, to the inclusion manager, stating that I had been on the phone to her as I was very unhappy about detentions 'again' for minor transgressions in the scheme of things and 'that I expected special treatment for my son due to his 'SN'.

DS has severe learning difficulties with several other co morbid difficulties and never should have been in mainstream school anyway but there was no choice as I couldn't get him an EHCP.

I am so fucking angry as this proves they never took his SN seriously at all which they proved in the way they treated him!

I also found a copy of an email from said inclusion manager to all his teachers outlining DS's behaviour plan and stating that if he failed to get enough points, he would be excluded.

Same woman sat across from me in a meeting with the Board of Governors insisting that I must have been mistaken when I said that she'd told me this on the phone.

I am absolutely disgusted that such people exist and are in authority of vulnerable children .

AIBU?

Allington

I have no idea what the allegations were, why they were made, what people believed at the time, what reason they had to make a referral. None. Of course people tell lies sometimes. The idea of a conspiracy stretches credibility, but it is remotely possible. I can't comment on this particular situation, obviously.

Arthur yes I’ve acknowledged that the SEN budget might not cover the cost, it’s a notional budget and obviously some schools have more children with SEN than others. As I stated which is why it is very important to apply for EHCP’s and the funding it brings when necessary. So one kid with high or complex needs is not ‘hogging’ the budget.

Teachers should most definitely not be regarded as enemies. Neither should parents! They are valuable source of info! Far better when they can work in partnership and better results gained.

Far better for school to be honest and say we cannot meet needs, rather than plodding along trying to.

Clairetree you are being deliberately hostile and obtuse. Of course it takes only 30 seconds to give parents the names of charities such as IPSEA and SOSSEN. They literally only need the name. Parents are quite happy to do the googling once they have a name and will navigate the websites themselves. A good teacher would be very happy to point parents in the right direction. You can go over and above to help, you know, and many teachers I have encountered do.
However, from what you have said (about job offers arriving daily), I suspect you work for an agency and are not the sort of person that would go over and above for pupils.

pingu thank you

Yes, some listen and try to understand and negotiate what is and isn't possible.

Others just don't want to know - this is the way we do it and if you child doesn't fit the mold then we want to get rid of you.

I think the only answer is for parents to educate themselves. To advocate for their child. But not to see schools or teachers as the enemy

I agree. However not all parents can do this, for various reasons. Maybe they have learning disabilities themselves or simply cannot understand the minefield that is Educational Law etc, etc.

Which is why schools employ a SENCO, who should be able to advise parents and work in partnership with them.

It’s a joint problem, not one or the other to blame.

@Claw001
I apologise if I misunderstood.

I was just trying to point out that even with a very pro active, motivated school EHCP are difficult to come by and take time. During that time needs still have to be met and that cost comes from the SEN budget AND the school budget.

Then there are the students who are denied an EHCP but practically need a lot of support in school. Just that they are denied this by the LA. We have had parents unable or unwilling to participate in the application and appeals process and teh school did a lot of work on behalf of the parents. This is expensive, complex and time consuming for staff and arguably is not the correct use of their time. Disproportionately more time is spent on pupils with additional needs. That is in no way say they do not deserve this time but rather that the powers that be need to recognise that educational provision for pupils with SEN is more expensive than for those without SEN and needs appropriate funding and cannot be done on the cheap.

It takes 12 weeks - 10 weeks in the case of appeals against refusals to assess. Also LAs often end up conceding appeals when they realise parents are serious, especially when they are supported by schools, so they may be even quicker

10-12 weeks x 3 if you get a refusal to assess, refusal to issue then refusal to write a decent plan. That's an extra 8/9 months on top of the 20 weeks minimum (ha!) it takes anyway. A decent EHCP can potentially take well over a year to obtain.

Some LAs do concede quickly. Some do it at the last minute. There was a change made recently where LAs must concede by a certain point if doing so, as they are unnecessarily jamming up the tribunal system with cases they never intend to actually turn up and oppose.

Of course it takes only 30 seconds to give parents the names of charities such as IPSEA and SOSSEN. They literally only need the name

This is not about time. This is about me - a non-expert in SN - making a decision to go over the heads of my SENCO and Head to provide information to a parent designed to put them at odds with one another. People in my school with more knowledge than I have of SN would be rightly very annoyed if I started doing this.

It isn't a responsibility of my role, so I am perfectly at liberty to refrain from doing it.

I walked into DD's school expecting to be treated as a partner. Instead I was treated as the enemy, every suggestion I made rejected as unworkable, DD 'diagnosed' with all sorts of conditions they had no competence to diagnose, requests for assessments then ignore what the assessment says and wait a bit then want another assessment, attacks on my parenting to the point of making false allegations in one referral they made

Same here, Allington. I had a teacher take it upon himself to write to my child's paediatrician using the address on the report sent to school detailing DS' needs. He told them that I was fabricating DS symptoms, that DS wasn't having his needs met at home and being poorly parented (despite having never been to my home or had any contact with me/DH outside of parents evening), and that no SEN support was needed. Teacher tried to deny writing this letter even though there's a signed, handwritten copy of it in DS medical records on school letter headed paper.

you do realise I hope, how many charities in this sector blatantly contradict each other, the LA

Funny that the charities contradict the LA. I wonder why

And in that year schools are having to try and meet the needs of that student. That may mean that the meet those needs out of their budget and everything goes really well. Or it could mean that they refuse to meet any needs until the EHCP is in place and it ends up being disastrous for the student, their classmates and the teacher or that the school is in a desperate financial situation, recognises all of the adjustments that the student needs but simply cannot fund them so does the absolute best that they can by juggling staff and stretching resources as far as they can and it simply isn't enough. The student ends up doing something that leads to exclusion.

As with most things this system needs to be challenged. Unfortunately the people affected are often vulnerable or so exhausted just trying to manage day to day that they simply don't have the energy, or resources, to fight it. That is what the government relies on isn't it? The most vulnerable in society being unable to stand up for themselves. It is the same within health and social care too.

Arthur this is why it is important for schools to say they cannot meet needs, rather than plod along. It triggers the EHCP assessment. It would also give parents the choice of participating towards appeal process or having to move schools.

It would be very unlikely for LA to refuse a school who are saying we cannot meet needs, as this amounts to school saying child can no longer attend unless needs are meet.

Same here, Allington. I had a teacher take it upon himself to write to my child's paediatrician using the address on the report sent to school detailing DS' needs. He told them that I was fabricating DS symptoms, that DS wasn't having his needs met at home and being poorly parented (despite having never been to my home or had any contact with me/DH outside of parents evening), and that no SEN support was needed. Teacher tried to deny writing this letter even though there's a signed, handwritten copy of it in DS medical records on school letter headed paper.

@pengggwn don't you want to comment on this either?

*YouCantStopTheSignal
*
Same here, Allington. I had a teacher take it upon himself to write to my child's paediatrician using the address on the report sent to school detailing DS' needs. He told them that I was fabricating DS symptoms, that DS wasn't having his needs met at home and being poorly parented (despite having never been to my home or had any contact with me/DH outside of parents evening), and that no SEN support was needed. Teacher tried to deny writing this letter even though there's a signed, handwritten copy of it in DS medical records on school letter headed paper.

What a Sneaky fucker!! Shocking!! What did your paediatrician say to this?? Was they on schools side? I feel all the 'professionals' stick together tbh hope that wasn't the case in this instance.

Same here. Social worker questioned why these concerns had not been raised with her - either in the regular report a couple of months previously, or by contacting her if it was new. No answer, nor could they provide any information about when DD was supposed to have shown these symptoms.

There are many, many fantastic teachers who genuinely care about the children they teach. Sadly, not all.

Same here, Allington. I had a teacher take it upon himself to write to my child's paediatrician using the address on the report sent to school detailing DS' needs. He told them that I was fabricating DS symptoms, that DS wasn't having his needs met at home and being poorly parented (despite having never been to my home or had any contact with me/DH outside of parents evening), and that no SEN support was needed. Teacher tried to deny writing this letter even though there's a signed, handwritten copy of it in DS medical records on school letter headed paper.
Did you complain? What was the outcome? You say 'teacher', was this the SENCO? Did they actually say this in these terms or are you paraphrasing and putting your own understanding on it? Sorry - lots of questions - I'm gobsmacked!

@pengggwn and @ clairelight2

please come back and explain these teachers?

@Allington

How can any teachers here answer for the teachers that you are referring to?
With the nest will in the world, all we are hearing is one side of the story and completely out of context.

They are just trying to give you a teacher's perspective. They aren't making excuses but more trying to explain why the system doesn't always work - not because the people in it don't care but just because too much is being asked of them.

And the harsh truth is that although your child is absolutely your number 1 priority they may not be the top priority in school. That isn't meant to be harsh. It's just trying to explain the situation. It isn't working for anyone - not the students or the staff.

jimmy it’s quite common in the SN world! Some parents have a real nightmare!

I had a school SENCO object to my sons diagnosis. The same SENCO reported me to child protection. The social worker threatened me with illegal child protection proceedings. Lack of knowledge can be a dangerous thing!

I had to get a solicitor involved, cost me an absolute fortune.

@arthuritis because they have been so vocal in the OMG parents' are so unreasonable discourse on this thread.

They didn't question perhaps the parents who posted on this thread might have a point. That teachers and schools (SLT and SGB) can be prejudiced and hostile to children with SN.

Sorry, stray apostrophe...

Allington

Excuse me. Doing bedtime over here.

I am bewildered. What do you want me to say? Why do you believe I would have any comment to make at all on this?

@Allington

I think they are expressing their frustration, in the same way that you are expressing yours.

Both children (and their parents) and teachers are treated badly under this system. You are seeing it from your side and they from theirs.

I think as parents it's easy for us to think "This will only take a couple of minutes of the teacher's time so why can't they do it" whilst the teacher is thinking " I've got 10 e mails to answer, all asking for info. It's going to take me ages to find out what they want and then reply plus I've got marking to do and lesson planning tonight and I need to get home for daughter's birthday".

It's only since I've worked closely with teachers that I've been able to really see and appreciate their workload.

I truly understand that this doesn't help you as a parent. Maybe the teachers on here could give some advice as to the best way to navigate the system?

I am sure many parents would love advice about navigating the system.

But so many teachers have come on this thread to tell us we don't understand, it's not fair to expect them to do what is legally required, schools can't be expected to provide for our children.

Plus, when I point out my fundraising experience get sneered at because the school - complaining about lack of money - don't want to even meet and discuss it.

It shows that parents of children with SN are all too often seen as a problem for advocating for their children.

I know that pitting teachers against parents is not going to solve the problem but having had experience of two schools I can say that attitude is key to a good partnership.

Sadly at our school I have seen the unwillingness of staff to listen (actually walk away in the middle of my sentence - rude class teacher) and to be economical with truth (chop and change support hours and do something different on paper to Real Life, or use another child's EHCP full funded TA and deny that they are doing so - SENCO) and to send empty politician speak emails rather than address my concerns (looking at you head teacher).

The whole debarcle negatively affected me - felt like I was constantly on edge by end of year - on top of parenting child with SEN and filling gaps of his education. Sadly some schools (SLT are key in this) have a very ingrained attitude of us vs parents, I have found - to my dismay.