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Original poster

So he lied then

432 replies

Metoodear · 13/08/2018 15:23

We’re are the calls for Corbyn and the rest of the any semites to step down

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/08/13/jeremy-corbyn-admits-present-wreath-laid-munich-massacre-terrorists/

The silence speaks for it self

OP posts:
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15
SillySallySingsSongs · 14/08/2018 12:51

Lots of is have made our views on Boris very clear, yet you just can't bring yourself to criticise Jeremy in any way at all.

The fact the Corbyn is now expected to tweet something about an incident that happened in a foreign country over 40 years ago just shows how people move the goal posts.

The issue is whether he laid wreaths at the graves of their murderers!

The fact you are deflecting/chosing not to see it says volumes.

Do not minimise this.

GhostofFrankGrimes · 14/08/2018 12:57

As brexit shows disinformation and mistruths were highly effective. Sadly as a result we don’t live in a true democracy because a handful of people control the political narrative for their own gain. That is why disingenuous conversations and dismissals of injustice piss me off. They form part of the dishonest discourse. I want honest conversation about everything from anti semitism to hijabs but it’s drowned out by tabloid screaming and vested interests

Piddly2 · 14/08/2018 12:58

Trouble with Britain is we can't let go of the past to get on with the future.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 14/08/2018 12:58

Personally I don't think of "a comment about the murdered athletes" as an isolated thing; it seems to more more that people are looking for something - anything - to suggest that JC is capable of considering all parties to a disagreement, rather than just his preferred ones

And the evidence just isn't there, is it?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 14/08/2018 13:00
  • seems to be more ...
bananafish81 · 14/08/2018 13:00

I feel that whatever JC does will never be good enough for those that seek to make political capital out of it

Do you feel that what he has done to address anti semitism within the Labour party so far has been sufficient?

Do you believe that there has been bigotry within the Labour party - or is this all just 'smears by the MSM'?

I'm getting a strong whiff of 'Jews should stop making such a fuss'

Puzzledandpissedoff · 14/08/2018 13:04

I want honest conversation about everything from anti semitism to hijabs

Excellent; then perhaps you'll answer the many questions around how you feel about JC's handling of antisemitism within his party?

TornFromTheInside · 14/08/2018 13:05

The issue is whether he laid wreaths at the graves of their murderers!
Has that even been established yet - there seems to be conflicting opinion about whether he actually laid a wreath for them, or just that their graves were in the vacinity.

Also, the people in the graves were NOT the actual murders at Munich - they were linked to the same Black September organisation. This is akin to arguing the links between McGuinness / Adams and IRA activities. Plenty of people attended the funeral for McGuinness including a former US president.

It doesn't look great for Corbyn, no, but at the same time, people are conflating an awful lot.

UpOnTheDowns · 14/08/2018 13:09

As brexit shows disinformation and mistruths were highly effective. Sadly as a result we don’t live in a true democracy because a handful of people control the political narrative for their own gain. That is why disingenuous conversations and dismissals of injustice piss me off. They form part of the dishonest discourse. I want honest conversation about everything from anti semitism to hijabs but it’s drowned out by tabloid screaming and vested interests

Deflect, deflect, deflect, minimize, minimize, minimize. You're really good at this - is there a course or something one can go on to improve one's ability to avoid genuine self-reflection?

SillySallySingsSongs · 14/08/2018 13:09

I'm getting a strong whiff of 'Jews should stop making such a fuss'

Yep me too.

DaisyTwirl · 14/08/2018 13:15

The fact the Corbyn is now expected to tweet something about an incident that happened in a foreign country over 40 years ago just shows how people move the goal posts.

And yet the man himself felt it to be of vital importance that he lays a wreath in remembrance of the terrorists just a few years ago.

Why was it so important to him a few years ago, but not at all important just a few years later?

DaisyTwirl · 14/08/2018 13:18

Has that even been established yet - there seems to be conflicting opinion about whether he actually laid a wreath for them, or just that their graves were in the vacinity.

Yes it has.
The pictures are very clear, and his own account of it was very clear.

Until he suddenly got a selective memory.

Alltheprettyseahorses · 14/08/2018 13:19

the people in the graves were NOT the actual murders at Munich - they were linked to the same Black September organisation

Atef Bseiso, one of the Munich terrorists, is there.

DaisyTwirl · 14/08/2018 13:21

All the facts are there, for all to see.
But that is not good enough for the cult.

So he lied then
ImAIdoot · 14/08/2018 13:28

I find it disgusting that people criticize Jeremy Corbyn and ignore the price of eggs.

These people need to be challenged.

TornFromTheInside · 14/08/2018 13:29

And yet the man himself felt it to be of vital importance that he lays a wreath in remembrance of the terrorists just a few years ago.

That's just outright misleading.
IF he's to be believed, he wasn't laying wreaths specifically for them, in fact he claims not for them at all, but other victims of terrorism.
One of the men though was a PLO leader said to have been involved (but NOT one of the actual Munich terrorists).

You're making it sound like he was specifically honouring the terrorist of Munich, which I very much doubt it the case.

Fact is, we are not really sure at this point - but his post in the Morning Star at the time suggests he was including Atef Bseiso who was an intelligence officer in the PLO and close to Yasir Arafat. Bseiso was alleged to have been involved in Black September - but of course, you and I have no clue about that - propaganda is rife between Israel and Palestine.

I'm in favour of giving a man a fair trial. At the moment, the evidence I'm seeing isn't conclusive.
But, even if he absolutely DID intend to honour Atef Bseiso, is it such a crime? Not something I'd fancy doing, but isn't it as much a right of his as it was for Clinton to attend McGuinness' funeral?

I don't believe people expect Jews to just shut up - I think they want to understand what anti-semitic incidents are happening in the Labour Party, and how they relate to Corbyn, and his condemnation (or not) of them. I don't think people know what those specific incidents are.

Can somebody detail them?

Oakmaiden · 14/08/2018 13:34

The pictures are very clear

You keep saying this but I haven't actually seen anything other than a picture of him holding a wreath (no grave/memorial in view) and another picture of one of the memorials (no wreath in view). And I have looked.

And even if the wreath WAS laid there, it wasn't necessarily a deliberate act. In as much as, he may well not have known that one of the Black September perpetrators was buried there at that time. He may just have been told "These are people killed in Paris by Mossad" and not actually have had the chance, at a real live event, to go away and check that all the victims of that were Good Guys. And as one event out of the many many he must have attended over the past years, it is entirely possible he doesn't have a direct memory of what wreathes were laid where and for whom. It is entirely likely a good proportion of the memorialising wasn't even in English (although that is entirely a guess on my behalf and may well be wrong).

ImAIdoot · 14/08/2018 13:34

Also I'm disgusted at people posting a photo of him doing the Muslim Brotherhood symbol with his hands.

There's no evidence he specifically did that with both hands, we can't even see the other hand! Why won't people leave poor Jeremy alone?

TornFromTheInside · 14/08/2018 13:35

Atef Bseiso, one of the Munich terrorists, is there

The ACTUAL Munich terrorists were:

Khalid Jawad
Luttif Afif
Ahmed Chic Thaa
Afif Ahmed Hamid
Yusuf Nazzal
Adnan Al-Gashey
Jamal Al-Gashey
Mohammed Safady

Atef Bseiso was alleged to have been part of the organisation, but he was not one of the actual terrorists. None of us will ever really know how involved he was, or wasn't. This is Middle Eastern politics - a hotbed of propaganda, but let's assume he was. It's akin to being part of the IRA. We simply don't know if he was part of the planning, or just part of the same organisation.

Justanotherlurker · 14/08/2018 13:38

But, even if he absolutely DID intend to honour Atef Bseiso, is it such a crime?

Are you being wilfully obtuse?

A back bench MP, laying a wreath for murderers, you can not see even any remote issue?

sunshinesupermum · 14/08/2018 13:38

I'm getting a strong whiff of 'Jews should stop making such a fuss'

THIS and we know what happens when Jews don't make a fuss don't we? Some people survived despite 'not making a fuss'. Six million sadly didn't.

sunshinesupermum · 14/08/2018 13:39

poor Jeremy you're having a laugh aren't you?

ImAIdoot · 14/08/2018 13:41

If we could just all calm down on the right wing propaganda for a second, don't you people realise that if there is no evidence of Jeremy associating with members of a terrorist organisation that have been shot or imprisoned? The fact he is instead associating with the ones that remain alive and at large after an attack, in the act of commemorating their deaths, puts a clear distance between him and them.

It's only common sense really.

SillySallySingsSongs · 14/08/2018 13:42

I don't believe people expect Jews to just shut up

Well its certainly coming across that way.

More excuses after excuses. More of he can't be criticised. Would you come up with the same 'he didn't know what he was doing' etc lines if it was Boris?

I very much doubt it.

TornFromTheInside · 14/08/2018 13:45

What precisely is so bad about him making the Muslim brotherhood symbol? What do you believe it is signifying that is so deplorable?