To think schools shouldn't teach religion as absolute fact?

[PoesyCherish]

DSD is 6 and is learning about Christianity in school. They're teaching her Jesus is the Son of God rather than "some people believe he is". Everything about the religion is taught as fact. They've also failed to mention anything about any other religion.

AIBU to think they shouldn't be teaching it as absolute fact? How are children supposed to be understanding and tolerant of other people's beliefs if they're taught one world view as fact?

Walkingdeadfangirl

As far as I know, CofE is different because it is the 'state' religion. CofE schools have to accept all applicants, I think?

RafaIsTheKingOfClay

Well, I believe the state has a duty to provide appropriate educational environments for its children and to allow for parental choice. I believe there ought to be more schools, smaller classes, lots of other changes before faith schools come under my scrutiny.

Who owns the land and buildings of faith schools. If they were banned could the church just sell them off for millions. Or are they owned by the state and could just carry on as comprehensives in a MAT?

CofE schools have to accept all applicants, I think?

They can have criteria based on faith

Walkingdeadfangirl

I'm not sure, but if the Church owns them then of course they can sell them. I know Catholic schools receive considerable Church funding anyway, so there would be a shortfall there.

JacquesHammer

Oh right. I honestly didn't think so.

Pengggwn No CofE schools can discriminate as well, just some choose not to. Other religions could choose to be inclusive. They dont, I wonder why that is?

Walkingdeadfangirl

You wonder why? Really?

Faith schools shouldn't be allowed anyway, no matter what they teach.

I am a Catholic teacher in a Catholic Primary School and I teach RE as fact, because I believe it is. We also teach about other world religions, but obviously not to the same depth. I find it very strange indeed that you are shocked that Catholic RE takes priority in a Catholic school

I'm a non-catholic who teaches in a catholic school and I would teach as you suggest... because that reflects my belief. However, for some of my colleagues, their belief is so strong that it IS fact for them.. does that make sense?

I think if this is something you're uncomfortable with, you need to change schools. It's kinda part of the deal.

Given, in most cases, the people of the Catholic parishes paid for the land on which the buildings stand, and the buildings themselves, how do you expect our county councils to pay for the land and buildings when they turn all religious schools into secular schools?

Honestly, it’s a bit rich expecting the church to fork out for all that then telling the they can’t teach Catholicism.

The government has offered an alternative. Free schools. Apparently any man and his dog can set one up and promote whatever shite they want in them. Why not band together with your community and start one? No?

The government has offered an alternative. Free schools. Apparently any man and his dog can set one up and promote whatever shite they want in them. Why not band together with your community and start one? No?

I cannot know what people will be saying about the free school experiment in as little as ten years, but I imagine it to be something like: "We sent our children to be educated by people who had never run a school, didn't know anything about how schools worked and thought Ofsted was a cream for thrush. What the fuck is wrong with us?"

You wonder why? Really?
Well I always assumed it was because of privilege.

But I do wonder why the people who are genuinely religious allow it to go on? What happened to loving thy neighbour, and even reaching out to spread the word. Has religion always been so insular and corrupt?

Walkingdeadfangirl

Yes, I think it has 😂

But to be fair, there are non-Catholic children in Catholic schools, as demonstrated in the OP. It is fair enough for them to primarily serve their own religious community because they exist to provide a Catholic education. Where someone wants to send their child there without baptising them, it is fair enough for them to specify that the parents have to support the ethos of the school.

Apparently any man and his dog can set one up and promote whatever shite they want in them

I guess you dont know much about education then. Any man and his dog cannot open a free school, that is not how it works. And if you did open a school it would still be illegal to open a secular school, never mind an atheist, anti-theist, devil worshipping or even academically selective school.

YAVVDNBU.
My book recommendation for tonight (drum roll please) is Catherine Nix's "The Darkening Age", which, while a bit polemical, is a good summary of how Christianity (by extension, religion) has not been a good friend to science in the past. Other sources could confirm how much of a friend it has been to women in the past. Durkheim pointed out years ago how it can be a way of propping up social structures of otherwise dubious legitimacy or worth. I am very disturbed by how much influence religion has on education, and the increase in influence in society as a whole. I never heard anyone claim that the UK was a Christian country until relatively recently, as a quick example - in the 90's most of us would have said it was secular.
Faith schools began to increase under Tony Blair. There was a very deliberate increase in their involvement. For many of us there is no choice but to use them, as pp's have said. Thankfully, some of us were educated in religious schools at some point and have still turned into rampaging atheists , but one presumes that they expect some return on investment.

Has religion always been so insular and corrupt?

Of course it has, hence why we are in a situation of some religions being the ridicule of comedians worldwide for decades and Tommy Robinson recently being some kind of martyr

Oops, that should have been Catherine Nixey. Clearly not the best example of checking my sources www.amazon.co.uk/Darkening-Age-Christian-Destruction-Classical/dp/1509812326?tag=mumsnetforum-21

People A lot of voters want selection, but it seems unacceptable to say so. So we use 'faith' selection as an acceptable code for promoting/increasing it. Why cant people just be honest.

Don't answer I know why

I know Catholic schools receive considerable Church funding anyway, so there would be a shortfall there.

Do you have personal experience, because I think you’d be surprised how little they are paying. The last figure I can find is 5 years out of date and it’s likely to be much lower now given the number of VA schools that have converted into academies since then.

It's a Catholic school! YABVVVU.

Her parents were unreasonable to send her to a religious school. I wish we lived in a secular society but CofE is interwoven into our politics.

Not all schools have to follow the NC.

Rafals:

It was just my understanding. But having looked it up:

The school buildings and land of Catholic schools are owned by the Catholic Church. The Church provides these premises, at no charge, to enable the state to fulfil its obligation to provide education for the population. The day to day running costs of Catholic schools are funded by the state in the same way that all schools are funded (either through local authority or DfE funding agreements). The Church covers 10% of the capital costs for the maintenance of the premises.

So, although the cost of education is funded by the state, if the Catholic Church was disallowed from providing education, the government would have to build about 2,500 new schools.

Well surely it’s about time said land was taken off churches. Goes back to ancient hardly fair laws. Didn’t Henry 8th also then go on to taking church land off those he didn’t like to give to his mates. Some houses are built on previously owned church land which reserved the right to still ask for taxes if they so wish when they sold it. Still could if they wanted to.

The state shouldn’t be funding church schools, for many parents they literally have no choice and have to suck up church schools foisted on them. It’s an outdated system.

Our local primary is a CofE school.

Religion was taught as fact.

At one point DS believed in it all firmly and had 'the fear' and 'guilt', that is so familiar to me as a child educated in a convent.

At 11 he now does not believe. I'm not sure why. I too am an atheist but haven't shared my views with him as I didn't want to influence him either way.

The local primary spent hours and hours and hours teaching RE. After literacy and numeracy it was viewed as the most important subject.

Many of the children were from homes which practise different religions, or no religion at all. It all feels like a colossal waste of precious time to me. I appreciate that everyone has a right to their own belief, but to spend hours and hours teaching one set of beliefs to children who could sorely do with more physical education and guidance on the challenges of the modern world (technology, social media, mental health relationships).

My firm belief FWIW is that RE should be scaled down and lessons geared towards improving mental health and resilience should take their place.